Late season head odor

[Paul Scribner]

Round about the middle of August. A strong odor comes from the head when I pump sea water in. I suspect it is marine growth in the in-take hose. I installed an in-line deodorizer but doesn't help. Am thinking of installing a bladder type fresh water supply in the head area. Anyone experience this? Solutions? Maybe its just Cape Cod Bay water? Thanks
Paul Scribner
s/v Serenitas
CD 28 Hull 205



scribner@channel1.com

[D. Stump, Hanalei]

Paul,
As I understand it, one of the biggest misconceptions about head odors is that it's what we as humans put in the head that causes the odor. Actually, if you want to see what really smells, put a glass of salt water(from your slip), covered with seran wrap in the sun for a few days and you"ll understand when you remove the seran! The hose from the thru hull to the head pump is the culprit. This hose is usually specially made to preclude penetration by odor, but as it ages, the odors will win! It would probably be best to replace that small piece of hose with the best head hose you can get from West Marine or the like.

Hope this helps....

Dave Stump
Captain Commanding
s/v Hanalei (CD-30)

[John]

Dear Dave
Even though dry flushes are the standing order on our CD 31, we are experiencing similar odors. Using my sniffer (model 1952 !) I've traced it back to the vent on the anti-siphon loop in the overboard discharge hose. This loop is located in a stand-up locker in the cabin. This is unfortunate because it stinks! Interestingly enough I found in my owners manual that the system was origionaly laid out so that the loop and vent were located in the port side cockpit locker. Much better on the sniffer. I wonder if my layout was a production change or something the prior owner did ? Any thoughts?



nuttallj@msn.com

[D. Stump, Hanalei]

John,
Hanalei (CD-30) has two vents on the waste system. One is 1/2" inside Dia. tubing from the top of the holding tank, thru the starboard lazerette, to a small bronze thru hull vent on the transom. I had trouble with this vent this spring. The boat smelled fine when we launched her, but after a few weeks - SMELL! Turned out to be that the thru hull vent on the transom had a bronze screen in it. Someone had overfilled the holding tank, and the only path of exit was to force the waste thru the vent. This immediately fouled the vent and started to lift the hose from the head to the holding tank off of the tank(you can generate an incredible amount of hydraulic force with that little head pump!). I ended up with sewage water under the engine! The other vent is a vented loop between the holding tank and the bilge pump (used as a waste overboard discharge pump). That loop is in the port lazerette. Haven't had any trouble with that as we very seldom dump overboard.

As far as the situation you describe, venting inboard and into a locker to boot, doesn't sound very appetizing to me. I think I'd get small through hull vents and install them high, just under the rail, to assure all venting was to outside air. Sometimes it makes one wonder what a systems designer was thinking of - vent inboard???

Anyhow, just some thoughts. Oh, Hanalei now has no odor at all, fixing the vent and replacing the large hose to the holding tank fixed the problem! Let me know if I can be of further assistance.....

Dave Stump
Captain Commanding
Hanalei

[Harvey Wilson]

John,
Hanalei (CD-30) has two vents on the waste system. One is 1/2" inside Dia. tubing from the top of the holding tank, thru the starboard lazerette, to a small bronze thru hull vent on the transom. I had trouble with this vent this spring. The boat smelled fine when we launched her, but after a few weeks - SMELL! Turned out to be that the thru hull vent on the transom had a bronze screen in it. Someone had overfilled the holding tank, and the only path of exit was to force the waste thru the vent. This immediately fouled the vent and started to lift the hose from the head to the holding tank off of the tank(you can generate an incredible amount of hydraulic force with that little head pump!). I ended up with sewage water under the engine! The other vent is a vented loop between the holding tank and the bilge pump (used as a waste overboard discharge pump). That loop is in the port lazerette. Haven't had any trouble with that as we very seldom dump overboard.

As far as the situation you describe, venting inboard and into a locker to boot, doesn't sound very appetizing to me. I think I'd get small through hull vents and install them high, just under the rail, to assure all venting was to outside air. Sometimes it makes one wonder what a systems designer was thinking of - vent inboard???

Peggie Hall, of Peal products, is very knowledgable about holding tank problems..her company makes K.O. and a host of other sanitation products for the boating fraternity. She's on Compuserve's Sailing Forum, and has been _very_ helpful in solving problems such as this.

Harvey/ Ga

s/v Stargazer



102072.2315@compuserve.com

[John R.]

John,
Hanalei (CD-30) has two vents on the waste system. One is 1/2" inside Dia. tubing from the top of the holding tank, thru the starboard lazerette, to a small bronze thru hull vent on the transom. I had trouble with this vent this spring. The boat smelled fine when we launched her, but after a few weeks - SMELL! Turned out to be that the thru hull vent on the transom had a bronze screen in it. Someone had overfilled the holding tank, and the only path of exit was to force the waste thru the vent. This immediately fouled the vent and started to lift the hose from the head to the holding tank off of the tank(you can generate an incredible amount of hydraulic force with that little head pump!). I ended up with sewage water under the engine! The other vent is a vented loop between the holding tank and the bilge pump (used as a waste overboard discharge pump). That loop is in the port lazerette. Haven't had any trouble with that as we very seldom dump overboard.

As far as the situation you describe, venting inboard and into a locker to boot, doesn't sound very appetizing to me. I think I'd get small through hull vents and install them high, just under the rail, to assure all venting was to outside air. Sometimes it makes one wonder what a systems designer was thinking of - vent inboard???

Peggie Hall, of Peal products, is very knowledgable about holding tank problems..her company makes K.O. and a host of other sanitation products for the boating fraternity. She's on Compuserve's Sailing Forum, and has been _very_ helpful in solving problems such as this.

Harvey/ Ga

s/v Stargazer

Harvey is correct. I instituted some of Peg Hall's suggestions and they work. The double vent on the holding tank rather than a single vent has made major improvements. In addition I clamped a piece of hose to the vent fittings of the vented loops on the intake and discharge lines of the head, ran them both to a tee fitting and then to a standard 1/2" thruhull vent fitting. Both vented loops now vent to the exterior of the boat. I use Forespar vented loops with the screw on vent caps. Those screw on vent caps have a few small ribs on them that need to be removed for the hose to slip over. Periodically it is a good idea to remove the hose from the vent caps and then unscrew the caps and remove the rubber flapper valve and rinse away any built up salt crystals that may prevent it from sealing properly.

[Larry DeMers]

Peggy Hall of Peal Products is also available on rec.boats.cruising. She is constantly helping people with their head problems. One of her products..K.O. is a great product.**IF** you do not allow it to be stored in too hot an atmosphere. The biological makeup of the product dies off at something like 95deg. or slightly higher. I have had two bottles that just did not work, and I found out the product was stored in a metal storage building before being put on the shelf for sale. Peggy will replace these defective ones free if returned to her. She has a free brochure that contains some great ideas to get the smell down to zero..one of which is the double tank vent that has been talked about here.

Cheers!

Larry

John,
Hanalei (CD-30) has two vents on the waste system. One is 1/2" inside Dia. tubing from the top of the holding tank, thru the starboard lazerette, to a small bronze thru hull vent on the transom. I had trouble with this vent this spring. The boat smelled fine when we launched her, but after a few weeks - SMELL! Turned out to be that the thru hull vent on the transom had a bronze screen in it. Someone had overfilled the holding tank, and the only path of exit was to force the waste thru the vent. This immediately fouled the vent and started to lift the hose from the head to the holding tank off of the tank(you can generate an incredible amount of hydraulic force with that little head pump!). I ended up with sewage water under the engine! The other vent is a vented loop between the holding tank and the bilge pump (used as a waste overboard discharge pump). That loop is in the port lazerette. Haven't had any trouble with that as we very seldom dump overboard.

As far as the situation you describe, venting inboard and into a locker to boot, doesn't sound very appetizing to me. I think I'd get small through hull vents and install them high, just under the rail, to assure all venting was to outside air. Sometimes it makes one wonder what a systems designer was thinking of - vent inboard???

Peggie Hall, of Peal products, is very knowledgable about holding tank problems..her company makes K.O. and a host of other sanitation products for the boating fraternity. She's on Compuserve's Sailing Forum, and has been _very_ helpful in solving problems such as this.

Harvey/ Ga

s/v Stargazer

Harvey is correct. I instituted some of Peg Hall's suggestions and they work. The double vent on the holding tank rather than a single vent has made major improvements. In addition I clamped a piece of hose to the vent fittings of the vented loops on the intake and discharge lines of the head, ran them both to a tee fitting and then to a standard 1/2" thruhull vent fitting. Both vented loops now vent to the exterior of the boat. I use Forespar vented loops with the screw on vent caps. Those screw on vent caps have a few small ribs on them that need to be removed for the hose to slip over. Periodically it is a good idea to remove the hose from the vent caps and then unscrew the caps and remove the rubber flapper valve and rinse away any built up salt crystals that may prevent it from sealing properly.

demers@sgi.com

[Walt Bilofsky]

Peg Hall has been very helpful. I found that most of the odor came from salt water up inside the rim of the bowl. I minimize this by shutting the salt water intake valve, and using the shower head extension on the sink faucet to rinse the bowl with a little fresh water. When flushing solid waste, I open the salt water intake and flush, then close it, rinse with fresh and flush till empty.

An alternative would be to use salt water, but when leaving the boat, close the salt water intake, rinse with fresh water, and flush empty.



bilofsky@toolworks.com

[John (again)]

Thanks for the great posts everyone!
I am following up on all your suggestions. They make lots of sense. I am now thinking my stern vent may be clogged, because during a recent pump out the suction hose was acting like the vent was clogged ( the suction wouldn't break until the hose was removed). I'll check that, re-vent that interior anti-siphon vent, and check the "KO" website!!
John
"Aimless"
CD-31 (#28)

Dear Dave
Even though dry flushes are the standing order on our CD 31, we are experiencing similar odors. Using my sniffer (model 1952 !) I've traced it back to the vent on the anti-siphon loop in the overboard discharge hose. This loop is located in a stand-up locker in the cabin. This is unfortunate because it stinks! Interestingly enough I found in my owners manual that the system was origionaly laid out so that the loop and vent were located in the port side cockpit locker. Much better on the sniffer. I wonder if my layout was a production change or something the prior owner did ? Any thoughts?

nutallj@msn.com