Dock lines

[Neil Gordon]

Does the eye go ashore or on deck?

[tjr818]

That depends. Tiller or Wheel? Locked prop or free turning?
Wee have our own slip so we have two of the dock lines with the eyes on deck, this keeps us in the same position each time. We do the same with the spring lines. We also have two other lines on board that can be used either way, if needed, depending on the mood of the skipper.

[Jim Walsh]

Control of the line should always be at the vessel, hence the eye goes ashore. That being said I have the dock lines in my slip cleated on the floating dock and the eyes are on my vessel since it is fastest and most convenient for a singlehander such as myself. My slip dock lines are never removed for use elsewhere.

[Paul Clayton]

I'm on a fixed dock. Our dockmaster asks that, if we dock bow in, we cleat the bow lines to the dock so he can easily make adjustments as water rises and falls. The stern lines loop over pilings and cleat to the boat. Reverse that for docking stern in. We have a lot of wind tide and at low water, boats can end up hanging on the lines if they are set up tight enough to keep the boat off the dock at high water.

[tjr818]

I'm on a fixed dock...boats can end up hanging on the lines if they are set up tight enough to keep the boat off the dock at high water.

We are so lucky, our docks float so we do not have to adjust or dock lines, however, sometimes we walk down the ramps to our boat, sometimes we have to walk up hill.

[Jim Cornwell]

I have to agree with Paul Clayton's dockmaster. But Yankee's docklines have served for seven seasons now and have chafed some, despite chafing gear, making replacement before any big storms this season seem like a prudent thing to do. Apart from proving to myself that I can still make a decent eye splice, why make ANY eyes, I'm wondering - why not just tie to the outer pilings (whether at bow or stern) and belay to cleats everywhere else? Wouldn't that provide the greatest flexibility for adjustment?

On the subject of chafed docklines, sort of, anybody ever used old firehose for chafing gear?

[winthrop fisher]

HI,

I have seen people do it both ways and i have had boats up to 41.

For a long time i bought lines without the eyes, it makes it easyer for people with small boats.

but its up to you.
Winthrop

[Neil Gordon]

>>But Yankee's docklines have served for seven seasons now and have chafed some, despite chafing gear, making replacement before any big storms this season seem like a prudent thing to do.<<

I get a lot of free dock lines that way, as most that I find are frayed at or near the eye. I tend to lose about 5' in the process of cutting off the frayed portion and splicing in a new eye.

>>Apart from proving to myself that I can still make a decent eye splice, why make ANY eyes, ...<<

Are you splicing 3-strand or braid? Splicing 3-strand is a joy to me; braided rope on the other hand is never fun to splice. That would heavily influence my decision.

>>... why not just tie to the outer pilings (whether at bow or stern) and belay to cleats everywhere else?<<

A line without an eye could be adjusted from either end. Can someone explain why that might be a problem?

>>On the subject of chafed docklines, sort of, anybody ever used old firehose for chafing gear?

All the time... the inner, rubber-backed section. I use seine twine, one end permanently attached to the chafing gear, to attach to the dock line and keep it in place, and put it where I need it. It all comes off before I leave the dock. I find all sorts of uses for the outer hose section, too.

[Jim Cornwell]

Neil: I use three-strand nylon and also find splicing an eye to be a satisfying task. Have also had some success with splicing double braid, using the Brian Toss snare fid, but three-strand nylon performs just right and is the right thing for handsome classic sailboats like ours. If no eyes, a proper whipping at each end of a dockline is a joyful thing to do, too! And pleases the gods.

I have obtained some cast-off fire hose, 1-1/2" I think, and was thinking of using it to protect permanent stern lines, made fast at those outer pilings where some of my worst chafe has occurred in the past. I'm interested that the drill is to separate inner and outer layers of the hose. I'll cut off a length and experiment with it. Thanks for the comment. Jim.

[Sea Hunt Video]

Jim and Neil:

I use fire hose as chafing gear also. A friend is with Miami-Dade Fire and they switch out their "old" hoses every 2-3 years of sooner. They do not recycle their hoses but trash dump them for safety and quality control. "Old" to them is almost new to me.

Neil, I use the outer layer of the hose, not the inner rubber backed layer. I was told the outer layer is more durable and, should it start rubbing back and forth in a blow, the rubber layer may become hot and wear more quickly. It has worked very well on my mooring pendants over the past several years.

[swhfire21]

My only concern with using fire hose is that it's impervious to water. I've read several Boas US articles were they believe waterproof chafing gear can lead to premature failure during a storm as the dry rope inside overheats from repeated stretching cycles. I usually use old pant legs from denim jeans.

[Jim Cornwell]

That's exactly my concern about fire hose, Steve. Chafing gear needs to stay cool in the heat of battle. But the outer jacket, unlike commercially prepared chafing protectives, is way oversized and would let in lots of water. And it's tough as nails. Any other thoughts on this from anyone?

[Neil Gordon]

That's exactly my concern about fire hose, Steve. Chafing gear needs to stay cool in the heat of battle. But the outer jacket, unlike commercially prepared chafing protectives, is way oversized and would let in lots of water. And it's tough as nails. Any other thoughts on this from anyone?

I don't disagree but with be interested in comparative tests. "Tough as nails" fire hose seems more likely to chafe the very line it's intended to protect, as the line stretches inside the chafe gear.

In conditions that might give rise to heat buildup and potential failure, I'd be inclined to double up my lines, perhaps one wrapped with the outer jacket, the other with the inner core.

[Klem]

A couple of thoughts on this.

Chafe happens because the line moves across a surface. To eliminate chafe, you need to minimize movement or make the pressure between the fairlead and the line low. Minimizing movement means having as little line between the cleat and the fairlead as possible. You can also use a less stretchy line but that has issues in terms of shock loading. To decrease the pressure, you want to radius out all of the corners.

We do use some firehose as chafe gear and it works well. We use the outer jacket of double jacket hose as the inner jacket has rubber on it which has been shown to prevent cooling of the line and therefore lead to heat related failure.

Most often, I use tubular webbing slid over lines. 2" webbing will fit most line sizes and 1" will fit small lines.

In permanent applications, I now use a show piece of dyneema over the chafe point which is then cow hitched into the nylon. The dyneema is incredibly chafe resistant and the nylon gives the stretch. You can also do this with chain shackled to a spliced thimble in the nylon but you would only really want to do that on the dock end due to the damage from chain.

As to the original question about where does the eye go, I think it depends. I base it on where the person adjusting the line will be standing. When I have worked on larger commercial vessels, the lines are thrown onto the pier with eyes in the end so that the deck crew adjusts them on board the vessel. If I am docking solo, I put the eyes on the boat and then step off and adjust the lines on the dock cleats.

[Dick Villamil]

I keep my typhoon on an "L" dock and run two lines through the bow chocks - one to each post on the dock. The spliced eyes are on the bow cleat. The stern line goes through the stern chock to a post on the dock the spliced eye on the stern cleat. That way I can adjust the lines as needed without getting on the boat. Has been like this for 6 years and through some pretty awful storms. I double the lines in advance of a storm and use oversize fenders attached to the dock.