Replacing Typhoon Seacocks

[Sea Hunt Video]

I am a rookie and admittedly know very little about this issue. I did own a 1977 Ty Weekender for two (2) years. When I acquired the Ty it did not have seacocks for the cockpit drains.

I replaced the hose configuration and shortened the length of the hose. The PO had it going in a 360 degree loop over each drain. This was OK but it allowed water to back up in the cockpit after a heavy rain. After reconfiguring very similar to the photo "Markst95" posted the water backing up in the cockpit was eliminated.

Here is my question for the experts on this board:

What is the benefit of a seacock for a cockpit drain hose that is supposed to be ALWAYS open

I understand the benefits of a quality bronze seacock/backing plate, etc., for a hose that is only infrequently used (marine head raw water intake; sink drain hose, etc.) - the seacock is almost always in the "closed" position and only opened for a specific function. If the hose ruptures, breaks, cracks, etc., the closed bronze seacock prevents water from coming in via the thru hull fitting. But I do not understand the purpose/benefit of a seacock for a cockpit drain hose.

From my limited knowledge and understanding it seems like if something is going to fail it will be the hose not the bronze seacock fitting. If the hose cracks and water seeps in, duct tape, "Rescue Tape" or similar can make a temporary fix if you are onboard. If not onboard the seacock does no good because it is supposed to be left open 24/7/365 - at least that is my understanding.

If the hose somehow "falls off" the bronze thru hull, and you are onboard you can either reattach the hose or plug the thru hull with a cork, a wood plug or one of those orange/red rubber plugs (I have one of these on board S/V Bali Ha'i, plus several corks and wood plugs).

So, what am I not understanding here Some people on this board whom I know are very bright and very experienced are saying it is dangerous to not have a seacock on a cockpit drain hose What does the seacock provide that I am not understanding

I have actually toyed with the idea of removing the two (2) Spartan bronze seacocks on S/V Bali Ha'i that are attached to the two cockpit drain hoses. The starboard side seacock works well. The port side seacock is again "frozen" in the open position. I "unfroze" it months ago but because I do not close it the seacock has managed to once again freeze in the open position.

Is the idea of removing the two (2) cockpit drain hose seacocks yet another one of my crazy ideas.

[Oswego John]

Robert,

You mention that one of your sea cocks has frozen up again. I think that I remember that you mentioned that you had them lapped recently.

I'm curious if you treated the cores with marine grease. Several years ago someone on the board recommended using NAPA red grease. I tried it and it does the job real well.

Good luck,
O J

[Sea Hunt Video]

OJ:

I did not lap the sea cocks. I decided I would wait until haul out this summer. Probably another one of many mistakes. When deciding not to lap the sea cocks is when I came up with the crazy idea of removing the sea cocks from the two cockpit drain hoses. I am still thinking about it.

As for the process itself I was going to follow Maine Sail's recommendations, etc. I think someone recommended "Morey's Red" or something like that - not sure.

[Oswego John]

Robert,

Yes, that's the grease that I'm talking about. It's called Morey's Super Red, NAPA Part #3209. A 37 year supply cost me about a little under $ 6.00

Are you in the water now?

O J

[Sea Hunt Video]

OJ:

Yes. I will be hauling out sometime in late June or early July. At my age the summer temps get oppressively hot and stifling. 100 ft under the ocean on SCUBA or sitting in a pool with a Guinness are the only forms of exercise I can tolerate in July, August and September. It is one of the reasons I am thinking about moving to a more "temperate" climate zone.

[Dick Villamil]

I also replaced my seacocks that were originally gate valves. The 90 degree elbow and thru hull were fine - although I rebedded the through hull. Since I am on fresh water I used another bronze gate valve but replaced the hoses with a reinforced plastic clear hose that doesn't kink. I also keep some flexible copper wire (14 gauge) just in case some leaves or debris get caught in the elbow. So far no problem except one time when some pine needles got stuck. The portable bilge pump took three or four strokes to dislodge the debris. So far 6 years in the water (seasonal) and no other problems and the gate valve works flawlessly - I exercise it frequently just to make sure. Salt water on the other hand is probably what caused the corrosion.

[Bob Ohler]

Quoted from previous post:

"The uproar was due to the fact that I put a NPT thread (the 45 degree ell) together with a straight thread (the thru-hull). Given the load and the possibility of damage from abuse or foreign objects (low) I thought it was a reasonable compromise. Still do." Rollergirl

Rollergirl, I did the same thing once. I was doing an oil change on a foreign car and lost the metric plug. I got a similar but different sized NPT plug, coated it with permanent thread locker, and twisted it home using a 12" wrench. It seemed to work fine and I also thought this was a reasonable compromise.

Coarse thread vs. fine thread. SAE vs. metric. Flare vs. pipe. Straight vs. tapered threads. They're all the same thing. I too use them interchangeably.

"If it jambs force it. If it breaks, it needed to be replaced anyway." Anonymous

[sharkbait]

I purchased a straight thread tap which I use when necessary to mate fittings under those circumstances. Very easy to straighten a taper fitting with the same thread pitch.

[Maine_Buzzard]

Love this thread! Great discussion, because I too have looked askance at the cockpit seacocks.

The best reason I can quote for having them is that because the drain through-hulls end up being below waterline, the seacock gives you the means to close off the through hull positively, without having to pull the hose and insert a plug. Hence the ABYC "really good idear".

If the hose should fail, the seacock is the first means of keeping the water outside, outside.

If you go away from the boat, you can shut the seacocks and know that the ocean won't be inviting itself. As for the rains, well we don't seem to get that any more in Maine. It only snows... (1" today) Seriously, if it rains more then 6", you probably need to check more than your boat.

As for what needs to be in there, again a great question-

How about a Forespar Marelon flanged valve? Low profile, and I agree that ells and 45's are to be avoided as much as possible. I keep a piece of old lifeline on board to poke leaves and crap through, and also like the shower hair getters that have barbs down their length to grab the fuzzy stuff and pull it back out. Will probably now add one to the boat kit. (Look in the big box plumbing section near the Draino.) My thought is that you should be able to snake something all the way through to feel confident about it.

As for NPT and straight threads? Dude, I'm not jumping in that fray... You do your boat, I'll do mine.

Off to buy more rum.

[Steve Laume]

When I bought my first Ty, which had seacocks with no elbows, it came with a small sink plunger. It took me a little while to figure out what it might have been used for. If you do get a slight clog in the cockpit drain lines a good plunging will usually clear it.

I still keep one on Raven in the event anything needs that sort of treatment, Steve.

[Sea Hunt Video]

If you go away from the boat, you can shut the seacocks and know that the ocean won't be inviting itself.

I sincerely hope this does not degenerate into something akin to "locked versus spinning prop" but I was taught to ALWAYS leave the cockpit seacocks fully open.

What is the wisdom of this board Cockpit seacocks closed or open when not aboard

[Jim Walsh]

Cockpit seacocks open, every other one closed.

[jrisler]

I really appreciate all of the advice. I think I will be going down to the boat to measure how much room I have to work with. I am also thinking about taking out the old gate-valves to see the condition of the thru-hulls. My only concern being that I would need to find a temporary way to keep the scuppers draining during the week while I am away from the boat. If the hose is long enough, could I just clamp it to the thru-hull? Thoughts? I also have a question about my teak, but I will put that under a new topic.

[rlhigginsjr]

DSC_0431.JPG

Speaking of seacocks, can someone help me out? I just took possession of Little Wing, a '73 Weekender, and I am trying to get the old valves out so I can replace them. The existing ones are corroded and inoperable - in the closed position no less. I cannot figure out how to get them out without taking a sawz-all to the thru-hull. There is not enough clearance between the valve bonnet and the adjacent wall to simply screw them off.

Any help would be most appreciated.

Regards,

Rich Higgins

[Markst95]

Rich- you could try loosening the thru hull first, loosening the nut might allow you to twist the valve while turning the thru hull. I would probably just take a grinder to it, you don't want to re-use it as it looks original.