Options for Removing Perkins 4108 from Cape Dory 36

[Jeff Peterson]

Our Perkins 4108 is leaking oil from the rear seal, front seal, and engine pan. We asked the yard for an estimate of costs. They want to get the engine out of the boat to do the work but report that they need to take the engine apart to get it out of the compartment and companionway....which they estimate to be ballpark about $3,000 for removal and $1,500 to reinstall...not counting the actual engine work.

I talked with folks at Robinhood who report that they have used a "C" hook device about 18 inches high and 18 inches deep to get the engine out of the boat...but do not have a picture of this thing...This sounds like a more economical option.

Does anyone have experience...good or bad...getting the 4108 out of a 36...(its a 1983)? Or, does anyone have a photo or more info on design of a "C" hook that I could share with the yard? (Note that the yard is pretty firm that they can't do the work inside the boat...I have seen other posts on the Board that indicate that the engine does come out of the compartment...so not sure why our Perkins will not slide out)

Good news is that the engine bed seems to be ok...

Thanks

[moctrams]

Talk to John Little at Flag Harbor in St. Leonard, MD. He may be very helpful.

http://flagharbor.com/marine.html

[John Ring]

The Perkins 4.108 comes out of a CD36 easily, just have to plan a little. I just did mine. Lifting it out through the companion way looks tight, but should go, maybe have to remove the alternator & other bits to help it fit through. If you have it out, I'd consider selling the Perkins and replacing it with a Volvo D2-40 or a short Yanmar so you can actually access the stuffing box in the future. The old Perkins is just too big physically to be in that little space. Another option is to keep the Perkins, and just do the work with the engine in the cabin where there is more workspace.

Here's how I did mine. Link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uk6uejgXHSI

John

[Doug Jesseman]

Jeff, I removed my Perkins 4107 from my CD36 two years ago. I have the "C" bracket that you need if you want it. I removed the engine myself with a come along attached to an overhead beam. I own hull #5 and Cape Dorys have different internal wood panels depending on the year it was manufactured. I had to cut an additional "door" below the engine compartment hatch to remove the engine. I installed a hinge to that which make changing engine oil easier anyway. Probably the worst part was the rusted exhaust pipe. Nothing a saws all didn't fix and the rusted pipe to the cast iron manifold.....
Hansen Marine, in Marblehead, Mass, rebuilt the engine and she has been flawless ever since. Perkins makes a great diesel engine, they really are tough.
It would be a great time to rebuild the tranny and replace the flex coupling and repack the thru hull.
Good Luck Doug.

[bottomscraper]

On Mahalo the Perkins was removed without much disassembling. The alternator came off along with the Seafrost compressor. The boat yard used a small crane. We decided to sat goodbye to Mr Leaky last season and replaced with a Beta 38. We are very happy with our new engine. Mahalo is a 1990 vintage so there may be some differences.

Here is a picture of the new Beta 38.

IMG_3505.JPG

[David van den Burgh]

Rich,

Not to hijack the thread, but did the yard remove the steel engine bed and build those foundations, or are the foundations original?

David

[John Stone]

I removed the Perkins 4-108 from the Far Reach. I unbolted everthing--alternator and seafrost compressor, electrical connectors, hoses, etc. We were on the hard. I placed two 2x4s next to one another on edge across the wood rails that support the sliding companionway hatch, padded with carpet. I bolted a small chain to the rings (attachment points) already on the engine. With one person to help, I then used a come-along connected to the 2x4s and the chain on the engine, to lift the it off its mounts. Then we pulled the engine forward sliding the 2x4s along the hatch rails. We then lowered It onto the cabin sole which I padded with carpet and a moving blanket. Next I rented a little hydronic hoist/ basket crane with enough range to lower the hook down over the companion way and simply lifted the engine out of the boat. It was along time ago but I recall it was straight forward and completed without the slightest bit of drama. I can definitely state the engine did not require dissassembly other than remove the aforementioned compressor and alternator.

[bottomscraper]

Rich,

Not to hijack the thread, but did the yard remove the steel engine bed and build those foundations, or are the foundations original?

David

Original beds were rusty steel. Those were yard built. Here is a better picture, note that they were trimmed down in a few places before the engine was installed.

IMG_3437.JPG

[David van den Burgh]

Thanks, Rich, for the picture. Since Jeff got several great replies already about how to approach removing his engine, I'll stray just a bit more from the original post to say that's an interesting approach to the engine foundations. What did they use to for the beds? I can see they're tabbed to the hull, but what is the structural member? That approach certainly looks a lot simpler than the foundations I constructed for my little Westerbeke 20B Two that's going in my Alberg 30.

[bottomscraper]

What did they use to for the beds? I can see they're tabbed to the hull, but what is the structural member?

IIRC they used G10 FRP and epoxy. It is nice that the engine mounts can be through bolted.

[Jeff Peterson]

Thanks to everyone for all the great input. I will respond with how this works out.

[John Nuttall]

Thanks to everyone for all the great input. I will respond with how this works out.

Hi Jeff,
How did the engine removal go ?
John

[John Nuttall]

Hi John Ring,
Great video !
I have a couple of questions:
How many hours did it take you to get the engine out ? Put in back in ?
Is that I-beam aluminum ?
Best
John Nuttall
CD36 #103 '84
Aimless
Oriental,NC

[John Ring]

...How many hours did it take you to get the engine out ? Put in back in ?
Is that I-beam aluminum ?
Best
John Nuttall
CD36 #103 '84
Aimless
Oriental,NC

John,

The actual lifting/setting the engine takes maybe 1 hour. More time is spent disconnecting fuel lines, engine mounts, exhaust, electrical, and the coupling. This takes most of a day if you can fit your body in the space behind the engine to disconnect things. The exhaust hose, muffler, and exhaust pipes have to come off at the manifold first too. Take your time & make sure you got everything before you lift, and check often with a flashlight as you lift to be sure you got everything. I used zip ties to hold the voltage regulator, fuel lines, and exhaust water lines tight to the engine during the lift.

The reverse is the same, about an hour to set the motor down, and about a day to reconnect everything. But allow additional time now to re-align the coupling to the shaft.

Once the fuel in/out are disconnected, do your best to keep fuel from leaking out of the hoses and immediately connect the engine side's fuel in/out with a hose barb to keep air out of the system. I was able to reinstall the Perkins and carefully reconnect the fuel lines without letting enough air into the system to require bleeding the high pressure side. Once reconnected, the old Perkins fired right up & ran great!

I took advantage of the engine's absence over the winter to cut the shaft down to 18" to center a new MaxProp in the aperture, got rid of the drive saver and put a new shorter split head coupling on to free up space to service the stuffing box, and replaced the old stuffing box hose & clamps - all great options while the engine is out.

And yes, the I beam is aluminum. I got it from McMaster.com (4"x6"x3/8, six feet long).

Good luck!
John Ring

[Matt Cawthorne]

I had my engine pulled last year. While it was out I decided to grind away a little of the fiberglass that was holding down the engine mounting frame. On one side of the engine the longitudnal tube that was glassed into the hull was.....gone. That is right, the vertical webs that stuck through the fiberglass ended in a heap of corrosion debris. I have pictures, but am having problems at the moment adding them here. If your engine is out, I highly recommend you grind away the fiberglass and get a look.

I made a new frame, but couldn't find a local galvanizer who was interested in a small job. In the end it just got painted with cold galvanizing before going back in. I did weld the tubes all shut after giving them the linseed oil treatment and filling them with argon.

After the engine was rebuilt, I test drove it for about 6-7 hours. I am guessing that the amount leaked before the rebuild would have been a pint and a half over that amount of time. After the rebuild and the 6-7 hour run there were perhaps 3 drops of oil in the bilge and I think that is oil that I spilled when filling the transmission. This is like defying the law of gravity. I am not quite sure of how a British engine works when it can't leak.