Question on electronics from newcomer

[tom ricks]

I've just bought a Typhoon. I plan to sail mainly in Penobscot Bay, where the tidal variation is about 12 feet.

So I'd like some advice on electronics. Would a handheld depth finder be useful?

Also, any recommendations for handheld GPS (specifically, is there one that is better with nautical charts)?

And while I am at it, any recommendations on radios?

Thanks,
Tom

[Carl Thunberg]

First, congratulations on the purchase of a great boat, and welcome to the Board!

I've been very happy with my Garmin GPSMap 76CX with the Southern Maine blue-chart micro-SD card. The Southern Maine blue-chart covers all of Penobscot Bay and Mount Desert, up to roughly Schoodic Point, and south to the Merrimack River, Massachusetts. The CX model is in color, which is a real benefit. Send me an e-mail. I'd be happy to lend you mine, so you could "try before you buy".

For a Typhoon, I would think a hand-held radio would be about all you need. I have absolutely no first-hand experience with hand-held depth finders. Penobscot Bay is pretty well marked, though. Even if you had one, how often would you actually use it?

[Neil Gordon]

Carl,

"Depth" is a navigation tool, which is why charts show depths that are way deeper than even the largest vessels might need to worry about.

Paper chart, compass and a means of measuring depth can get you home, no batteries required.

[Carl Thunberg]

I guess my point, which I didn't elaborate on, is that with the freeboard of a Typhoon under way, putting a handheld depth finder in the water can put you in jeopardy of falling overboard. I just think there's some practical limitations to their use under way, especially if you're single-handing.

[Neil Gordon]

I guess my point, which I didn't elaborate on, is that with the freeboard of a Typhoon under way, putting a handheld depth finder in the water can put you in jeopardy of falling overboard. I just think there's some practical limitations to their use under way, especially if you're single-handing.

It matters if you're alone or have crew, I suppose.

[Steve Laume]

You can buy a built in, permanently mounted, digital, depth sounder for about 100 bucks. The display is only 2" in dia. and is easy to read with alarms, if you want the annoyance. You can epoxy the puck on the inside of the hull and you are ready to go. They are very low on power consumption so you could hook it up to a small deep cycle battery you could haul home to charge. You could also run LED running lights and have a socket to charge a hand held radio. If you wanted to expand on the system you could also add a small solar panel.

If all you wanted the depth sounder for was to figure out how much scope to put out the handheld might be okay. For general use I would want the option of a constant display, Steve.

[Chris Reinke]

Tom - The handheld GPS that Carl recommends is a fine option.

For the handheld radio I have a iCOM which I really like due to extended battery life. I would only recommend the waterproof models since reliability during the worst conditions is what you really want. They offer M-88 ($250) and M-72 which both have 19-20 hours of use. The M-88 is very compact and offers up to 5 watts of transmit power (5/3/1 selectable power output). The M-72 ($200) is a bit larger but offers up to 6 watts of transmit power (6/3/1 selectable power output) which may be a consideration depending on your cruising.

[Terry]

Hi,
I, too, have the Garmin, the 76CSx model, which has a compass in addition to GPS. I'm not that thrilled with the compass part for marine use, however, but do use it hunting with a topo map loaded. It's a good unit.

Steve has a good point about a small, mounted, depth finder. Also about putting in a solar panel. The prices are fairly reasonable for a small panel that will recharge a marine battery very nicely, if it's used for running lights and minimal electronics. A DC power socket would allow running a GPS and a radio from it, too.

My panel is only 300 watts or so and is pretty old, but seems to work well. I only have one small battery, and routinely use a cabin fan and radio when working on the boat, and have yet to see the voltage drop below 12vdc.

BTW: When I installed a new depth finder on Cassandra, I worried over the process quite a bit. In the end it wasn't too bad. I molded a blotch of marine epoxy putty to the hull beneath where the head sits. Once dry and hard, I flattened and leveled the top of the mound with a rasp, then sanded it smooth. I checked it out with petroleum jelly to see if it would work. It did, so I epoxied the transponder in place. It works very well.

Enjoy your CD!

Regards, Terry

[SurryMark]

Hand-held depth sounder? Besides knowing depth as a guide to navigation, the times that you really want a depth sounder usually are the times you want both hands and all of your concentration.

Penobscot Bay is great sailing, with tucked-away places and a taste of ocean rollers.

[Paul D.]

I will third the Garmin GPS76 unit. I have a 10 year old model that has proved reliable.

My Typhoon had a compass and that was all. My brother had a Typhoon to which he added a Standard Horizon multi - depth and speed unit he was happy with - simple install and one mounting keeping the cockpit clean. May be more than you need though unless you want it for navigation. I see a hand held depth finder as a back up but on a Ty it would be great for gunkholing if you just can't deal with a led line.

I have sailed along a charted depth line in fog more than once and see the depth sounder as the most important instrument other than the compass. This is a good thing as presently it is the only built in electronic instrument aboard Femme that works! (And it has tin foil and duct tape inside shorting out the alarm.) Yep, the 30 year old Signet wind and speed instruments finally croaked and the old Benmar autopilot is another story.

[tartansailor]

Carl,



Paper chart, compass and a means of measuring depth can get you home, no batteries required.

X2

[M. R. Bober]

Carl,

"Depth" is a navigation tool, which is why charts show depths that are way deeper than even the largest vessels might need to worry about.

Paper chart, compass and a means of measuring depth can get you home, no batteries required.

Neil,
You are such a Spartan. Do you serve hardtack when you have guests aboard?

I would go with a permanently mounted depth sounder as a minimum. A hand held VHF is better than nothing, but range and battery life are real concerns. GPS/chartplotter are useful.

Mitchell Bober
Sunny Lancaster, (Where we would sail on Cleopatra's barge if we could.) VA

[Joe Myerson]

Carl,
I would go with a permanently mounted depth sounder as a minimum. A hand held VHF is better than nothing, but range and battery life are real concerns. GPS/chartplotter are useful.

I agree that a permanent depth sounder is very important. But, as a longtime user of the Garmin hand-helds (I use the older GPSmap 76), I'd like to point out that they can be mounted semi-permanently and hooked into your battery system.

I've used such a system for years (supplemented with AA batteries for emergency use).

BTW, Capt. Gordon serves PP&J with the hardtack!

--Joe

[SurryMark]

I'd be interested in hearing real experiences of close coastal navigation by depth, especially with very low visibility. In my experience, if you start with a reasonable estimate of location, and allow +/- 20 feet or so for tide, given the fact that chart depths don't measure every single bump and dip on the bottom, you can verify that you're in about 120' of water and not 60'. That +/- 120' area can be quite broad. As for following, say, the 60' or 30' line into a harbor, that can be a twisty experience when motoring, even trickier under sail, and you could be toying with rapidly shoaling water. Sailing single-handed vastly complicates this.

I think a mounted depth sounder is a valuable navigation tool, and I've only had a gps for a few years; before that it was compass, chart, and depth sounder, and no reliable way to measure speed through the water or, especially, over the ground. (Don't ask how many times I mistook an island that I had passed scores of times.) And I have a friend who still cruises Maine bays with a five foot draft and only a chart and compass (& no motor and the anchor stored below). But, dear reader, I personally wouldn't be too macho. Tell me how wrong I am, and, especially, give me some pointers on navigation by depth.
thx, m

[Steve Laume]

I was raised on paper charts and dead reckoning navigation. When I started sailing again with the Typhoon navigation was with a combination of paper charts, compass, hand bearing compass, hand held GPS and I also had a handheld VHF. There was no depth sounder which was missed.

Raven now has all of the above, plus a full sized chart plotter at the helm. The chart plotter is an amazing tool which I would never want to give up.

When navigating with more basic tools I always used the depth sounder to give me an approximation of where I was along a dead reckoning line. This works particularly well in areas where the depths change in a predictable manner.

In some areas, one sight line and the depth will give yo a very good idea of where you are. I have played with following a contour line but have gotten bored with it pretty quickly.

It seems like several times a season I find myself hugging the RI shoreline. If the breeze is slightly offshore I feel quite comfortable getting in close. For the most part the shore slopes off gently and predictably. It is a very pretty sail where I will watch the depth sounder and hover around the 20' mark. The plotter is running, and I have a visual on the beach but I rely heavily on the depth sounder for this activity.

So I mostly use my depth sounder for a conformation of location, determining the proper amount of anchor line to let out, exploring the edges of an anchorage to find a sweet spot, and cruising the beach, Steve.