Difference between 25D,26,27 & 270

[John Phillips]

Can anyone tell me the what the CD26 and the CD270 are like? I can find plenty of information on the 25D and the 27, but not the other two.
Also, it appears that the 25D often sells for nearly as much as the 28, low 20's, is there any explanation for this.



sailboat@gpcom.net

[john churchill]

Can anyone tell me the what the CD26 and the CD270 are like? I can find plenty of information on the 25D and the 27, but not the other two.
Also, it appears that the 25D often sells for nearly as much as the 28, low 20's, is there any explanation for this.

i have a cd26 which is a cd25d with an extra foot on the transom for an outboard well. the interior is different as well. practical sailor did a review of the old 25 and the 25d, published in a book "practical boat buying". call me for more cd26 info. (757)547-7714.



bone2@norfolk.infi.net

[Dana Arenius]

Can anyone tell me the what the CD26 and the CD270 are like? I can find plenty of information on the 25D and the 27, but not the other two.
Also, it appears that the 25D often sells for nearly as much as the 28, low 20's, is there any explanation for this.

_____________________________________________________________________

Hi John,


Before I forget folks, I will be working in the San Francisco area from Feb 9th thru the 22th (Livermore) and I will be gone for a while.

First I will try to explain the differences:

The 25D took the place (in length only) of the earlier CD25. This was about 1981. The CD25 and CD25D are very different boats. The CD25 was sitting room only, the CD25D has standing room (5'11"). The CD25 was a Stadel/Cape Dory "design team" design, the CD25D was an Alberg design. The CD25 has a "traditional layout with quarter berths and forward vee berth with optional outboard engine. The CD25D utilizes the entire forward area for a large head area. It has only quarter berths and under sail locker berth design. The starboard quarter berth has "draw out" bed section which widens the starboard berth so two can sleep. This does cut back on the available floor walking area. Because it was standard with the diesel and most equipment, the price of the CD25D was fairly expensive when new (about $38K in 1985, now about $67K as built by Octavia Marine).

The price of a CD25D will compete with earlier CD28s. Those CD28s built in the 70s will be a little more expensive but still in the $20-30K range.

By 1985, Cape Dory and many other manufacturers were finding it very difficult to build boats less than 30 feet and still make a profit.
The well equipped CD22/22D and the CD25D were discontinued. These were replaced with a 22 foot (Typhoon Senior) and 26 foot model (CD26) which did not offer as much standard equipment or features as the former models. You could, if you wished, outfit them with more for additional cost.

Both the CD22 and CD26 had outboard engine wells. An optional diesel was available for the CD26. The hull design of the CD26 can be thought of as being identical to that of the CD25D except an additional length was added for the engine well. The interior layout of the CD26 is also different. It is more in the traditional design with quarter berths and a forward vee berth area. The sail plans of the CD25D and CD26 are identical.

You can visit my CD26 web site at http://members.aol.com/darenius/
CapeDory/CD26.html (at the bottom of this page) to have a picture tour of my CD26 (Hull #2).

The 270 was an attempt of Cape Dory to introduce a boat design which offered more interior space than those designs by Alberg. The 270 was designed by Dieter Empacher (I know I have this name spelling wrong).
It has a much wider beam and the underbody is a drop keel/hull trunk design. The topsides were made to look very much like the Alberg design to fit into the family. This boat was offered in the early eighties but only a few were built. It was fairly expensive (about $57K when it came out). These boats were normally very well equipped.
Its design can not be compared with the earlier CD27 designed by Alberg. A different design approach completely.

The CD28 was a very popular design. Many were built. One can see the years each model was built and how many from the Cape Dory Home Page.

So in short, these models were offered at different times and with different features.

Dana



arenius@jlab.org

[Jon Larson]

Dana,

First let me compliment your web page on your CD26. Nice photos, the boat looks like a jewel. Nice dodger, they're great, we even had one on our CD22, Cape Dory's carry them well.

A couple of comments. The CD25, I had thought and I could be wrong, was a modification of the original Allied Marine (Catskill, NY) Greenwich 24 that was indeed designed by our friend Carl Alberg. When Allied went bankrupt, I had thought, Cape Dory bought the molds. I had been through the Allied plant and had crawled all over the Greenwich 24, it didn't even have sitting headroom, so I think Stadel and CD raised the freeboard of the boat, thus making it more livable and also resulting in a one foot increase in length. The lovely underwater curves we love in our Alberg CDs is the same on the CD25 as the original Alberg Greenwich 24 from Allied. I think.

Also, my CD22 had the outboard mounted on a spring loaded motor mount off the transom, not in a well. There was a lazerette that was VERY useful where a motor well might have been. That CD22 was a very capable little boat and I kind of wish I had it now given the low level of sailing I'm doing these days.

Speaking of sailing, shoot a note over if you might be interested in trying to get out on the bay while you're working at Livermore. Marilyn and I are off to Hawaii for the last couple of weeks in February and though (nominally) retired I've said yes to too many things and my calendar is more jammed than when I worked for money, but if something can be worked out it would be neat.

Jon Larson
Cape Dory 30 PERI
San Francisco Bay

____________________________________________________________________

Hi John,


Before I forget folks, I will be working in the San Francisco area from Feb 9th thru the 22th (Livermore) and I will be gone for a while.

First I will try to explain the differences:

The 25D took the place (in length only) of the earlier CD25. This was about 1981. The CD25 and CD25D are very different boats. The CD25 was sitting room only, the CD25D has standing room (5'11"). The CD25 was a Stadel/Cape Dory "design team" design, the CD25D was an Alberg design. The CD25 has a "traditional layout with quarter berths and forward vee berth with optional outboard engine. The CD25D utilizes the entire forward area for a large head area. It has only quarter berths and under sail locker berth design. The starboard quarter berth has "draw out" bed section which widens the starboard berth so two can sleep. This does cut back on the available floor walking area. Because it was standard with the diesel and most equipment, the price of the CD25D was fairly expensive when new (about $38K in 1985, now about $67K as built by Octavia Marine).

The price of a CD25D will compete with earlier CD28s. Those CD28s built in the 70s will be a little more expensive but still in the $20-30K range.

By 1985, Cape Dory and many other manufacturers were finding it very difficult to build boats less than 30 feet and still make a profit.
The well equipped CD22/22D and the CD25D were discontinued. These were replaced with a 22 foot (Typhoon Senior) and 26 foot model (CD26) which did not offer as much standard equipment or features as the former models. You could, if you wished, outfit them with more for additional cost.

Both the CD22 and CD26 had outboard engine wells. An optional diesel was available for the CD26. The hull design of the CD26 can be thought of as being identical to that of the CD25D except an additional length was added for the engine well. The interior layout of the CD26 is also different. It is more in the traditional design with quarter berths and a forward vee berth area. The sail plans of the CD25D and CD26 are identical.

You can visit my CD26 web site at http://members.aol.com/darenius/
CapeDory/CD26.html (at the bottom of this page) to have a picture tour of my CD26 (Hull #2).

The 270 was an attempt of Cape Dory to introduce a boat design which offered more interior space than those designs by Alberg. The 270 was designed by Dieter Empacher (I know I have this name spelling wrong).
It has a much wider beam and the underbody is a drop keel/hull trunk design. The topsides were made to look very much like the Alberg design to fit into the family. This boat was offered in the early eighties but only a few were built. It was fairly expensive (about $57K when it came out). These boats were normally very well equipped.
Its design can not be compared with the earlier CD27 designed by Alberg. A different design approach completely.

The CD28 was a very popular design. Many were built. One can see the years each model was built and how many from the Cape Dory Home Page.

So in short, these models were offered at different times and with different features.

Dana

jon9@ix.netcom.com

[Dana Arenius]

Hi Jon,

Your're right....I made a mistake. I meant to say that the 22' Typhoon Senior and the CD26 had engine wells. I had 22' on my mind when I incorrectly stated the CD22 had the engine well. I've done this before! Sorry.

I think you will find that Stadel designed the Greenwich 24 for Allied. Allied still has a nice web site with the boats history. I think you can get to it thru the main page of this association and then going to the specifications of the CD25. At the bottom of the CD25 specification page I think there is a link to the Allied page. When Cape Dory took over the design they increased the height of the coach to give more room (but still sitting room). I had thought the hull was left alone. You are right when you say the hulls are very similiar, I can not tell the difference.

By refering to the CD25 as a "Stadel/Cape Dory design team", I was trying to say that the hull was by Stadel (the orginal 24) and the top coach by Cape Dory, not that Stadel or Cape Dory worked together. The old design and new modifications by Cape Dory then made what we know as the CD25 today. I had missed meeting Carl Alberg once at the Newport R.I. Internatinal Boat show (Rhode Island was our old sailing ground). The Cape Dory factory had brought him down from Marblehead, MA for the show. I would have loved to meet him and ask him.

But the Cape Dory factory folks that I knew and the other boat builders in the area had always indicated that Alberg never wanted his name associated with the 25. Not that it was not a great boat, it was just that he did not design it.

Thanks for your offer for a sail. I will be pretty busy at Livermore until the weekend (Feb 14,15th). I know how busy things can get before taking a trip. If you plans change, let me know....I would have loved to have taken a sail on the bay.

Thanks again and have a nice trip,

Dana







darenius@aol.com

[Jon Larson]

Dana,

I am now smarter about the CD25..thank you!

I think the 14th or 15th could be very workable, Dana. This coming week I'll shoot you an Email note.

Jon Larson
Cape Dory 30 PERI
San Francisco Bay

Hi Jon,

Your're right....I made a mistake. I meant to say that the 22' Typhoon Senior and the CD26 had engine wells. I had 22' on my mind when I incorrectly stated the CD22 had the engine well. I've done this before! Sorry.

I think you will find that Stadel designed the Greenwich 24 for Allied. Allied still has a nice web site with the boats history. I think you can get to it thru the main page of this association and then going to the specifications of the CD25. At the bottom of the CD25 specification page I think there is a link to the Allied page. When Cape Dory took over the design they increased the height of the coach to give more room (but still sitting room). I had thought the hull was left alone. You are right when you say the hulls are very similiar, I can not tell the difference.

By refering to the CD25 as a "Stadel/Cape Dory design team", I was trying to say that the hull was by Stadel (the orginal 24) and the top coach by Cape Dory, not that Stadel or Cape Dory worked together. The old design and new modifications by Cape Dory then made what we know as the CD25 today. I had missed meeting Carl Alberg once at the Newport R.I. Internatinal Boat show (Rhode Island was our old sailing ground). The Cape Dory factory had brought him down from Marblehead, MA for the show. I would have loved to meet him and ask him.

But the Cape Dory factory folks that I knew and the other boat builders in the area had always indicated that Alberg never wanted his name associated with the 25. Not that it was not a great boat, it was just that he did not design it.

Thanks for your offer for a sail. I will be pretty busy at Livermore until the weekend (Feb 14,15th). I know how busy things can get before taking a trip. If you plans change, let me know....I would have loved to have taken a sail on the bay.

Thanks again and have a nice trip,

Dana

jon9@ix.netcom.com