95% jib on a CD28

[Rockinar]

I have only used what appears to be about a 115% jib/genoa on my CD28. I have another sail that looks like a 95%. Its pretty small. Should I run the jibsheets inside the shrouds or outside the shrouds like the 115%?

[casampson]

I used to run the sheets outside the shrouds on my CD 25, because it seemed to be the natural thing to do. However, I had a problem with the jib -- which is about the same size as yours -- shaking in heavy wind. Some forum members recommended running the sheets inside the shrouds. So I did, and the jib stopped shaking.

[fmueller]

Do you have tracks on your coach roof ? If yes, maybe those are for a small (100% or less ) jib ? On most of the smaller CDs the coach roof tracks if present were for a "working" jib.

My 27 has OEM coach roof tracks and I had a small dacron tri-radial jib made by Quantum/Bristol last summer. The sheets run thru blocks on the toe rail tracks and then up to blocks on the coachroof tracks. This year has been unusually windy on Narragansett Bay and I am really liking having that jib. I've yet to break out the genny - I just feel so much confidence with this smaller sail now. Most of the time, even in heavy air, I only use the winches as snubbers coming about if I've time the the tailing of the sheet well, then just wrap the sheet in the jaws to secure it. Makes single handing much more practical not having to drag long sheets around the standing rigging and figure out how to grind and sail at the same time.

In 20+ knots true with one one reef in the main and that little jib flying the boat just scoots ... I can do 30ish degrees apparent, 45 true, and plough forward at nearly hull speed without the rail being under, and no flogging. I did not have any reefing aids added to the luff to keep a clean entry at the leading edge. It's just great, in real wind it pulls like a little mule. It's been a revelation. If I come down to the club and there are whitecaps all over the place, my only worry is getting off and back on my slip. I'd rather be a little slower in light air but SO much more in control in the rough stuff, and my VMG upwind in light air might be the same anyway with better pointing.

cheers

Fred

[kerrydeare]

I have ... another sail that looks like a 95%. Its pretty small. Should I run the jibsheets inside the shrouds or outside the shrouds like the 115%?

First, do you have a furling system, or do you use hank-on sails?

The sail you describe may have been the original club-footed jib that shipped with the CD 28. You will know the club sail because it was fitted with rope lacing near the bottom of the luff. If you have a furler this is moot because the smaller sail will have been modified from the original hank-on configuration.

The 28 had no "inside" jib tracks or cabin-top tracks other than a few fittings for the club boom. This means you must run the sheets outside the shrouds, otherwise you will have nothing but chafed rigging.

[Rockinar]

I have ... another sail that looks like a 95%. Its pretty small. Should I run the jibsheets inside the shrouds or outside the shrouds like the 115%?

First, do you have a furling system, or do you use hank-on sails?

The sail you describe may have been the original club-footed jib that shipped with the CD 28. You will know the club sail because it was fitted with rope lacing near the bottom of the luff. If you have a furler this is moot because the smaller sail will have been modified from the original hank-on configuration.

The 28 had no "inside" jib tracks or cabin-top tracks other than a few fittings for the club boom. This means you must run the sheets outside the shrouds, otherwise you will have nothing but chafed rigging.

I had roller furling and just switched to hank on. The sail in question is the original 95% for the club footed jib (I removed self tacking club foot setup because the boat is stupid easy to tack, it's not needed and the club thing just takes up deck space). Someone gave me a hank on sail thats the same size as the original club jib and I was going to give it a try. Was not sure to run sheets for the small sail outside or inside the shrouds.

[kerrydeare]

... Someone gave me a hank on sail thats the same size as the original club jib and I was going to give it a try. Was not sure to run sheets for the small sail outside or inside the shrouds.

I had the same boat with hank-on sails for quite a while, and on occasion used the club jib with sheets. There are a number of issues with this idea, but two primary problems. Unless you change hardware, there is no place to tack the sail other than the rail. If you run the sheets inside the shrouds, you will inevitably have chafe. No way around it. If you run the sheets outside, there is no was to get sufficiently "close-winded" when trying to go to weather. That's why the original club boom, as poor as it was, made sense.

What can be done to improve the club boom (if you still have it) is to improve the sheeting system using some sort of track as is done on other CD models, This prevents the sail from either falling off near the head, or being stalled near the foot. Another tactic that may be worth looking at is using snatch blocks where the old club boom sheets were located. I never actually tried this because I never removed the boom. You will then need to determine the best route to your winches that allows the sheets a fair lead.

Believe me, I tried almost all possible combinations over the years and ended up being satisfied with "good enough."

[Rockinar]

... Someone gave me a hank on sail thats the same size as the original club jib and I was going to give it a try. Was not sure to run sheets for the small sail outside or inside the shrouds.

I had the same boat with hank-on sails for quite a while, and on occasion used the club jib with sheets. There are a number of issues with this idea, but two primary problems. Unless you change hardware, there is no place to tack the sail other than the rail. If you run the sheets inside the shrouds, you will inevitably have chafe. No way around it. If you run the sheets outside, there is no was to get sufficiently "close-winded" when trying to go to weather. That's why the original club boom, as poor as it was, made sense.

What can be done to improve the club boom (if you still have it) is to improve the sheeting system using some sort of track as is done on other CD models, This prevents the sail from either falling off near the head, or being stalled near the foot. Another tactic that may be worth looking at is using snatch blocks where the old club boom sheets were located. I never actually tried this because I never removed the boom. You will then need to determine the best route to your winches that allows the sheets a fair lead.

Believe me, I tried almost all possible combinations over the years and ended up being satisfied with "good enough."

So basically I have to use the 115% and and cant use anything smaller unless I use the club footed boom?

[mgphl52]

... Someone gave me a hank on sail thats the same size as the original club jib and I was going to give it a try. Was not sure to run sheets for the small sail outside or inside the shrouds.

I had the same boat with hank-on sails for quite a while, and on occasion used the club jib with sheets. There are a number of issues with this idea, but two primary problems. Unless you change hardware, there is no place to tack the sail other than the rail. If you run the sheets inside the shrouds, you will inevitably have chafe. No way around it. If you run the sheets outside, there is no was to get sufficiently "close-winded" when trying to go to weather. That's why the original club boom, as poor as it was, made sense.

What can be done to improve the club boom (if you still have it) is to improve the sheeting system using some sort of track as is done on other CD models, This prevents the sail from either falling off near the head, or being stalled near the foot. Another tactic that may be worth looking at is using snatch blocks where the old club boom sheets were located. I never actually tried this because I never removed the boom. You will then need to determine the best route to your winches that allows the sheets a fair lead.

Believe me, I tried almost all possible combinations over the years and ended up being satisfied with "good enough."

So basically I have to use the 115% and and cant use anything smaller unless I use the club footed boom?

In some rather nasty snot when we HAD to get from point A to point B... I sailed KAYLA (CD28) with a triple reef on the main and less than 50% of the roller furled jib. In order to point better (ie: make progress on tacks...) I would use both jib sheets to trim the head sail so the clew was inside the shrouds. Yes, the sheets were ran outside and I know that'll cause chafe... but for what we needed it worked great!

[kerrydeare]

... So basically I have to use the 115% and and cant use anything smaller unless I use the club footed boom?

In my experience the club-footed jib with 2 or more reefs in the main is a very handy and capable setup for this design, but I don't know if that's exactly what you are asking.

'I have used and still own (see existing classifieds on this board) a number 5 jib and a storm jib for the CD28 design. Both sails were designed to tack to the rail via a single block located just aft the aft lower shroud. This block was separate from the standard track where other fairleads and padeyes were mounted.

So yes, it is indeed possible to use smaller sails and tack them to the rail with the sheets running outside the rig. However as mentioned earlier these small jibs will not point the way larger sails can on the boat (say 110% or number 3 and larger). I think it realistic to say that in conditions where these sails are needed, a boat like the CD28 is not going to do that well going to weather when compared to larger boats or to designs specifically built for that purpose, especially when sailing short-handed

I suspect that some sailors may not agree with this suggestion, and I don't want to suggest that the CD28 cannot handle heavy air going uphill. But over the course of almost 40 years with this boat, I've realized many times that one has to take design factors into consideration and make practical choices in certain tactical situations. It's also important to note that it's one thing to sail upwind in heavy air in protected waters (bays, rivers, and lakes) and entirely a separate thing to handle such winds and seas offshore in open waters.

[fmueller]

just a question ... couldn't tracks be added to the coach roof of a 28 ...

also Michael: I've tried the same thing with my big jib which has a high cut clew and and have been able to use the windward sheet as an in-hauler just a little bit. The thing is, of course, any big jib rolled in enough to clear the leeward rigging is really not going to have much shape left, and a baseball bat of rolled Dacron for a leading edge, where as a proper small jib, for those of us who have been using large roller reefing jibs for a generation or more (I count myself), is a revelation in heavier wind. Much more than I expected.

Fred