I've removed all bottom paint to the gel-coat. In a number of areas, I inadvertently sanded through the gel-coat exposing the resin. Can I apply Interprotect 2000E/2001 barrier system directly over these spots or should I first apply Interprotect 1000E/1001 and follow with the 2000 series? I'd also like to know if anyone has tried the 3M barrier system and how it compares to the Interprotect product.
Mike Pallon
IMPROMPTU
CD27, #125
pallonm@ccsu.edu
Barrier Coat Application
Moderator: Jim Walsh
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Bill Goldsmith
Re: Barrier Coat Application
I'm going through the same process right now on Second Chance (CD27 #172). In many spots, prior sanding had reduced the gelcoat thickness so much that the mere application of the sander revealed resin immediately. Glad to hear you're doing a barrier coat because it's supposed to restore the moisture resistance of the original gelcoat and then some.
My understanding is that with Interlux you have to use the 1000 over bare resin, and the 2000 over that and gelcoat. Check with Interlux help line or their website, I've called them and they're very helpful. Guys in my yard have used 3M and swear by it--it's a bit more forgiving on application timing. However, I'm going to use the most complex system--West System--which you have to mix yourself. Another boat in my yard was done with it and looks fantastic. With West System they recommend the first coat be pure epoxy without the barrier additive which I think provides a sealer coat similar to the Interlux 1000.
Question for you: how are you dealing with the very bottom of the keel? Mine is resting on a single timber with no access to the bottom.
Bill Goldsmith
Second Chance
1980 CD 27 #172
goldy@bestweb.net
My understanding is that with Interlux you have to use the 1000 over bare resin, and the 2000 over that and gelcoat. Check with Interlux help line or their website, I've called them and they're very helpful. Guys in my yard have used 3M and swear by it--it's a bit more forgiving on application timing. However, I'm going to use the most complex system--West System--which you have to mix yourself. Another boat in my yard was done with it and looks fantastic. With West System they recommend the first coat be pure epoxy without the barrier additive which I think provides a sealer coat similar to the Interlux 1000.
Question for you: how are you dealing with the very bottom of the keel? Mine is resting on a single timber with no access to the bottom.
Bill Goldsmith
Second Chance
1980 CD 27 #172
Mike Pallon wrote: I've removed all bottom paint to the gel-coat. In a number of areas, I inadvertently sanded through the gel-coat exposing the resin. Can I apply Interprotect 2000E/2001 barrier system directly over these spots or should I first apply Interprotect 1000E/1001 and follow with the 2000 series? I'd also like to know if anyone has tried the 3M barrier system and how it compares to the Interprotect product.
Mike Pallon
IMPROMPTU
CD27, #125
goldy@bestweb.net
-
Joe Brown
Re: Barrier Coat Application
Just read your exchange about sanding through the gelcoat. I may face the same problem. As for how to paint the underside of the keel, I have to wait until my boat is in a Travelift sling, prior to launch, and then touch up botgh the underside of the keel and the spots where the jackstand blocks rested. A good yard will wait 15-20 minutes for this paint to set up before launching and that's good enough for most bottom paints to set up.
joebrown@mint.net
joebrown@mint.net
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cyrus jordan
Re: Barrier Coat Application
I just finished putting on IL 2000. I never went through the gelcoat with the sanding process. Straightforward directions on the can. I found that an organic vapor respirator filter helped alot. I used cheap brushes with each coat so I could throw them away. I don't think you have to worry about the bottom of the keel at all; on my Typhoon the bottom of the keel is lead with just a coating of gelcoat. If you went through the gelcoat with your sanding low down on your keel, you may only be seeing lead, not fiberglass, If this is the case, I don't think you'd have to pay all the money and spend all the time with IL 1000 as a first coat.
cy jordan
cjordan@together.net
cy jordan
cjordan@together.net
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Bill Goldsmith
Re: Barrier Coat Application
Thanks Joe. If it were only bottom paint I would do just that. I am more concerned about how to handle the barrier coat issue which involves waiting for the epoxy to cure and then putting on bottom paint. I am not sure how much time I'll need. If it's more time than I can get in the sling, I was curious about other people's experiences in this regard.
Bill
goldy@bestweb.net
Bill
Joe Brown wrote: Just read your exchange about sanding through the gelcoat. I may face the same problem. As for how to paint the underside of the keel, I have to wait until my boat is in a Travelift sling, prior to launch, and then touch up botgh the underside of the keel and the spots where the jackstand blocks rested. A good yard will wait 15-20 minutes for this paint to set up before launching and that's good enough for most bottom paints to set up.
goldy@bestweb.net
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Matt Cawthorne
Re: Barrier Coat Application
Bill,
Patricia and I did the West system thing 5 years ago and it held up great except at the waterline where we did not coat high enough. Last year I went back and raised the waterline and everything is holding up nicely. I did patches for the jackstands and when they were completely done moved the jackstands and then did the rest. The keel was tougher. The boat was sitting on two 8x8 timbers running crosswise. I barrier coated everywhere that I could and then went and put two 6x8's under spots that had already been done. Using some wedges (siding shakes) we took as much of the load off of the original blocks as possible. Then we dug holes under the original 8x8's and pulled them out. You have to be careful not to overload the jackstands when you do this. A far better way would be to have the marina pick your boat up and move it 8 inches on the blocks to allow access. We did ours in march and it was cold so it took the whole weekend to do the patches for the stands and then a whole weekend to do the rest of the boat. In hindsight I wish that I had waited for a warmer weekend and then all 5 or 6 coats can be done in a signle day. If I had it to do over I would also scrape the bottom of the hull to get it extra smooth (it was pretty good already) using a cabinet scrapter and apply a couple of coats of epoxy with copper powder mixed in. West sells the stuff and it is a pretty fair anti-foulant. I would only keep 1 layer of ablative paint on the bottom and a thin one at that. Buildup would never be a problem and any areas which wear through would be protected by the copper/epoxy mix.
Good luck it is a lot of work, but most certainly worth it.
Matt
mcawthor@bellatlantic.net
Patricia and I did the West system thing 5 years ago and it held up great except at the waterline where we did not coat high enough. Last year I went back and raised the waterline and everything is holding up nicely. I did patches for the jackstands and when they were completely done moved the jackstands and then did the rest. The keel was tougher. The boat was sitting on two 8x8 timbers running crosswise. I barrier coated everywhere that I could and then went and put two 6x8's under spots that had already been done. Using some wedges (siding shakes) we took as much of the load off of the original blocks as possible. Then we dug holes under the original 8x8's and pulled them out. You have to be careful not to overload the jackstands when you do this. A far better way would be to have the marina pick your boat up and move it 8 inches on the blocks to allow access. We did ours in march and it was cold so it took the whole weekend to do the patches for the stands and then a whole weekend to do the rest of the boat. In hindsight I wish that I had waited for a warmer weekend and then all 5 or 6 coats can be done in a signle day. If I had it to do over I would also scrape the bottom of the hull to get it extra smooth (it was pretty good already) using a cabinet scrapter and apply a couple of coats of epoxy with copper powder mixed in. West sells the stuff and it is a pretty fair anti-foulant. I would only keep 1 layer of ablative paint on the bottom and a thin one at that. Buildup would never be a problem and any areas which wear through would be protected by the copper/epoxy mix.
Good luck it is a lot of work, but most certainly worth it.
Matt
Bill Goldsmith wrote: I'm going through the same process right now on Second Chance (CD27 #172). In many spots, prior sanding had reduced the gelcoat thickness so much that the mere application of the sander revealed resin immediately. Glad to hear you're doing a barrier coat because it's supposed to restore the moisture resistance of the original gelcoat and then some.
My understanding is that with Interlux you have to use the 1000 over bare resin, and the 2000 over that and gelcoat. Check with Interlux help line or their website, I've called them and they're very helpful. Guys in my yard have used 3M and swear by it--it's a bit more forgiving on application timing. However, I'm going to use the most complex system--West System--which you have to mix yourself. Another boat in my yard was done with it and looks fantastic. With West System they recommend the first coat be pure epoxy without the barrier additive which I think provides a sealer coat similar to the Interlux 1000.
Question for you: how are you dealing with the very bottom of the keel? Mine is resting on a single timber with no access to the bottom.
Bill Goldsmith
Second Chance
1980 CD 27 #172
Mike Pallon wrote: I've removed all bottom paint to the gel-coat. In a number of areas, I inadvertently sanded through the gel-coat exposing the resin. Can I apply Interprotect 2000E/2001 barrier system directly over these spots or should I first apply Interprotect 1000E/1001 and follow with the 2000 series? I'd also like to know if anyone has tried the 3M barrier system and how it compares to the Interprotect product.
Mike Pallon
IMPROMPTU
CD27, #125
mcawthor@bellatlantic.net
-
kurt
Re: Barrier Coat Application
I am reposting an item I orginally posted on 1/18/99...and believe me, vinyester resin (the 3m product) offers superior moisture exclusion effectivness to any of the epoxy products from interlux, west, system3,vc17 etc.
Several years ago severe blistering developed on the bottom of my 1985 CD 26, Alerion. In the fall of 1995 I used a 7" high
speed disc sander and 26 grit discs to remove all of the gelcoat beneath the waterline. After letting the hull air dry during the 5
month winter haul out period here in Michigan, I applied 8 thin coats (4 gallons) of System 3 epoxy resin to the bottom.
To date, the repair has been satisfactory with only a couple blisters appearing right at the waterline/topside transition point
where I had only feathered the sanding and didn't competely remove the gel coat.
As luck would have it, just after completeing my repair job 3M introduced its new new line of marine coatings based on
vinylester resin formulations. Based on the extensive reading and research I did prior to my project I would use the 3M
products if I had to do it over. Vinylesters are the most waterproof coating available. However, at the time I did my repair only
'professional use' vinylester products were available
kjlgpw@aol.com
Several years ago severe blistering developed on the bottom of my 1985 CD 26, Alerion. In the fall of 1995 I used a 7" high
speed disc sander and 26 grit discs to remove all of the gelcoat beneath the waterline. After letting the hull air dry during the 5
month winter haul out period here in Michigan, I applied 8 thin coats (4 gallons) of System 3 epoxy resin to the bottom.
To date, the repair has been satisfactory with only a couple blisters appearing right at the waterline/topside transition point
where I had only feathered the sanding and didn't competely remove the gel coat.
As luck would have it, just after completeing my repair job 3M introduced its new new line of marine coatings based on
vinylester resin formulations. Based on the extensive reading and research I did prior to my project I would use the 3M
products if I had to do it over. Vinylesters are the most waterproof coating available. However, at the time I did my repair only
'professional use' vinylester products were available
kjlgpw@aol.com