Weather helm

[Peter Kozup]

I probably should know the answer to this question, but I'm really not sure, so I'm asking the board. My CD26 has a lot of weather helm. I understand that some weather helm is a good thing, but I find that as soon as I ease up on the tiller the boat is heading into the wind, excessively, I believe. What's the best thing to do to lessen weather helm? Again, I'm not trying to get rid of all weather helm, but I would like to be able to reach for something across the cockpit without having the boat swing through 35 degrees into the wind. Thanks for your thoughts.

[Oswego John]

Hi Pete,

I guess you need a little more foresail area or less mainsail area.

Do you have a larger jib? In a pinch, reef the main.

Try to get a better balance fore and aft.

All the best,
O J

[tartansailor]

Loosen your backstay 1"
then
Tighten your forestay 1"

I like a neutral helm with a 130 genny.

With a jib I'm usually reefed so I still retain slight weather helm.

When I'm flying my 180, my backstay adjuster comes in handy, but there are others on this board who do not subscribe to this.

Dick

[Jim Evans]

If your mainsail is blown out of shape, that will certainly increase your weather helm. You might see if taking add'l tension on your outhaul and halyard/downhaul help to flatten your main.

And I certainly agree with Dick's suggestion of tuning the mast forward.

[Russell]

The most simple solution of all is to make sure your not overtrimming your main.

[Neil Gordon]

I probably should know the answer to this question, but I'm really not sure, so I'm asking the board. My CD26 has a lot of weather helm. I understand that some weather helm is a good thing, but I find that as soon as I ease up on the tiller the boat is heading into the wind, excessively, I believe.

In what sort of conditions?

As you said, a bit of weather helm is good since if you let go of the tiller (e.g., fall overboard) the boat will round up and stop. I find it useful also for standing at the mast taking the main down.

Others have pointed out various causes/solutions... mask rake, sail condition, sail trim, reefs, etc. Describe the wind conditions and points of sail that give you the most problem and we'll narrow the discussion a bit.

[Peter Kozup]

Neil and everyone else,
I believe that the weather helm is more noticeable when the winds are brisker and when reaching, particularly close reaching. I also believe that my main is probably blown out a bit -- the sails are not new by any means -- but I didn't realize that that could cause weather helm. If I tighten up the forestay and loosen the backstay I would assume that that would rake the mast forward and that that would decrease the foresail area while increasing the area aft of the main. That, by my figuring, should increase weather helm because the aft part of the boat would be driven to the lee, thereby driving the bow of the boat windward. Or, is my figuring wrong?? Thanks to all who have replied to my question. I will try some of these ideas out next time I'm on the water.

[Oswego John]

Peter

As I understand it, when the top of the mast is moved foreward, it also moves the center of effort of the sail mass foreward.

This move foreward brings the center of effort closer to, but not equal to the center of lateral resistance. This lowers, but not negates, weather helm.

http://www.sailingusa.info/sailboat_balance.htm

Best wishes,
O J

[Neil Gordon]

If I tighten up the forestay and loosen the backstay I would assume that that would rake the mast forward and that that would decrease the foresail area while increasing the area aft of the main.

Moving the top of the mast forward moves the whole main forward just a bit. That moves the center of effort of the main forward just a bit, also. You tune the stays because moving the mast step is just a bit harder.

Measure the effort not in relation to the mast but in relation to the boat. The jib or genoa hasn't moved but the main is now further forward. More pull and less push reduces the weather helm.

You could also just try reefing early. See if the reduction in weather helm and easier steering doesn't make up for the lack of sail area.

[drysuit2]

Peter,

Your right the 26 has a certain degree of weather held designed in the craft. But as your sails age and stretch out it becomes excessive. Before I spent money on a new set of sails, the helm could only sail a neutral helm with the jib at 150% and the first reef in the main. Now you may only have a working jib [100%] and that can be part of why she wants to head up into the wind. As John mentioned the 26 really likes at least a 135% jib with a full main.

I mentioned wanting to remedy my weather helm to my sailmaker when I ordered new sails two seasons ago. My new main and genny have a higher aspect than the old ones so the Center of Effort is farther forward, without giving up much sail area. In addition, since my new sails are not 20 years old and blown out, my leach opens up properly. [An open leach allows the sail to spill wind when overpowered, allowing the sails power to be translated into forward motion instead of just excessive heal.]
If new sails are not in the cards, you may want to try flattening your sails a bit. A little more downhaul and outhaul will open up your leach. As you change your setting you can see the curve of the sail change. A lot of folks don’t like to flatten their sails. They think baggy = more power = faster. Also more down and out haul can make your leach flap in old sails. [Heck, too much outhaul makes my leach flap on my brand new jenny] When this happens tightening the leach line will stop the flapping but close up the leach even more.
I also use the Cunningham eye a lot. This is because the 26 doesn’t have a downhaul, but a fixed boom instead. So it’s not as easy to adjust all your lines. On the jenny play with the sheeting angles; move those blocks around. Forward will tighten the leach; aft will open it up. Oh and don’t oversheet your main! Trim it just enough to take the luff out of the luff.
Lastly don’t be afraid to fool around with any or all of your sail settings. Like I said, sometimes I reef the main before I reef the jib. [There are no hard and fast rules]. It all depends on the conditions and what I am trying to do. Cape Dory’s are very forgiving boats, they will still manage to get me from point A to point B even when my sail trim is embarrassingly wrong.

Thanks for putting up with my excessively long post. Can you tell I love sail trim?