Slow Dance looks better now that she has some varnish and the grey is gone. However, she is the fourth CD on which I have had a significant problem with 3M tapes leaving a hard to remove residue after a lot less time that their claims for the tapes. I've used, over the years, the green, the blue, and now the silver. This time the blue went on and a front was coming, so I removed it after 36 hours and prior to the first coat of varnish. 1" blue tracks everywhere.
The silver was then used (its about 2-3 times as expensive, so better, of course) Today I spent all day getting it off. A friend and fellow sailor at the chandler allowed it to stay on his Allied 36 for 6 weeks with no problem. I left it about 10 days and it was a real problem.
I suspect older and porous gelcoat may be the culprit, but I simply don't know. Now that I have a decent base to build upon I'll re-tape with every coat to avoid this hassle. But I'm puzzled, and wonder if anyone has the answer.
Joe Sankey
CD 30 #311 Slow Dance
sankey@gulftel.com
Long-lasting masking tape that isn't
Moderator: Jim Walsh
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John R.
3M silver long term
3M's long term (30 day) silver mask (#3312 product number?)is the one you should be using. We used this tape for years in the marine business and I still use it today. It runs anywhere from $12 -$15 per roll at retail. We've left it on well beyond 3M's 30 day stated period in blistering heat and sun here in south Florida and it peels right off cleanly everytime. I don't have a clue why you are having such a difficult time. The blue mask should not be exposed beyond seven days. Time is critical with the blue mask, not nearly so critical with the silver mask. Never use the green mask in the sun or any standard masking tape.
The surface condition of the gelcoat should not make a difference. The worse the condition of the gelcoat the less adhesion you will get in the first place. We've used the silver on all grades of gelcoat over the past and it made no difference at all in the tapes release performance. You won't find a cleaner removing tape then the 3M silver mask.
If you are having trouble removing the remnants of your taping jobs use Naptha to make the job much easier.
The surface condition of the gelcoat should not make a difference. The worse the condition of the gelcoat the less adhesion you will get in the first place. We've used the silver on all grades of gelcoat over the past and it made no difference at all in the tapes release performance. You won't find a cleaner removing tape then the 3M silver mask.
If you are having trouble removing the remnants of your taping jobs use Naptha to make the job much easier.
Joe Sankey wrote: Slow Dance looks better now that she has some varnish and the grey is gone. However, she is the fourth CD on which I have had a significant problem with 3M tapes leaving a hard to remove residue after a lot less time that their claims for the tapes. I've used, over the years, the green, the blue, and now the silver. This time the blue went on and a front was coming, so I removed it after 36 hours and prior to the first coat of varnish. 1" blue tracks everywhere.
The silver was then used (its about 2-3 times as expensive, so better, of course) Today I spent all day getting it off. A friend and fellow sailor at the chandler allowed it to stay on his Allied 36 for 6 weeks with no problem. I left it about 10 days and it was a real problem.
I suspect older and porous gelcoat may be the culprit, but I simply don't know. Now that I have a decent base to build upon I'll re-tape with every coat to avoid this hassle. But I'm puzzled, and wonder if anyone has the answer.
Joe Sankey
CD 30 #311 Slow Dance
-
Joe Sankey
Re: 3M silver long term
Thanks for your response, John. That's what I used, and it failed. The blue failed as well. I assumed there was a rational explanation but it seems not.
sankey@gulftel.com
John R. wrote: 3M's long term (30 day) silver mask (#3312 product number?)is the one you should be using. We used this tape for years in the marine business and I still use it today. It runs anywhere from $12 -$15 per roll at retail. We've left it on well beyond 3M's 30 day stated period in blistering heat and sun here in south Florida and it peels right off cleanly everytime. I don't have a clue why you are having such a difficult time. The blue mask should not be exposed beyond seven days. Time is critical with the blue mask, not nearly so critical with the silver mask. Never use the green mask in the sun or any standard masking tape.
The surface condition of the gelcoat should not make a difference. The worse the condition of the gelcoat the less adhesion you will get in the first place. We've used the silver on all grades of gelcoat over the past and it made no difference at all in the tapes release performance. You won't find a cleaner removing tape then the 3M silver mask.
If you are having trouble removing the remnants of your taping jobs use Naptha to make the job much easier.
Joe Sankey wrote: Slow Dance looks better now that she has some varnish and the grey is gone. However, she is the fourth CD on which I have had a significant problem with 3M tapes leaving a hard to remove residue after a lot less time that their claims for the tapes. I've used, over the years, the green, the blue, and now the silver. This time the blue went on and a front was coming, so I removed it after 36 hours and prior to the first coat of varnish. 1" blue tracks everywhere.
The silver was then used (its about 2-3 times as expensive, so better, of course) Today I spent all day getting it off. A friend and fellow sailor at the chandler allowed it to stay on his Allied 36 for 6 weeks with no problem. I left it about 10 days and it was a real problem.
I suspect older and porous gelcoat may be the culprit, but I simply don't know. Now that I have a decent base to build upon I'll re-tape with every coat to avoid this hassle. But I'm puzzled, and wonder if anyone has the answer.
Joe Sankey
CD 30 #311 Slow Dance
sankey@gulftel.com
-
Ed Haley
Re: Long-lasting masking tape that isn't
After many years of having the same thing happen to me, I found that it was just as time consuming to remove the masking tape as it was to take extra care when painting brightwork without the tape.
I doubt that there is a tape that can seal off the penetration of any varnish type when your wet brush caresses the edge of the tape that is supposedly protecting the gelcoat. It usually makes matters worse as it spreads under the tape where air can't get to the varnish and congeal it. If you use as little as possible on the brush and take extra care in painting, the results can be quite nice.
This is certainly not a comment on your painting ability but with practice you'll find that you can do without the tape. IMHO
eghaleyNOSPAM@twcny.rr.com
I doubt that there is a tape that can seal off the penetration of any varnish type when your wet brush caresses the edge of the tape that is supposedly protecting the gelcoat. It usually makes matters worse as it spreads under the tape where air can't get to the varnish and congeal it. If you use as little as possible on the brush and take extra care in painting, the results can be quite nice.
This is certainly not a comment on your painting ability but with practice you'll find that you can do without the tape. IMHO
eghaleyNOSPAM@twcny.rr.com
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Joe Sankey
Re: Long-lasting masking tape that isn't
Ed, I'd hesitate to defend my varnishing ability. However, I did not mask the toe rail, and you're right; doing it carefully yields better results. I do find that as I've gotten older I can't see as well, and in certain areas the tape was comforting. Several years ago I had a problem when I let it get wet, so this time I removed it prior to rain and prior to varnish; 36 hours on a 7 day tape, and still a residue. Frustrating, but not life threatening. Besides, I got to spend a day in the sunshine without thinking too hard.
Joe Sankey
Slow Dance
sankey@gulftel.com
Joe Sankey
Slow Dance
Ed Haley wrote: After many years of having the same thing happen to me, I found that it was just as time consuming to remove the masking tape as it was to take extra care when painting brightwork without the tape.
I doubt that there is a tape that can seal off the penetration of any varnish type when your wet brush caresses the edge of the tape that is supposedly protecting the gelcoat. It usually makes matters worse as it spreads under the tape where air can't get to the varnish and congeal it. If you use as little as possible on the brush and take extra care in painting, the results can be quite nice.
This is certainly not a comment on your painting ability but with practice you'll find that you can do without the tape. IMHO
sankey@gulftel.com
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John R.
Re: 3M silver long term
Joe,
You may want to give 3M a call and run your experiences past them and get some feedback. The only thing I can think of is that perhaps the tape is old, been in a warehouse for a long time, stored improperly or subjected to some other type of adverse conditions. Being that you had trouble with silver and blue probably makes those points moot but that's why I would call 3M to be sure.
I'm confident they would like to know about your problem and maybe they will have a solution. They were always quite interested and helpful with product support for us.
You may want to give 3M a call and run your experiences past them and get some feedback. The only thing I can think of is that perhaps the tape is old, been in a warehouse for a long time, stored improperly or subjected to some other type of adverse conditions. Being that you had trouble with silver and blue probably makes those points moot but that's why I would call 3M to be sure.
I'm confident they would like to know about your problem and maybe they will have a solution. They were always quite interested and helpful with product support for us.
Joe Sankey wrote: Thanks for your response, John. That's what I used, and it failed. The blue failed as well. I assumed there was a rational explanation but it seems not.John R. wrote: 3M's long term (30 day) silver mask (#3312 product number?)is the one you should be using. We used this tape for years in the marine business and I still use it today. It runs anywhere from $12 -$15 per roll at retail. We've left it on well beyond 3M's 30 day stated period in blistering heat and sun here in south Florida and it peels right off cleanly everytime. I don't have a clue why you are having such a difficult time. The blue mask should not be exposed beyond seven days. Time is critical with the blue mask, not nearly so critical with the silver mask. Never use the green mask in the sun or any standard masking tape.
The surface condition of the gelcoat should not make a difference. The worse the condition of the gelcoat the less adhesion you will get in the first place. We've used the silver on all grades of gelcoat over the past and it made no difference at all in the tapes release performance. You won't find a cleaner removing tape then the 3M silver mask.
If you are having trouble removing the remnants of your taping jobs use Naptha to make the job much easier.
John R. wrote:Joe Sankey wrote: Slow Dance looks better now that she has some varnish and the grey is gone. However, she is the fourth CD on which I have had a significant problem with 3M tapes leaving a hard to remove residue after a lot less time that their claims for the tapes. I've used, over the years, the green, the blue, and now the silver. This time the blue went on and a front was coming, so I removed it after 36 hours and prior to the first coat of varnish. 1" blue tracks everywhere.
The silver was then used (its about 2-3 times as expensive, so better, of course) Today I spent all day getting it off. A friend and fellow sailor at the chandler allowed it to stay on his Allied 36 for 6 weeks with no problem. I left it about 10 days and it was a real problem.
I suspect older and porous gelcoat may be the culprit, but I simply don't know. Now that I have a decent base to build upon I'll re-tape with every coat to avoid this hassle. But I'm puzzled, and wonder if anyone has the answer.
Joe Sankey
CD 30 #311 Slow Dance
-
Bruce Janssen
Re: Long-lasting masking tape that isn't
I made the mistake of leaving some 3M blue on all winter, I dampened it with mineral spirits a couple times let it sit for 20 min. and it came off 99% clean.
bvj@rkymtnhi.com
bvj@rkymtnhi.com
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fred
Re: Long-lasting masking tape that isn't
3m now makes a blue plastic tape that is the best I've ever used for varnish work. It holds up well outdoors, and doesn't leak. Gives a nice clean edge every time. It is easy to remove as well.
It is pretty expensive, 3m stuff always is, but worth it. Beware if you buy it, there is not as much on a roll as the regular tapes. You may need one or two rolls more than you're used to buying.
I use this stuff everyday, and it's far better than the green, blue, silver, fineline, and every other tape we've tried.
fred@hotsheet.com
It is pretty expensive, 3m stuff always is, but worth it. Beware if you buy it, there is not as much on a roll as the regular tapes. You may need one or two rolls more than you're used to buying.
I use this stuff everyday, and it's far better than the green, blue, silver, fineline, and every other tape we've tried.
fred@hotsheet.com
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Chris Scheck
Re: Long-lasting masking tape that isn't
Masking tape has caused me more pain than anything on the boat, with the exception of the outboard.
First thing to know, for novices, is never use plain paper tape on any paint job above the waterline. It's junk ... that stuff is for painting your porch.
Second thing, the sooner you peel the tape off, the better. Same day if possible. Once the varnish has dried for a few hours, you can peel the tape off without disturbing the varnish job.
The worst thing you can do with the 3M blue is get it wet. Be careful not to hose anything down near the tape. Once the tape is wet it won't peel off. It just tears into all kinds of shreds. Disaster.
I used blue tape in the head and it's been there for months and it peels right off still. So I think the problem outside may be caused by exposure to the sun and/or dew.
If you are applying 4 or 5 coats of varnish, you may want to pull the tape off after the second or third coat and tape again. If too much varnish builds up on top of the tape, you won't be able to peel it off. Part of the tape will remain trapped under all those coats of varnish. Then you'll be back to scraping with a razor blade.
I keep all my tapes in a big Ziploc bag. It keeps the adhesive from drying out, so it keeps more of its brand-new stickiness. Also keeps dirt from getting on the edge of the roll.
A plastic bondo spreader is a good tool for scraping old tape off. Be very careful if you use a razor blade ... it's too easy to scratch or gouge the glass. Don't trust a helper to use a razor blade ... they could scratch the heck out of your deck and you wouldn't know it until it was too late.
Chris Scheck
RAGTIME CD33 #117
cscheck@aol.com
First thing to know, for novices, is never use plain paper tape on any paint job above the waterline. It's junk ... that stuff is for painting your porch.
Second thing, the sooner you peel the tape off, the better. Same day if possible. Once the varnish has dried for a few hours, you can peel the tape off without disturbing the varnish job.
The worst thing you can do with the 3M blue is get it wet. Be careful not to hose anything down near the tape. Once the tape is wet it won't peel off. It just tears into all kinds of shreds. Disaster.
I used blue tape in the head and it's been there for months and it peels right off still. So I think the problem outside may be caused by exposure to the sun and/or dew.
If you are applying 4 or 5 coats of varnish, you may want to pull the tape off after the second or third coat and tape again. If too much varnish builds up on top of the tape, you won't be able to peel it off. Part of the tape will remain trapped under all those coats of varnish. Then you'll be back to scraping with a razor blade.
I keep all my tapes in a big Ziploc bag. It keeps the adhesive from drying out, so it keeps more of its brand-new stickiness. Also keeps dirt from getting on the edge of the roll.
A plastic bondo spreader is a good tool for scraping old tape off. Be very careful if you use a razor blade ... it's too easy to scratch or gouge the glass. Don't trust a helper to use a razor blade ... they could scratch the heck out of your deck and you wouldn't know it until it was too late.
Chris Scheck
RAGTIME CD33 #117
cscheck@aol.com