CD Typhoon Restoration Project

[Rick Parish]

J - Thanks for the education on laminate repair. I really do appreciate that one. I'm about done sanding and fairing the deck. The hull will take until mid May. Then off to a barn for painting. After that, Wood Working 101. I'm saving your laminate post so I can refer to it when I'm ready to start replacing wood trim. I had something interesting happen while poking around a curious little flaw on the deck paint. I saw a small (1/4) long crack in the deck paint. I used a scraper to try to lift the paint, thinking it was just some loose flaking. After removing about 1 sq in. of paint, I used the pointed corner of the scraper to test the firmness of the fiberglass. I very easily gouged through the gelcoat and into the glass laminate. It was soft in one very limited spot, perhaps 1/8 sq in. Firm glass all around. This got me looking around for more. I have found 6 spots like this. Do you think these very small soft spots are cause for concern? Oh yea, I would love to have the Spartan catalog address or phone number. Thanks. Yes I think I have a motor bracket. Let me describe what I have. There is a deck mounted bracket about 6" long and 1" high that accepts another bracked that is 'L' shaped. One leg of the 'L' slides under the deck mounted bracket. The other leg of the 'L' hangs over the stern and has a 2x6 piece of wood that I assume accepts the motor clamp. Talk to you later.

Jessica - Sounds like we should take your deck and my hull and make one new boat. Your hull problems sound serious, but I would suggest you get a second opinion on the condition of the fiberglass. I'm no expert, but ..... Is fiberglass less expensive than epoxy? I haven't priced fiberglass. It sounds like you are planning to put a new layer or two of laminate over the existing fiberglass. Correct? Have you read anything about how to do that? Advice from friends?
The delamination I referred to in my boat is on the deck, not the hull as you indicated. There is a core in the deck. I've almost completed sanding and fairing the decks in preparation for primer. The delamination is about 4 sq. ft on the aft deck and it's taken over 2 qts of epoxy to fill the void left by the rotted core. Thank you for the idea on how to find voids in the hull/deck joint. It worked. I appreciate your comments about mahogany vs teak. The trim around the companionway is mahogany, so is the bulkhead. The coamings are also mahogany. Sliding hatch and cockpit seats are teak as is toe rail. Diversity. Do you know anything about how to fix a crack in veneer? Looking to the future, I'm going to need some brass deck fittings - cleats, jib track, chocks, traveler. Any ideas on where to look? Most of the retail outlets in Tampa offer only "the new stuff". Older style brass hardware has not exactly jumped off the shelf into my shopping basket. Thanks for your help, back to the sander tomorrow. Rick

Rick,
We have the Spartan catalog and can get the address if you like (I don't have it on me)--they have good stuff, for a price. Do you have a motor mount? We spent a lot of time combing some "used marine goods" stores, there are a couple here in New England. Thing is, most of the items are not any less expensive, even though they are used. I know there is a place down in Florida like that, as a friend has told me, I can also find out details (sorry, not being very specific today).
Yes, I do know about fixing veneer, if you have not solved that yet. First, assess the problem: Is the crack just in the veneer? Can you still use the veneer, or is enough lost or warped so that you will need to replace it? Sometimes it is easiest to just fill the void with filler, varnish the sucker, and live with it. You can disguise discoloration with a brown marker. If the crack does not lie flat and the veneer is still in good shape, you can pry up the edges (carefully!), squoosh wood glue in, and clamp the piece between two flat boards--use wax paper! though when clamping, so as not to glue your piece to something it shouldn't be lued to. If you need to remove the veneer--if it is warped, or some of it is missing, take a razor blade and cut out the crack and the veneer in a diamond shape if the crack does not extend to the edge of the backing, a wedge shape if it reaches one edge (the point where the crack starts and getting wider towards the edge on either side of the crack) and a strip if it extends through the whole piece. Take a piece of veneer, or the whole panel if you can, to the wood store(a hardwood store should have veneer, but also furniture makers etc) and find a matching piece. Remember that varnishing or finishing will darken it, also you can cheat and stain it or whatever--don't worry too much, as the wood will also darken naturally and blend in over time. Cut the new veneer to match the pattern you cut out, smear both glueside pieces with glue leaving NO ungluey wood, clamp between two flat boards and leave for a day or two. It's best to clamp, and apply good even pressure, but also just putting cinderblocks or something on top will do. If youwant to invest some money in glue, get soemthing called "Gorilla Glue", as it holds up much better in marine environments. Remember the wax paper!, and scrape off excess glue& paper with razor, sand and finish.
Fiberglass resin is much less expensive than epoxy or vinylester, but also less water resistant. We are not sure what to do--is it worth investing the $$? As the fiberglass guy said, well you can put diamonds in the side of the hull, sure, it'll be stronger, but is it worth it?

parish6@ibm.net

[Jessica]

J - Thanks for the education on laminate repair. I really do appreciate that one. I'm about done sanding and fairing the deck. The hull will take until mid May. Then off to a barn for painting. After that, Wood Working 101. I'm saving your laminate post so I can refer to it when I'm ready to start replacing wood trim. I had something interesting happen while poking around a curious little flaw on the deck paint. I saw a small (1/4) long crack in the deck paint. I used a scraper to try to lift the paint, thinking it was just some loose flaking. After removing about 1 sq in. of paint, I used the pointed corner of the scraper to test the firmness of the fiberglass. I very easily gouged through the gelcoat and into the glass laminate. It was soft in one very limited spot, perhaps 1/8 sq in. Firm glass all around. This got me looking around for more. I have found 6 spots like this. Do you think these very small soft spots are cause for concern? Oh yea, I would love to have the Spartan catalog address or phone number. Thanks. Yes I think I have a motor bracket. Let me describe what I have. There is a deck mounted bracket about 6" long and 1" high that accepts another bracked that is 'L' shaped. One leg of the 'L' slides under the deck mounted bracket. The other leg of the 'L' hangs over the stern and has a 2x6 piece of wood that I assume accepts the motor clamp. Talk to you later.

Rick,
YES YES YES they are reason for concern. They sound very much like what we guess our boat to have looked like a couple of years ago. Nobody did anything about them, and they pick up water easily, and they spread...
Yours sound quite manageable, and the key thing I can say is keep water out of them. Maybe either removing the soft fiberglass and filling with epoxy filler (Use epoxy or vinylester as both are more water resistant) and then putting on a good barrier coat, or perhaps just relying on a good barrier coat is enough. And keep you eye on them. Make a note of where they are, and next year check them out. Maybe a good analogy is a cavity forming in a tooth?
Will get the Spartan info soon (am at work, info at home), but yes that most definitely is a motor bracket. Does it have a label/maker on it?



jmorton@ensr.com

[Rick]

Thanks, I think. The little soft spots I've found are not much larger than pin head size. I've been gouging them out with the pointed corner of a scraper and filling them with Marine Tex which is a putty. My plan was to prime and paint - not special barrier coat since the problem is above the water line. What da ya think? So far the ones I have found are all above the waterline, but I really have not looked at the condition below the waterline yet - one project at a time. Should I be grinding out these soft spots to create a much larger hole to fill? I haven't been doing much more than removing the soft spot, not taking out any glass beyond the spot. To me, the soft spot looks like an imperfection in the glass caused by foreign matter in the resin - something like a very small wood chip or specks of sawdust. Until just now that was what I thought I was dealing with. You've made my day. Other matters - I'm going to start a new post since we are rapidly running out of indent space by replying to replies of other replies. I'll do that next week and probably call it something original like "restoration part 2" so look for a fresh new post next week. I'll look for a label or manufacturers mark on my o.b. motor bracket. Also, do you need patterns of all the wood trim? I have the following - stem head, toe rail, stern rail, hatch, hatch runners, companionway slide frame (horizontal rails that hold the wash boards in place), wash boards, cockpit coamings (both sides and aft near main sheet cam cleat) and those funny bull nose pieces that mount to the deck house at the forward end of the coamings. Let me know if you need all the above or just certain pieces.

J - Thanks for the education on laminate repair. I really do appreciate that one. I'm about done sanding and fairing the deck. The hull will take until mid May. Then off to a barn for painting. After that, Wood Working 101. I'm saving your laminate post so I can refer to it when I'm ready to start replacing wood trim. I had something interesting happen while poking around a curious little flaw on the deck paint. I saw a small (1/4) long crack in the deck paint. I used a scraper to try to lift the paint, thinking it was just some loose flaking. After removing about 1 sq in. of paint, I used the pointed corner of the scraper to test the firmness of the fiberglass. I very easily gouged through the gelcoat and into the glass laminate. It was soft in one very limited spot, perhaps 1/8 sq in. Firm glass all around. This got me looking around for more. I have found 6 spots like this. Do you think these very small soft spots are cause for concern? Oh yea, I would love to have the Spartan catalog address or phone number. Thanks. Yes I think I have a motor bracket. Let me describe what I have. There is a deck mounted bracket about 6" long and 1" high that accepts another bracked that is 'L' shaped. One leg of the 'L' slides under the deck mounted bracket. The other leg of the 'L' hangs over the stern and has a 2x6 piece of wood that I assume accepts the motor clamp. Talk to you later.

Rick,
YES YES YES they are reason for concern. They sound very much like what we guess our boat to have looked like a couple of years ago. Nobody did anything about them, and they pick up water easily, and they spread...
Yours sound quite manageable, and the key thing I can say is keep water out of them. Maybe either removing the soft fiberglass and filling with epoxy filler (Use epoxy or vinylester as both are more water resistant) and then putting on a good barrier coat, or perhaps just relying on a good barrier coat is enough. And keep you eye on them. Make a note of where they are, and next year check them out. Maybe a good analogy is a cavity forming in a tooth?
Will get the Spartan info soon (am at work, info at home), but yes that most definitely is a motor bracket. Does it have a label/maker on it?

parish6@ibm.net

[Ferd Moyse III]

Rick...will try to answer your questions re toe rail. Not difficult to bend the 3/8 teak...but I would be concerned over much more thickness. The only real difficulty is toward the bow when the curves become compound, but if I can do it (with patience) anybody can! Yes screws...had I been fooling with my saltwater boat I would have used nuts & bolts, but frankly this is QUITE a substantial feeling toerail with absolutely no movement. I also found that at places (toward bow and stern) the deck layup was VERY thick and although I was 3/4" below the edge, I drilled pilot holes into solid glass....nuts would have been impossible. Yes, I used Briteside Poly...Interlux....its on sale at BOAT/US now ($17 a qt)...I used the same Hattaras White you speak of for deck & cockpit. Count on three coats, three quarts...you'll have lots left over but two won't do the deck/cockpit...I used the same stuff in dark green for hull...lookds great but I should have prepared a little more as the dark shows EVERY imperfection...but only thinks I'd notice!



seawolf@tecinfo.com

[Bob]

Ferd,
How did you apply the paint to the topsides of your boat. Did you roll and feather with a brush or did you spray it? What about thinning it down too? I have a 1971 Typhoon that needs some fill work on the crazing on the deck and hull and then an awlgrip or such job. This will be a job that I will tackle within the year but just trying to think ahead. Was just wondering about the application that you used.
Bob

Rick...will try to answer your questions re toe rail. Not difficult to bend the 3/8 teak...but I would be concerned over much more thickness. The only real difficulty is toward the bow when the curves become compound, but if I can do it (with patience) anybody can! Yes screws...had I been fooling with my saltwater boat I would have used nuts & bolts, but frankly this is QUITE a substantial feeling toerail with absolutely no movement. I also found that at places (toward bow and stern) the deck layup was VERY thick and although I was 3/4" below the edge, I drilled pilot holes into solid glass....nuts would have been impossible. Yes, I used Briteside Poly...Interlux....its on sale at BOAT/US now ($17 a qt)...I used the same Hattaras White you speak of for deck & cockpit. Count on three coats, three quarts...you'll have lots left over but two won't do the deck/cockpit...I used the same stuff in dark green for hull...lookds great but I should have prepared a little more as the dark shows EVERY imperfection...but only thinks I'd notice!

BundyR@aol.com

[Eliot Daley]

Rick
I have ordered "Spartan" bronze turnbuckles from Traditional Marine Outfitters. They also carry many other bronze hardware items. I think that they are from Maine or NovaScotia. I don't really know how to get in touch with them now. You may want to try "Spartan". There have been some other postings for harware and such that you may want to search for. It has been fun reading about your progress. Gives me an idea of what I am in for in eventually. Good luck with it.
Bob

Jessica - Sounds like we should take your deck and my hull and make one new boat. Your hull problems sound serious, but I would suggest you get a second opinion on the condition of the fiberglass. I'm no expert, but ..... Is fiberglass less expensive than epoxy? I haven't priced fiberglass. It sounds like you are planning to put a new layer or two of laminate over the existing fiberglass. Correct? Have you read anything about how to do that? Advice from friends?
The delamination I referre

EliotDaley@AOL.com