In going through the excercise of replacing my genoa for later this season, thwe topic of "why don't you use a bi radial laminate spectra?" was brought forth by the sailmaker, the firm which will remain anonymous. The issue in my mind is that the price differential is $300 which , if the technology warrants, I would pay. However, being unfamiliar with sail technology as such I am looking for someone to give me an unbiased appraisal of the pros and cons between the traditional dacron cross-cut vs the newer laminate technology. Viewed from the Cape Dory 25 skipper's perspective.
Thanks in advance.
Don Carr
carrd48@netzero.net
Dacron vs Laminate for cruising
Moderator: Jim Walsh
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Dana
Re: Dacron vs Laminate for cruising
Really depends on the sailmaker....some will only state you will be happy with the sail for 3-5 years for the laminate. Personally, I have had a Hood mylar/dacron laminar 130% furling sail on a Hood LD810 furling system (CD26) since 1986. There has been no problems with the Hood laminar. I have had to replace the foam luff insert and some minor stiching as can be expected. It was designed as a reefable sail (with the LD810 hence the foam luff to take up any baginess in the center of the partially reefed sail). It also has heavier material layers at the foot and leech..becoming thiner toward the center of the sail. Thus when you furl reef, you are generally using the heaviest part of the sail. Guessing the age of the sail, other sailmakers have commented that it looks good for a 4-5 year old sail. They are surprised that laminar is lasting this long...their expectations of their sail design life is a lot less. There is very little sail stretch and they contribute the life and condition of the sail to "overly built design". Performance of the sail is excellent in all wind conditions....
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darenius@aol.com
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Don Carr wrote: In going through the excercise of replacing my genoa for later this season, thwe topic of "why don't you use a bi radial laminate spectra?" was brought forth by the sailmaker, the firm which will remain anonymous. The issue in my mind is that the price differential is $300 which , if the technology warrants, I would pay. However, being unfamiliar with sail technology as such I am looking for someone to give me an unbiased appraisal of the pros and cons between the traditional dacron cross-cut vs the newer laminate technology. Viewed from the Cape Dory 25 skipper's perspective.
Thanks in advance.
Don Carr
darenius@aol.com
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brent musolf
Re: Dacron vs Laminate for cruising
Don,
this depends on which ccompany the loft is using for their cloth. Dimension makes soom really cool cruising laminates that are great and very fast as well as durable. These cloths are mylar and spec or kevlar and then backed by a very durable laminate. The costs are with in a dollar per yard of good dacron. the advantages are that you get a light and strong sail with very little stretch and and the durability of dacron. My next boat will have this cloth on board.
If you have any question or need cloth prices so you can negotiate better give me a call at work. (734)676-6004
Dr. Brent Musolf
P.S. I am not a sailmaker or distributor. I used to do canvas work and sail repair when I was in school and my internship so I had accounts with all the major sail cloth manufactures. Still have some samples and about 20 yards of KX-18 laying around the house.
docmusolf@wnol.net
this depends on which ccompany the loft is using for their cloth. Dimension makes soom really cool cruising laminates that are great and very fast as well as durable. These cloths are mylar and spec or kevlar and then backed by a very durable laminate. The costs are with in a dollar per yard of good dacron. the advantages are that you get a light and strong sail with very little stretch and and the durability of dacron. My next boat will have this cloth on board.
If you have any question or need cloth prices so you can negotiate better give me a call at work. (734)676-6004
Dr. Brent Musolf
P.S. I am not a sailmaker or distributor. I used to do canvas work and sail repair when I was in school and my internship so I had accounts with all the major sail cloth manufactures. Still have some samples and about 20 yards of KX-18 laying around the house.
docmusolf@wnol.net
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Matt Cawthorne
Re: Dacron vs Laminate for cruising
Don,
The choice of sail material is a very personal one and I suspect that you will get many different opinions about it.
The cost may ultimately be more than the $300. The longevity of traditional crosscut dacron sails is well proven. Racers love the laminates because they offer better stiffness and therefore better sail shape at a lighter weight. The drawback is that the laminates have traditionally not lasted nearly as long as dacron. Sailmakers tend to claim that their latest laminate will last a long time. They may be right, but until a sufficient number of years passes you will not know for certain. By that time they will have switched to a new material.
Another issue if you buy dacron sails is whether or not to use a resin. Resin coated sails have a better shape initially, but I am told that sails made from unfilled material tend to last longer. The sails on the Patricia Louise are of the unfilled variety. They are 17 or 18 years old. I am in the process of re-stiching the yankee now. The main is tired and may only last a few more years. While re-stiching I put the REMAINS of a relatively new sail on the cement floor to prevent my dacron sails from getting chafed. The remains are of a main sail made of a Kevlar laminate that was given to me by a friend. He has given up on the laminate sails due to their short life and gone back to his old dacron sail.
If I win the lottery new sails will happen every 5 years, but for now dacron is the choice for me.
Matt
mcawthor@bellatlantic.net
The choice of sail material is a very personal one and I suspect that you will get many different opinions about it.
The cost may ultimately be more than the $300. The longevity of traditional crosscut dacron sails is well proven. Racers love the laminates because they offer better stiffness and therefore better sail shape at a lighter weight. The drawback is that the laminates have traditionally not lasted nearly as long as dacron. Sailmakers tend to claim that their latest laminate will last a long time. They may be right, but until a sufficient number of years passes you will not know for certain. By that time they will have switched to a new material.
Another issue if you buy dacron sails is whether or not to use a resin. Resin coated sails have a better shape initially, but I am told that sails made from unfilled material tend to last longer. The sails on the Patricia Louise are of the unfilled variety. They are 17 or 18 years old. I am in the process of re-stiching the yankee now. The main is tired and may only last a few more years. While re-stiching I put the REMAINS of a relatively new sail on the cement floor to prevent my dacron sails from getting chafed. The remains are of a main sail made of a Kevlar laminate that was given to me by a friend. He has given up on the laminate sails due to their short life and gone back to his old dacron sail.
If I win the lottery new sails will happen every 5 years, but for now dacron is the choice for me.
Matt
Don Carr wrote: In going through the excercise of replacing my genoa for later this season, thwe topic of "why don't you use a bi radial laminate spectra?" was brought forth by the sailmaker, the firm which will remain anonymous. The issue in my mind is that the price differential is $300 which , if the technology warrants, I would pay. However, being unfamiliar with sail technology as such I am looking for someone to give me an unbiased appraisal of the pros and cons between the traditional dacron cross-cut vs the newer laminate technology. Viewed from the Cape Dory 25 skipper's perspective.
Thanks in advance.
Don Carr
mcawthor@bellatlantic.net