OK, I have searched the board and this seems to be a unique problem.
Fortunately, it is not critical, so long as the wheel or the autopilot work. However, in the event that the pedestal steering fails, then being able to use the emergency tiller appears to require the removal of the destroyer wheel. It seems as if it should just pull off once you remove the nut, but it doesn't. There is a key, but that should only ensure that the shaft turns when the wheel is turned, and it does. So, am I into another corrosion problem, has the wheel become jammed on the shaft, or what? We have tried the usual corrosion removers and a wheel puller. Perhaps it it time to try something else? How about a nut with a flat washer to push the wheel further onto the shaft, perhaps realigning it, before trying to pull it off?
Suggestions are most welcome.
Ken
S/V Parfait
CD-36
parfait@nc.rr.com
Destroyer Wheel Removal
Moderator: Jim Walsh
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Chris Reinke
Re: Destroyer Wheel Removal
Ken - Are you sure the wheel needs to be removed? My emergency tiller is offset so the tiller handle points almost directly port while steering straight. I do not know if this is the original piece, but it does not require the wheel to be removed. In an emergency I would think getting the wheel off would be a bit cumbersome and time consuming.
Sorry to say, this does not resolve your issue of the wheel not coming off as it should.
Good Luck,
Chris
Sorry to say, this does not resolve your issue of the wheel not coming off as it should.
Good Luck,
Chris
Ken Coit wrote: OK, I have searched the board and this seems to be a unique problem.
Fortunately, it is not critical, so long as the wheel or the autopilot work. However, in the event that the pedestal steering fails, then being able to use the emergency tiller appears to require the removal of the destroyer wheel. It seems as if it should just pull off once you remove the nut, but it doesn't. There is a key, but that should only ensure that the shaft turns when the wheel is turned, and it does. So, am I into another corrosion problem, has the wheel become jammed on the shaft, or what? We have tried the usual corrosion removers and a wheel puller. Perhaps it it time to try something else? How about a nut with a flat washer to push the wheel further onto the shaft, perhaps realigning it, before trying to pull it off?
Suggestions are most welcome.
Ken
S/V Parfait
CD-36
-
Larry DeMers
Re: Destroyer Wheel Removal
I have an Edson station and destroyer wheel, so if this is what you have, then we are still on the same page.
I suspect that your wheels key has become distorted over time..mine was also. If the wheel was then forced back on over a distorted or incorrect length key, the whole shebang would jamb up. There may also be a corrosion problem to consider as you state.
Ok, solution ideas? First a large gear puller, applied with a sense of the power you are using and an eye on bending metal etc. Then I would add some well diffused heat to the whole hub, moving the torch tip constantly <important..do not stop moving it around..the finish may be damaged if the spot temp is too high>. Theoretically, the hub should expand a little, breaking the corrosions seal on the key (mine is steel I think..so it would be subject to corrosion..why not brass?). Lastly, think about an arrangement where you can simultaneously pull the wheel & shaft outwards as far as the split ring will allow,then use a small impact hammer. Deliver a sharp but short swing to the threaded shaft. You are expecting only 1/8 in. movement of the shaft..to the position of the split ring, so take it easy on the musculature excercise here..you will damage the rear race if you hit the shaft too hard.
Another thought..I rebuilt my edson station this past spring. New bearings, split rings, grease, brake pads etc. I seem to remember that the wheel shaft is pulled straight out of the housing after the split rings are removed, a drift pin has been pulled from the shaft, and the bearings have been removed. I suppose that the wheel could be left attached to the shaft, then the whole assembly removed.
But...surely your emergency tiller will fit around the wheel! If it does not, get it rewelded to make it fit. Mine is keyed to have the angled handle facing backwards. It is woefully short for any meaningful useage..needs to be extended 2 - 2 1/2 ft. BUT..I have used 2 docklines tied to the handle and then routed to the sheet winches. I don't know how well this would work in large seas and significant weatherhelm, but the rudimentary equipment is there.
Cheers!
Larry DeMers
s/v DeLaMer
Cape Dory 30
demers@sgi.com
I suspect that your wheels key has become distorted over time..mine was also. If the wheel was then forced back on over a distorted or incorrect length key, the whole shebang would jamb up. There may also be a corrosion problem to consider as you state.
Ok, solution ideas? First a large gear puller, applied with a sense of the power you are using and an eye on bending metal etc. Then I would add some well diffused heat to the whole hub, moving the torch tip constantly <important..do not stop moving it around..the finish may be damaged if the spot temp is too high>. Theoretically, the hub should expand a little, breaking the corrosions seal on the key (mine is steel I think..so it would be subject to corrosion..why not brass?). Lastly, think about an arrangement where you can simultaneously pull the wheel & shaft outwards as far as the split ring will allow,then use a small impact hammer. Deliver a sharp but short swing to the threaded shaft. You are expecting only 1/8 in. movement of the shaft..to the position of the split ring, so take it easy on the musculature excercise here..you will damage the rear race if you hit the shaft too hard.
Another thought..I rebuilt my edson station this past spring. New bearings, split rings, grease, brake pads etc. I seem to remember that the wheel shaft is pulled straight out of the housing after the split rings are removed, a drift pin has been pulled from the shaft, and the bearings have been removed. I suppose that the wheel could be left attached to the shaft, then the whole assembly removed.
But...surely your emergency tiller will fit around the wheel! If it does not, get it rewelded to make it fit. Mine is keyed to have the angled handle facing backwards. It is woefully short for any meaningful useage..needs to be extended 2 - 2 1/2 ft. BUT..I have used 2 docklines tied to the handle and then routed to the sheet winches. I don't know how well this would work in large seas and significant weatherhelm, but the rudimentary equipment is there.
Cheers!
Larry DeMers
s/v DeLaMer
Cape Dory 30
Ken Coit wrote: OK, I have searched the board and this seems to be a unique problem.
Fortunately, it is not critical, so long as the wheel or the autopilot work. However, in the event that the pedestal steering fails, then being able to use the emergency tiller appears to require the removal of the destroyer wheel. It seems as if it should just pull off once you remove the nut, but it doesn't. There is a key, but that should only ensure that the shaft turns when the wheel is turned, and it does. So, am I into another corrosion problem, has the wheel become jammed on the shaft, or what? We have tried the usual corrosion removers and a wheel puller. Perhaps it it time to try something else? How about a nut with a flat washer to push the wheel further onto the shaft, perhaps realigning it, before trying to pull it off?
Suggestions are most welcome.
Ken
S/V Parfait
CD-36
demers@sgi.com
-
Ken Coit
Re: Destroyer Wheel Removal
Larry & Chris,
Thanks for the ideas. I am pretty sure my emergency tiller faces forward when keyed properly, but I will check that again. Larry, from the Edson drawings, it certainly looks like the entire wheel and shaft assembly will slide out, so maybe we can make this a home project and not subject the bearings to anything too traumatic. As for wanting / needing to remove the wheel, even if the emergency tiller can function with the wheel in place, I would like to be able to remove the wheel, a 15 second job if things are right, so I can clear the cockpit while at anchor or in the slip. Of course, it is also more likely to grow legs if it comes off easily.
Anyone else have a bright idea?
Ken
parfait@nc.rr.com
Thanks for the ideas. I am pretty sure my emergency tiller faces forward when keyed properly, but I will check that again. Larry, from the Edson drawings, it certainly looks like the entire wheel and shaft assembly will slide out, so maybe we can make this a home project and not subject the bearings to anything too traumatic. As for wanting / needing to remove the wheel, even if the emergency tiller can function with the wheel in place, I would like to be able to remove the wheel, a 15 second job if things are right, so I can clear the cockpit while at anchor or in the slip. Of course, it is also more likely to grow legs if it comes off easily.
Anyone else have a bright idea?
Ken
Ken Coit wrote: OK, I have searched the board and this seems to be a unique problem.
Fortunately, it is not critical, so long as the wheel or the autopilot work. However, in the event that the pedestal steering fails, then being able to use the emergency tiller appears to require the removal of the destroyer wheel. It seems as if it should just pull off once you remove the nut, but it doesn't. There is a key, but that should only ensure that the shaft turns when the wheel is turned, and it does. So, am I into another corrosion problem, has the wheel become jammed on the shaft, or what? We have tried the usual corrosion removers and a wheel puller. Perhaps it it time to try something else? How about a nut with a flat washer to push the wheel further onto the shaft, perhaps realigning it, before trying to pull it off?
Suggestions are most welcome.
Ken
S/V Parfait
CD-36
parfait@nc.rr.com
-
Larry DeMers
Re: Destroyer Wheel Removal
Ken,
You are right of course..if that wheels hub wasn't being stubborn, the wheel would pop off too easily!
On our boat, the wheels nut is always unscrewing. There is a chrome plated, brass knob available that has been priced up there with diamonds or caviar, but will cure the unscrewing problem..it is advertised anyway.
..and there is a device that attaches to your railing, that will allow you to slide the wheel on to the device and store the wheel off to the side when you want to have an unencumbered cockpit. Edson does both of these devices.
Have fun!
Larry DeMers
s/v DeLaMer
Cape Dory 30
demers@sgi.com
You are right of course..if that wheels hub wasn't being stubborn, the wheel would pop off too easily!
On our boat, the wheels nut is always unscrewing. There is a chrome plated, brass knob available that has been priced up there with diamonds or caviar, but will cure the unscrewing problem..it is advertised anyway.
..and there is a device that attaches to your railing, that will allow you to slide the wheel on to the device and store the wheel off to the side when you want to have an unencumbered cockpit. Edson does both of these devices.
Have fun!
Larry DeMers
s/v DeLaMer
Cape Dory 30
Chris Reinke wrote: Ken - Are you sure the wheel needs to be removed? My emergency tiller is offset so the tiller handle points almost directly port while steering straight. I do not know if this is the original piece, but it does not require the wheel to be removed. In an emergency I would think getting the wheel off would be a bit cumbersome and time consuming.
Sorry to say, this does not resolve your issue of the wheel not coming off as it should.
Good Luck,
Chris
Ken Coit wrote: OK, I have searched the board and this seems to be a unique problem.
Fortunately, it is not critical, so long as the wheel or the autopilot work. However, in the event that the pedestal steering fails, then being able to use the emergency tiller appears to require the removal of the destroyer wheel. It seems as if it should just pull off once you remove the nut, but it doesn't. There is a key, but that should only ensure that the shaft turns when the wheel is turned, and it does. So, am I into another corrosion problem, has the wheel become jammed on the shaft, or what? We have tried the usual corrosion removers and a wheel puller. Perhaps it it time to try something else? How about a nut with a flat washer to push the wheel further onto the shaft, perhaps realigning it, before trying to pull it off?
Suggestions are most welcome.
Ken
S/V Parfait
CD-36
demers@sgi.com
-
Patrick Turner
Re: Destroyer Wheel Removal
Ken,
I had this exact problem on my CD30. I wanted to remove the destroyer wheel in order to install an autopilot wheel on the inside (forward facing) of the steering wheel. Mine was about as "stuck" as stuck can be. I tried wheel pullers, heating the nut, an assortment of corrosion eaters and finally ended up pulling the whole wheel assembly out and taking it to a small local auto shop that had a hydraulic compression "thing". I don't actually know what they are called but they are used to press in compression pins and an assortment of other things. The machanic was able to place the assembly in a vice with the assembly shaft hanging down below and the threaded end up. He then just "pressed" the whoe shaft right out of the wheel. After that I made sure the shaft was greased up and it slide right on. This process also gets you very familiar with how the whole steering thing works. You might consider a brake rebuild at the same time if you think you might need it, since you have the thing pulled apart anyway.
Hope this helps.
Pat
patrick.t@home.com
I had this exact problem on my CD30. I wanted to remove the destroyer wheel in order to install an autopilot wheel on the inside (forward facing) of the steering wheel. Mine was about as "stuck" as stuck can be. I tried wheel pullers, heating the nut, an assortment of corrosion eaters and finally ended up pulling the whole wheel assembly out and taking it to a small local auto shop that had a hydraulic compression "thing". I don't actually know what they are called but they are used to press in compression pins and an assortment of other things. The machanic was able to place the assembly in a vice with the assembly shaft hanging down below and the threaded end up. He then just "pressed" the whoe shaft right out of the wheel. After that I made sure the shaft was greased up and it slide right on. This process also gets you very familiar with how the whole steering thing works. You might consider a brake rebuild at the same time if you think you might need it, since you have the thing pulled apart anyway.
Hope this helps.
Pat
patrick.t@home.com
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Ken Coit
Re: Destroyer Wheel Removal
Pat,
Thanks for the war story. I think they are called hydraulic presses. I have been in there to redo the compass housing and it looks like I am about to go again. Maybe not before we give up for the rest of the hurricane season or the winter, whichever comes first. Getting to it will be much easier since I have already fought the battle with the bolts holding the housing onto the pedestal and won. That took drilling out some of the stainless bolts, and retapping the pedestal before we were out of the woods.
Thanks and happy sailing,
Ken
parfait@nc.rr.com
Thanks for the war story. I think they are called hydraulic presses. I have been in there to redo the compass housing and it looks like I am about to go again. Maybe not before we give up for the rest of the hurricane season or the winter, whichever comes first. Getting to it will be much easier since I have already fought the battle with the bolts holding the housing onto the pedestal and won. That took drilling out some of the stainless bolts, and retapping the pedestal before we were out of the woods.
Thanks and happy sailing,
Ken
parfait@nc.rr.com