I am having problems with the Datamarine depth gauge that came as original equipment on my 1987 CD330 and would appreciate any recommendations or suggestions on how to repair the problem. Since Datamarine is no longer in business I am turning to the next best resource – this board.
I am not getting a proper signal or return and the local electronics shop is suggesting I replace the transducer. The gauge was bench tested and is working perfectly. The problem is that the boat is in the water and I would like to avoid pulling her just to replace the through hull transducer. I am considering 2 different approaches to solve this problem and welcome suggestions, comments, alternatives, or criticism, name calling, challenges, etc.
Idea #1 – Abandon the thru-hull transducer and install one of the transducers that seal to the fiberglass via epoxy. Will this type of transducer work with an older gauge?
Idea #2 – The current transducer appears to be suspended in epoxy, which pass through the hull in the center of a plastic fitting. Can I drill a hole in the existing epoxy, insert the new transducer into the hole and then fill the hole with new epoxy sealing the new transducer along side the existing one?
Am I nuts?
chris.reinke@sac.com
Original CD Equipment Manufacturer gone. Who do you call? -
Moderator: Jim Walsh
-
John R.
SEA / Datamarine
Chris,
Awhile back Datamarine was taken over by SEA (Stephens Engineering). They may be able to help you out with further troubleshooting and/or a replacement transducer. See the link at the bottom of this page.
I have attempted a couple transducer installations on the inside of the hull when owners didn't want a hole made in the hull for a typical installation. We did one using silicone and that worked fairly well but not perfectly. It was okay in shallower reads but readings in deeper waters were not always accurate (due to weak signal). Much similar results occured using epoxy but the readings seemed somewhat less accurate than when we used silicone. Perhaps the higher density of the epoxy was a factor but that is not a certainty because both were done in different boats. My understanding is that the density of the glass in the hull is very important in a installation of this type. It is critical that no air pockets are between the transducer face and the hull interior and none in the hull glass layup. If you use the epoxy technique be absolutely certain to have a thick mound of epoxy built up on the hull and also precoat the face of the transducer and then press the transducer down against the mound of epoxy all the while turning it while pressing down. That will minimize any risk of air pockets getting trapped in the attachment.
Another option is to use a transducer bubble glued to the interior of the hull filled with compass oil or mineral oil. I've never done this but have seen them installed. I don't know how accurate the transducer is when installed in this fashion. Perhaps someone else has more info and experience on that particular technique.
As for your idea #2: If you could obtain that replacement transducer component it could theoretically be done but I wouldn't be inclined to trust it. I do not know what you mean when you say "sealing the new transducer alongside the existing one". The old one may look like a plastic plug (filled with epoxy) slid inside a plastic sleeve with external threads that has a plastic nut which screws down against the hull and holds that sleeve in the hull. The transducer plug then slips inside the sleeve and is usually locked in place with either a stainless pin that goes through the sleeve sides and plug or it uses a plastic nut/cap that screws in place on the top of the sleeve. It would be a real pain to try and replace that transducer piece which is sealed in epoxy within one of those plugs.
Maybe others have actually tried doing it but I haven't and can't advise you whether or not it can be done successfully.
I would advise that you contact the tech dept at SEA and find out what they may be able to help you with. It may be a problem in the head unit circuitry or the cable itself leading from the transducer. Talk your particular model over with the tech guys before you do anything drastic.
Awhile back Datamarine was taken over by SEA (Stephens Engineering). They may be able to help you out with further troubleshooting and/or a replacement transducer. See the link at the bottom of this page.
I have attempted a couple transducer installations on the inside of the hull when owners didn't want a hole made in the hull for a typical installation. We did one using silicone and that worked fairly well but not perfectly. It was okay in shallower reads but readings in deeper waters were not always accurate (due to weak signal). Much similar results occured using epoxy but the readings seemed somewhat less accurate than when we used silicone. Perhaps the higher density of the epoxy was a factor but that is not a certainty because both were done in different boats. My understanding is that the density of the glass in the hull is very important in a installation of this type. It is critical that no air pockets are between the transducer face and the hull interior and none in the hull glass layup. If you use the epoxy technique be absolutely certain to have a thick mound of epoxy built up on the hull and also precoat the face of the transducer and then press the transducer down against the mound of epoxy all the while turning it while pressing down. That will minimize any risk of air pockets getting trapped in the attachment.
Another option is to use a transducer bubble glued to the interior of the hull filled with compass oil or mineral oil. I've never done this but have seen them installed. I don't know how accurate the transducer is when installed in this fashion. Perhaps someone else has more info and experience on that particular technique.
As for your idea #2: If you could obtain that replacement transducer component it could theoretically be done but I wouldn't be inclined to trust it. I do not know what you mean when you say "sealing the new transducer alongside the existing one". The old one may look like a plastic plug (filled with epoxy) slid inside a plastic sleeve with external threads that has a plastic nut which screws down against the hull and holds that sleeve in the hull. The transducer plug then slips inside the sleeve and is usually locked in place with either a stainless pin that goes through the sleeve sides and plug or it uses a plastic nut/cap that screws in place on the top of the sleeve. It would be a real pain to try and replace that transducer piece which is sealed in epoxy within one of those plugs.
Maybe others have actually tried doing it but I haven't and can't advise you whether or not it can be done successfully.
I would advise that you contact the tech dept at SEA and find out what they may be able to help you with. It may be a problem in the head unit circuitry or the cable itself leading from the transducer. Talk your particular model over with the tech guys before you do anything drastic.
Chris Reinke - CD330 wrote: I am having problems with the Datamarine depth gauge that came as original equipment on my 1987 CD330 and would appreciate any recommendations or suggestions on how to repair the problem. Since Datamarine is no longer in business I am turning to the next best resource – this board.
I am not getting a proper signal or return and the local electronics shop is suggesting I replace the transducer. The gauge was bench tested and is working perfectly. The problem is that the boat is in the water and I would like to avoid pulling her just to replace the through hull transducer. I am considering 2 different approaches to solve this problem and welcome suggestions, comments, alternatives, or criticism, name calling, challenges, etc.
Idea #1 – Abandon the thru-hull transducer and install one of the transducers that seal to the fiberglass via epoxy. Will this type of transducer work with an older gauge?
Idea #2 – The current transducer appears to be suspended in epoxy, which pass through the hull in the center of a plastic fitting. Can I drill a hole in the existing epoxy, insert the new transducer into the hole and then fill the hole with new epoxy sealing the new transducer along side the existing one?
Am I nuts?
-
Bill
Re: Original CD Equipment Manufacturer gone. Who do you call
Hi Chris
You certainly dont have to pull the boat to install a transducer that works. I have cut a 4" piece of PVC and affixed it to the hull using Life Caulk (the not glue stuff). Then I filled the PVC with water and anti-freeze inserted the transducer through a 4" cap and sealed the cap with silicon (sp) caulk. It has worked perfectly for over three years now.
If you want something more permanent (sp) the fix it after you haul out this fall. although this method works fine and has been suggested by many folks.
Fair Winds
Bill
Captain Commanding
S/V Rhapsody (the Original)
CD25D #148
Oklahoma Contingent of the NE Fleet of the CDSOA
Galley Wench Evening Light
<a href="http://www.applegatemarina.com">Kerr Lake, OK (Oklahoma's Outlet to the Sea)</A>
cd25d@rhapsodysails.com
You certainly dont have to pull the boat to install a transducer that works. I have cut a 4" piece of PVC and affixed it to the hull using Life Caulk (the not glue stuff). Then I filled the PVC with water and anti-freeze inserted the transducer through a 4" cap and sealed the cap with silicon (sp) caulk. It has worked perfectly for over three years now.
If you want something more permanent (sp) the fix it after you haul out this fall. although this method works fine and has been suggested by many folks.
Fair Winds
Bill
Captain Commanding
S/V Rhapsody (the Original)
CD25D #148
Oklahoma Contingent of the NE Fleet of the CDSOA
Galley Wench Evening Light
<a href="http://www.applegatemarina.com">Kerr Lake, OK (Oklahoma's Outlet to the Sea)</A>
Chris Reinke - CD330 wrote: I am having problems with the Datamarine depth gauge that came as original equipment on my 1987 CD330 and would appreciate any recommendations or suggestions on how to repair the problem. Since Datamarine is no longer in business I am turning to the next best resource – this board.
I am not getting a proper signal or return and the local electronics shop is suggesting I replace the transducer. The gauge was bench tested and is working perfectly. The problem is that the boat is in the water and I would like to avoid pulling her just to replace the through hull transducer. I am considering 2 different approaches to solve this problem and welcome suggestions, comments, alternatives, or criticism, name calling, challenges, etc.
Idea #1 – Abandon the thru-hull transducer and install one of the transducers that seal to the fiberglass via epoxy. Will this type of transducer work with an older gauge?
Idea #2 – The current transducer appears to be suspended in epoxy, which pass through the hull in the center of a plastic fitting. Can I drill a hole in the existing epoxy, insert the new transducer into the hole and then fill the hole with new epoxy sealing the new transducer along side the existing one?
Am I nuts?
cd25d@rhapsodysails.com
-
John R.
The Link
Forgot to add the link, here it is.
John R. wrote: Chris,
Awhile back Datamarine was taken over by SEA (Stephens Engineering). They may be able to help you out with further troubleshooting and/or a replacement transducer. See the link at the bottom of this page.
I have attempted a couple transducer installations on the inside of the hull when owners didn't want a hole made in the hull for a typical installation. We did one using silicone and that worked fairly well but not perfectly. It was okay in shallower reads but readings in deeper waters were not always accurate (due to weak signal). Much similar results occured using epoxy but the readings seemed somewhat less accurate than when we used silicone. Perhaps the higher density of the epoxy was a factor but that is not a certainty because both were done in different boats. My understanding is that the density of the glass in the hull is very important in a installation of this type. It is critical that no air pockets are between the transducer face and the hull interior and none in the hull glass layup. If you use the epoxy technique be absolutely certain to have a thick mound of epoxy built up on the hull and also precoat the face of the transducer and then press the transducer down against the mound of epoxy all the while turning it while pressing down. That will minimize any risk of air pockets getting trapped in the attachment.
Another option is to use a transducer bubble glued to the interior of the hull filled with compass oil or mineral oil. I've never done this but have seen them installed. I don't know how accurate the transducer is when installed in this fashion. Perhaps someone else has more info and experience on that particular technique.
As for your idea #2: If you could obtain that replacement transducer component it could theoretically be done but I wouldn't be inclined to trust it. I do not know what you mean when you say "sealing the new transducer alongside the existing one". The old one may look like a plastic plug (filled with epoxy) slid inside a plastic sleeve with external threads that has a plastic nut which screws down against the hull and holds that sleeve in the hull. The transducer plug then slips inside the sleeve and is usually locked in place with either a stainless pin that goes through the sleeve sides and plug or it uses a plastic nut/cap that screws in place on the top of the sleeve. It would be a real pain to try and replace that transducer piece which is sealed in epoxy within one of those plugs.
Maybe others have actually tried doing it but I haven't and can't advise you whether or not it can be done successfully.
I would advise that you contact the tech dept at SEA and find out what they may be able to help you with. It may be a problem in the head unit circuitry or the cable itself leading from the transducer. Talk your particular model over with the tech guys before you do anything drastic.
Chris Reinke - CD330 wrote: I am having problems with the Datamarine depth gauge that came as original equipment on my 1987 CD330 and would appreciate any recommendations or suggestions on how to repair the problem. Since Datamarine is no longer in business I am turning to the next best resource – this board.
I am not getting a proper signal or return and the local electronics shop is suggesting I replace the transducer. The gauge was bench tested and is working perfectly. The problem is that the boat is in the water and I would like to avoid pulling her just to replace the through hull transducer. I am considering 2 different approaches to solve this problem and welcome suggestions, comments, alternatives, or criticism, name calling, challenges, etc.
Idea #1 – Abandon the thru-hull transducer and install one of the transducers that seal to the fiberglass via epoxy. Will this type of transducer work with an older gauge?
Idea #2 – The current transducer appears to be suspended in epoxy, which pass through the hull in the center of a plastic fitting. Can I drill a hole in the existing epoxy, insert the new transducer into the hole and then fill the hole with new epoxy sealing the new transducer along side the existing one?
Am I nuts?
-
Larry DeMers
Re: SEA / Datamarine
Chris and John,
Good idea with the standing pvc pipe. Try the mineral oil in the pipe instead..might work better due to the viscosity of oil. Also, make certain that the hull is NOT cored. You will not have much success getting the signal thru balsa wood ('course we don't worry about that with CD's, but other boats...?). Hope you find the bottom..
Cheers,
Larry DeMers
demers@sgi.com
Good idea with the standing pvc pipe. Try the mineral oil in the pipe instead..might work better due to the viscosity of oil. Also, make certain that the hull is NOT cored. You will not have much success getting the signal thru balsa wood ('course we don't worry about that with CD's, but other boats...?). Hope you find the bottom..
Cheers,
Larry DeMers
John R. wrote: Chris,
Awhile back Datamarine was taken over by SEA (Stephens Engineering). They may be able to help you out with further troubleshooting and/or a replacement transducer. See the link at the bottom of this page.
I have attempted a couple transducer installations on the inside of the hull when owners didn't want a hole made in the hull for a typical installation. We did one using silicone and that worked fairly well but not perfectly. It was okay in shallower reads but readings in deeper waters were not always accurate (due to weak signal). Much similar results occured using epoxy but the readings seemed somewhat less accurate than when we used silicone. Perhaps the higher density of the epoxy was a factor but that is not a certainty because both were done in different boats. My understanding is that the density of the glass in the hull is very important in a installation of this type. It is critical that no air pockets are between the transducer face and the hull interior and none in the hull glass layup. If you use the epoxy technique be absolutely certain to have a thick mound of epoxy built up on the hull and also precoat the face of the transducer and then press the transducer down against the mound of epoxy all the while turning it while pressing down. That will minimize any risk of air pockets getting trapped in the attachment.
Another option is to use a transducer bubble glued to the interior of the hull filled with compass oil or mineral oil. I've never done this but have seen them installed. I don't know how accurate the transducer is when installed in this fashion. Perhaps someone else has more info and experience on that particular technique.
As for your idea #2: If you could obtain that replacement transducer component it could theoretically be done but I wouldn't be inclined to trust it. I do not know what you mean when you say "sealing the new transducer alongside the existing one". The old one may look like a plastic plug (filled with epoxy) slid inside a plastic sleeve with external threads that has a plastic nut which screws down against the hull and holds that sleeve in the hull. The transducer plug then slips inside the sleeve and is usually locked in place with either a stainless pin that goes through the sleeve sides and plug or it uses a plastic nut/cap that screws in place on the top of the sleeve. It would be a real pain to try and replace that transducer piece which is sealed in epoxy within one of those plugs.
Maybe others have actually tried doing it but I haven't and can't advise you whether or not it can be done successfully.
I would advise that you contact the tech dept at SEA and find out what they may be able to help you with. It may be a problem in the head unit circuitry or the cable itself leading from the transducer. Talk your particular model over with the tech guys before you do anything drastic.
Chris Reinke - CD330 wrote: I am having problems with the Datamarine depth gauge that came as original equipment on my 1987 CD330 and would appreciate any recommendations or suggestions on how to repair the problem. Since Datamarine is no longer in business I am turning to the next best resource ? this board.
I am not getting a proper signal or return and the local electronics shop is suggesting I replace the transducer. The gauge was bench tested and is working perfectly. The problem is that the boat is in the water and I would like to avoid pulling her just to replace the through hull transducer. I am considering 2 different approaches to solve this problem and welcome suggestions, comments, alternatives, or criticism, name calling, challenges, etc.
Idea #1 ? Abandon the thru-hull transducer and install one of the transducers that seal to the fiberglass via epoxy. Will this type of transducer work with an older gauge?
Idea #2 ? The current transducer appears to be suspended in epoxy, which pass through the hull in the center of a plastic fitting. Can I drill a hole in the existing epoxy, insert the new transducer into the hole and then fill the hole with new epoxy sealing the new transducer along side the existing one?
Am I nuts?
demers@sgi.com
-
M. R. Bober
Data Marine Sounders....
Chris, having gone through the same problem last season on RESPITE (the sounder was basically generating random numbers), let me suggest that you consider replacing the instrument & transducer. Our concern was the same as yours. Testing revealed the transducer was defective, but the instrument head was fine. Rather than go to extremes to cobble up an 18 year old instrument.....We waited until our winter haulout to replace the unit and were extremely careful not to run aground during the interim.
Anyway the transducer for the Raymarine ST60 fits the hole in the hull that will be left if you remove the Data Marine transducer. And as an added bonus for eyes that are a bit older, the digital display has BIGGER characters.
Every best wish,
Mitchell Bober
RESPITE
CD330
Annapolis, MD
Anyway the transducer for the Raymarine ST60 fits the hole in the hull that will be left if you remove the Data Marine transducer. And as an added bonus for eyes that are a bit older, the digital display has BIGGER characters.
Every best wish,
Mitchell Bober
RESPITE
CD330
Annapolis, MD
-
Jim Alexander
Re: Original CD Equipment Manufacturer gone. Who do you call
After spending money on the instrument I was told the same thing; replace the transducer. I did but with a Humminbird fish finder and have done about 4,500 miles since then and I'm still well satisfied. If you plan to cruise I would recommend it.Chris Reinke - CD330 wrote: I am having problems with the Datamarine depth gauge that came as original equipment on my 1987 CD330 and would appreciate any recommendations or suggestions on how to repair the problem. Since Datamarine is no longer in business I am turning to the next best resource – this board.
I am not getting a proper signal or return and the local electronics shop is suggesting I replace the transducer. The gauge was bench tested and is working perfectly. The problem is that the boat is in the water and I would like to avoid pulling her just to replace the through hull transducer. I am considering 2 different approaches to solve this problem and welcome suggestions, comments, alternatives, or criticism, name calling, challenges, etc.
Idea #1 – Abandon the thru-hull transducer and install one of the transducers that seal to the fiberglass via epoxy. Will this type of transducer work with an older gauge?
Idea #2 – The current transducer appears to be suspended in epoxy, which pass through the hull in the center of a plastic fitting. Can I drill a hole in the existing epoxy, insert the new transducer into the hole and then fill the hole with new epoxy sealing the new transducer along side the existing one?
Am I nuts?
jimalex@earthlink.net