Bilge pump blues

[adamganz]

Throwing all of my bilge pump musings aside for the moment, after recognizing I've burned three weekends pulling things apart and putting them back together with no success (and no sailing), I'm going to simplify the solution until winter. Replace the auto bilge pump with a slightly more powerful model, and repack the stuffing box. The stuffing box job worries me somewhat as I'll be doing it in the water, albeit with a friend who has done this before.

[mashenden]

Sounds like a good idea. In a past response or two I was confused as to what you had. I thought you had a Jabsco pump, but that was another poster. Sorry for the confusion.

I would not rely on any brand pump with an integral float switch. The switches get hair, oil, etc that build up on the float and they stop working as they should.

I recommend a pump with a separate switch. I have Jabsco Hydro Air switches but also a good electronic switch would be my second consideration... In short, something that is far less likely to gunk up. Install with water tight butt connectors (3M or Ankor) and/or good quality shrink tubing (something with glue built in to stop water). Wire the bilge switches according to the wiring diagram that comes with the switch. Then if you also want the means to manually run them, add switching through a fused switch to the red wire on the pump. I like to wire bilge pumps directly to the battery (I prefer no fuse on the bilge pumps, despite ABYCs rules). If you have 2 battery banks, then one pump system is wired to one battery and the other pump is wired to the second battery bank.

In my preferred design I have a smaller pump that is for daily water pumping, and a larger pump that is set up higher either in a stackable arrangement or somewhere higher in the bilge where it would never get wet unless the primary fails (this ensures that the back up remains in good condition).

[mgphl52]

The stuffing box job worries me somewhat as I'll be doing it in the water, albeit with a friend who has done this before.

Maybe wrap a yard-trash bag around the prop shaft to help reduce the volume of water.

[CD_Sailor]

... there seems to be some difference of opinion on the value of an automatic bilge pump. The fact that that debate exists makes me feel better about my conviction that the current known options (at least known to me) may be lacking ... ...

The following is of course just a coincidence regarding timing, but I'll pass along the information in any case.

Last Monday morning I went down to the boat intending to spend two days, do a few projects in preparation for a summer trip, and even get in some sailing on Barnegat Bay (NJ). All of this was accomplished.

Our boatyard features (among other things) a small protected pond with perhaps 10 or so vessels in slips. When I arrived I heard one of the workers running one of our larger tow/utility boats and the sound was definitely of a vessel under a heavy strain. Then I saw that the tow was dragging a mostly submerged 18 foot Marshall cat from the pond around to the work slip. The water in this area is mostly 5 feet or less, so despite the fact that the Marshall was submergaed, part of the structure was still visible (including of course the mast). An unusual sight for sure.

Eventually the cat made it to the work slip where the travel lift could do its job and haul the boat. This was done in stages to allow the water to drain prior to the haul. When the boat was finally hauled we found that the boat, not usually well attended to by the owner, had suffered a failure on the automatic bilge system. Therre were other issues, including most likely clogged scuppers (the cockpits on these designs are substantial), etc.

There were probably more than a few things wrong that allowed this to happen, but the owner's reliance on his automatic bilge pump was a strong contributor. Just sayin'.

[mashenden]

... there seems to be some difference of opinion on the value of an automatic bilge pump. The fact that that debate exists makes me feel better about my conviction that the current known options (at least known to me) may be lacking ... ...

The following is of course just a coincidence regarding timing, but I'll pass along the information in any case.

Last Monday morning I went down to the boat intending to spend two days, do a few projects in preparation for a summer trip, and even get in some sailing on Barnegat Bay (NJ). All of this was accomplished.

Our boatyard features (among other things) a small protected pond with perhaps 10 or so vessels in slips. When I arrived I heard one of the workers running one of our larger tow/utility boats and the sound was definitely of a vessel under a heavy strain. Then I saw that the tow was dragging a mostly submerged 18 foot Marshall cat from the pond around to the work slip. The water in this area is mostly 5 feet or less, so despite the fact that the Marshall was submergaed, part of the structure was still visible (including of course the mast). An unusual sight for sure.

Eventually the cat made it to the work slip where the travel lift could do its job and haul the boat. This was done in stages to allow the water to drain prior to the haul. When the boat was finally hauled we found that the boat, not usually well attended to by the owner, had suffered a failure on the automatic bilge system. Therre were other issues, including most likely clogged scuppers (the cockpits on these designs are substantial), etc.

There were probably more than a few things wrong that allowed this to happen, but the owner's reliance on his automatic bilge pump was a strong contributor. Just sayin'.

If checking your boat daily is not feasible, is there any other option other than an automatic system? Preferable something that is designed with redundancy (two systems wired to separate batteries, ideally without mechanical float switches - I love my Hydro Air switches).

[CD_Sailor]

... If checking your boat daily is not feasible, is there any other option other than an automatic system? ...

I know it sounds like a "non-answer" but the solution is to work assiduously to eliminate every possible leak, secure every hole in the boat, check every hose that may offend, and so on ad infinitum. This level of effort is ongoing, difficult, costly, and even perhaps impossible to achieve. But that's just where it is.

Incidentally I am not at the same time saying that automatic bilge pump systems should be avoided. I'm instead saying that they should be suspect and investigated at every opportunity.

[mashenden]

... If checking your boat daily is not feasible, is there any other option other than an automatic system? ...

I know it sounds like a "non-answer" but the solution is to work assiduously to eliminate every possible leak, secure every hole in the boat, check every hose that may offend, and so on ad infinitum. This level of effort is ongoing, difficult, costly, and even perhaps impossible to achieve. But that's just where it is.

Incidentally I am not at the same time saying that automatic bilge pump systems should be avoided. I'm instead saying that they should be suspect and investigated at every opportunity.

Agreed. Some advocate only having a manually operated bilge pump - mind blown!! . I can only assume they are live aboards or are aboard very regularly.

[Martinhilldpo]

2 thoughts

1 Automatic switches are a must. I would rather have a dead battery than a sunken boat. I am sure my insurance wouldnt pay out if there was not an automatic bilge pump in service. If you prefer to switch to manual when you are on board of course that is your prerogative.

2 If the water running back in to the bilge when the pump stops is enough to trigger the pump again (cycling), clearly there is too much water running back in to what must be a small bilge. In order to fix this you need to reduce the volume of water flowing back when the pump stops. Flapper valves are not bomb proof. I suggest 2 possibilities, either re-route your hose to have an anti siphon bend as close as possible to the pump or reduce the diameter of the hose.

[mgphl52]

reduce the diameter of the hose.

Very bad idea... restricting the output will cause premature pump failure.