I'm the proud new owner of a 1987 CD36 Cutter. This is my first experience with sailing a Cutter rig and I'm looking for some insight into the possible sail combinations available on differn't points of sail.
My sail inventory consists of a fully battened main, yankee, staysail, storm jib and a 130% Genoa. The Yankee is being repaired so I haven't flown it yet nor the storm jib. Also, the inner forestay is removable allowing me to sail the boat as a sloop if I want to.
My observations so far are that the staysail is effective with the 130 from a close reach to a beam reach but below that it only serves to blanket the 130. Also, the boat will point higher without the staysail. In triming the staysail I've been using the staysail sheet to set the luff in accordance with it's telltails and the outhaul to avoid backwinding the main. Is this approach right?
When tacking the 130 it is difficult to get past the inner forestay. So far the best approach seems to be to let the jib backwind and blow thru the slot between the 2 forestays. This approach works but you won't short tack up an narrow passages using it. Consequently, I'm considering removing the inner forestay when I anticipate a lot upwind work and sailing the boat as a sloop. Any other suggestions?
Will it be an differn't with the Yankee? I expect that it's higher cut than the 130 and might be easier to tack and less subject to blanketing off the wind. Is this true?
Is a cruising spinnaker a worthwhile addition to the sail inventory?
On a broad reach in 15 - 20 knots of wind using the main and 130 the boat is faster than I expected. I'm consistenly getting 7-71/2 knots through the water. Ten knots of wind and under is a differn't story. What's your experience?
Finally, the standard main sheet setup seems to have an awful lot of friction that make sheeting in a long and difficult process. Is this normal and what if any changes have you made?
Make no mistake.....I LOVE THIS BOAT as is but would appreciate any observations or suggestions that will improve me or her.
Mike Thorpe
CD36 Journey's End
mthorpe@capecod.net
Sailing a CD36 Cutter
Moderator: Jim Walsh
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Murray Glue
Re: Sailing a CD36 Cutter
Mike,
We own and love a CD30, here in NZ. She has the cutter rig, and much of what you say rings true for the 30 also.
The genoa ( your 130 ) is a problem to use for short tacking so we prefer to use the yankee, which is, as you say, high cut, and slips nicely through the slot. Because we sail short handed, or with two young children working the foredeck, we leave the cutter rig intact so that the sail changes can be made with the staysail up to keep some headway, steerage, and to provide shelter. The ability to work the headsail while not having to heave to is the biggest advantage of the rig over our previous sloop rigged boats.
Dayspring has an assymetrical cruising chute which fulfils all our desires for a big off-the-wind sail, and we have even used it hauled right in to sail upwind, in light airs.
One day, our dream is to own a CD36, but we would like to see one in the flesh first to be sure.
I have recently helped a couple of people get NZ made sails for Cape Dorys. Let me know if you want the contact email address for quotes for any replacements you might need.
We have just sailed Dayspring out into Tasman Bay for 5 days, in mid winter, and had a marvellous time. Thank goodness she has a heater !!
Murray Glue
CD30 107 Dayspring
Nelson
New Zealand
106452.2173@compuserve.com
We own and love a CD30, here in NZ. She has the cutter rig, and much of what you say rings true for the 30 also.
The genoa ( your 130 ) is a problem to use for short tacking so we prefer to use the yankee, which is, as you say, high cut, and slips nicely through the slot. Because we sail short handed, or with two young children working the foredeck, we leave the cutter rig intact so that the sail changes can be made with the staysail up to keep some headway, steerage, and to provide shelter. The ability to work the headsail while not having to heave to is the biggest advantage of the rig over our previous sloop rigged boats.
Dayspring has an assymetrical cruising chute which fulfils all our desires for a big off-the-wind sail, and we have even used it hauled right in to sail upwind, in light airs.
One day, our dream is to own a CD36, but we would like to see one in the flesh first to be sure.
I have recently helped a couple of people get NZ made sails for Cape Dorys. Let me know if you want the contact email address for quotes for any replacements you might need.
We have just sailed Dayspring out into Tasman Bay for 5 days, in mid winter, and had a marvellous time. Thank goodness she has a heater !!
Murray Glue
CD30 107 Dayspring
Nelson
New Zealand
106452.2173@compuserve.com
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matt cawthorne
Re: Sailing a CD36 Cutter
Mike,
Congratulations! It is a great boat.
Matt
matthew.cawthorne@phl.boeing.com
Congratulations! It is a great boat.
You will find that the boat sails well with the staysail and a smaller yankee (perhaps 110 to 115%). With that combo the boat points as high with the staysail as without.Mike Thorpe wrote: the staysail is effective with the 130 from a close reach to a beam reach but below that it only serves to blanket the 130.
If you use the yankee and staysail always leave the staysail up when going to windward. It helps move the yankee through the slot for reasonably quick tacks. I think that if you are going to use the genoa you might want to detach the inner forestay.Mike Thorpe wrote: When tacking the 130 it is difficult to get past the inner forestay.
If you have a little wind leave the staysail up and don't use the genoa. Leave the sails a little full and the boat will move along nicely. With all self tending sails I tack up narrow creeks that I would never attempt with a normal sloop rig.Mike Thorpe wrote: This approach works but you won't short tack up an narrow passages using it. Consequently, I'm considering removing the inner forestay when I anticipate a lot upwind work and sailing the boat as a sloop.
Off the wind the yankee will blanket as well. Whenever I go down wind the staysail comes down.Mike Thorpe wrote: Will it be an differn't with the Yankee? I expect that it's higher cut than the 130 and might be easier to tack and less subject to blanketing off the wind. Is this true?
I have had my boat up to 9.3 one time, but it was completely out of control and could not be sustained. 8 can occasionally be had, but not often. When you get more experience with the boat you will learn to make it go fast in lighter wind. This weekend I was making 6.5 knots close hauled in 10 knots of apparent wind. You can do the math, but the true wind probably was less than 7 knots. Just think of what the boat might do with sails that are less than 18 years old. My friends with much lighter boats, new sails, feathering props are constantly amazed at how fast the CD-36 goes with her fixed 3 bladed prop and old sails.Mike Thorpe wrote: On a broad reach in 15 - 20 knots of wind using the main and 130 the boat is faster than I expected. I'm consistenly getting 7-71/2 knots through the water. Ten knots of wind and under is a differn't story. What's your experience?
If you hate sheeting this one in try sailing a Nonsuch 36. The cat rig has some really nice advantages, but sheeting the main in seems like an all day event. Try lubricating the pulleys. Also my boat has turning blocks for the headsail that get very stiff and even lock up if not greased every year or so. Roller or ball bearing turning blocks would make tacking much easier.Mike Thorpe wrote: Finally, the standard main sheet setup seems to have an awful lot of friction that make sheeting in a long and difficult process. Is this normal and what if any changes have you made?
That is not likely to change.Mike Thorpe wrote: Make no mistake.....I LOVE THIS BOAT
Matt
matthew.cawthorne@phl.boeing.com
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Jerry Axler
Re: Sailing a CD36 Cutter
I don't have a genoa for my 36, but my experience is that it is not necessary when sailing on the wind. By using my telltails, both on the yankee and staysail, I am able to get super performance in all airs. Give me 8 to 10 knots of true wind and I'm getting close to the theoretical hull speed. Off the wind is another story. Just when you need all the sail area you can get, you must haul down the staysail because of blanketing. My secret weapon is the asymetrical cruising chute with a snuffer. Iuseit up to 15 knots apparent and at that point the yankee has sufficient sail area for a downwind run. Also the chute starts to become unmanagable at this point. If I am shorthanded, I will use the yankee with a whisker pole. It helps ,but it isn't anywhere near as efficient as the chute.Mike Thorpe wrote: I'm the proud new owner of a 1987 CD36 Cutter. This is my first experience with sailing a Cutter rig and I'm looking for some insight into the possible sail combinations available on differn't points of sail.
My sail inventory consists of a fully battened main, yankee, staysail, storm jib and a 130% Genoa. The Yankee is being repaired so I haven't flown it yet nor the storm jib. Also, the inner forestay is removable allowing me to sail the boat as a sloop if I want to.
My observations so far are that the staysail is effective with the 130 from a close reach to a beam reach but below that it only serves to blanket the 130. Also, the boat will point higher without the staysail. In triming the staysail I've been using the staysail sheet to set the luff in accordance with it's telltails and the outhaul to avoid backwinding the main. Is this approach right?
When tacking the 130 it is difficult to get past the inner forestay. So far the best approach seems to be to let the jib backwind and blow thru the slot between the 2 forestays. This approach works but you won't short tack up an narrow passages using it. Consequently, I'm considering removing the inner forestay when I anticipate a lot upwind work and sailing the boat as a sloop. Any other suggestions?
Will it be an differn't with the Yankee? I expect that it's higher cut than the 130 and might be easier to tack and less subject to blanketing off the wind. Is this true?
Is a cruising spinnaker a worthwhile addition to the sail inventory?
On a broad reach in 15 - 20 knots of wind using the main and 130 the boat is faster than I expected. I'm consistenly getting 7-71/2 knots through the water. Ten knots of wind and under is a differn't story. What's your experience?
Finally, the standard main sheet setup seems to have an awful lot of friction that make sheeting in a long and difficult process. Is this normal and what if any changes have you made?
Make no mistake.....I LOVE THIS BOAT as is but would appreciate any observations or suggestions that will improve me or her.
Mike Thorpe
CD36 Journey's End
cutter36@erols.com
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Mike Thorpe
Re: Sailing a CD36 Cutter
Matt,matt cawthorne wrote: I have had my boat up to 9.3 one time, but it was completely out of control and could not be sustained. 8 can occasionally be had, but not often.
When you say out of control do you mean from the weather helm and the boats desire to round up? How much wind did you have at the time?
Mike
mthorpe@capecod.net
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Matt
Re: Sailing a CD36 Cutter
I do not remember the exact wind but it was gusty and blowing pretty hard. The boat was new to me and I was trying to keep up with friends on a Bristol 40. We were on a broad reach and I had the large yankee and main up. The sails were little more than large drag devices as we were flying down wind. When a wave would roll us the boat would start to round up. The sails would then come into trim and the rolling and weather helm would increase and overpower the rudder until the sails started to luff. It was a great example of inexperience. Eventually I wised up and reduced sail.
I forgot to mention in the previous post that I tend to reef the main early these days. In order to minimize the carpel tunnel problems and make the sailing more enjoyable for the crew I will have both reefs in at 12 knots apparent. The sacrafice in speed is only one or two tenths of a knot, but the loads in the wheel are low and long sailing days are much more enjoyable.
Another down wind technique that I use when on a broad reach in light air is to pole out the clew of the yankee to a position that is very far forward and outboard enough that the sail has a shape similar to when on a beat, but is oriented so that it is nearly athwartships. This makes the sail act like a wing instead of a drag device and you can get a noticable amount of extra speed. You can sail by the telltales when configured like this. This technique is outlawed in sailboat racing. The big downside to this process is that having a pole up limits your maneuverability. The best way to set it up is with a topping lift and fore and after-guys. The sheet is all that goes through the end of the pole. That way if you have a traffic or MOB situation you can just furl up the yankee and turn immediately. Rigging the pole with the fore and after guys and the topping lift is very time consuming though. Good if you have an experienced crew.
Have fun with your new boat.
Matt
mcawthor@bellatlantic.net
I forgot to mention in the previous post that I tend to reef the main early these days. In order to minimize the carpel tunnel problems and make the sailing more enjoyable for the crew I will have both reefs in at 12 knots apparent. The sacrafice in speed is only one or two tenths of a knot, but the loads in the wheel are low and long sailing days are much more enjoyable.
Another down wind technique that I use when on a broad reach in light air is to pole out the clew of the yankee to a position that is very far forward and outboard enough that the sail has a shape similar to when on a beat, but is oriented so that it is nearly athwartships. This makes the sail act like a wing instead of a drag device and you can get a noticable amount of extra speed. You can sail by the telltales when configured like this. This technique is outlawed in sailboat racing. The big downside to this process is that having a pole up limits your maneuverability. The best way to set it up is with a topping lift and fore and after-guys. The sheet is all that goes through the end of the pole. That way if you have a traffic or MOB situation you can just furl up the yankee and turn immediately. Rigging the pole with the fore and after guys and the topping lift is very time consuming though. Good if you have an experienced crew.
Have fun with your new boat.
Matt
mcawthor@bellatlantic.net