[/img]Winterizing the YSM8
Moderator: Jim Walsh
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tjr818
- Posts: 1851
- Joined: Oct 13th, '07, 13:42
- Location: Previously owned 1980 CD 27 Slainte, Hull #185. NO.1257949
Winterizing the YSM8
On my new to me CD27, after reading many of the post here I understand that not only should I run Anti-freeze through the engine, but that I should also drain the cylinder head. My xerox of a xerox of a xerox owners manual does not have a clear picture of the cylinder head drain. I have peaked underneath the engine and have attached photos of what I am seeing. It is the brass fitting that is in question. I know I could just loosen this thing and find out what comes out, but I am hoping that some others have seen this and can tell me if it is a water drain or an oil drain.
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[/img]Tim
Nonsuch 26 Ultra,
Previously, Sláinte a CD27
Nonsuch 26 Ultra,
Previously, Sláinte a CD27
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Maine_Buzzard
- Posts: 506
- Joined: Dec 22nd, '10, 21:15
- Location: Feet Dry, Olympia, WA
Yanmar says that it is.
From the owner's manual online here:
<a href="http://s793.photobucket.com/albums/yy21 ... Yanmar.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i793.photobucket.com/albums/yy21 ... Yanmar.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
Your engine mount nut looks very loose too... The split washer should be compressed down.
From the owner's manual online here:
<a href="http://s793.photobucket.com/albums/yy21 ... Yanmar.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i793.photobucket.com/albums/yy21 ... Yanmar.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
Your engine mount nut looks very loose too... The split washer should be compressed down.
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Ray Garcia
- Posts: 258
- Joined: Apr 27th, '05, 22:08
- Location: 1981 CD27 #212 "Spirit" Huntington, NY
- Contact:
Yes, that is the drain valve. I have tried the same too but nothing came out. I gather it is blocked with sediment, I tightened it up and will tackle this at a later time.
Tip: You really have to warm up the engine prior to pumping through the antifreeze. Without the thermostat open you will just be sending the anti-freeze out the exhaust. Some owners setup a closed loop to recirculate the antifreeze. Search the posts, there is plenty of info on winterizing the little bomb.
Come to think of it, I better get working on mine soon.
PS - Check all the mounts!
Tip: You really have to warm up the engine prior to pumping through the antifreeze. Without the thermostat open you will just be sending the anti-freeze out the exhaust. Some owners setup a closed loop to recirculate the antifreeze. Search the posts, there is plenty of info on winterizing the little bomb.
Come to think of it, I better get working on mine soon.
PS - Check all the mounts!
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Warren Kaplan
- Posts: 1147
- Joined: Feb 5th, '05, 11:44
- Location: Former owner of Sine Qua Non CD27 #166 1980 Oyster Bay Harbor, NY Member # 317
What I always did was this.
Get two short lengths of hose, a bucket and a gallon or so of antifreeze and a supply of fresh water.
Warm the engine up for a while. When the engine is warm (if you are still in the water) close the raw water intake seacock. Remove the the hose from the seacock (leaving it connected to the engine or replacing it temporarily with a longer hose if needs be to reach the bucket) Put the free end of the hose into a bucket of fresh water. Start the engine again. Sucking a few gallons of fresh water through a warm engine (read..thermostat open) will rinse out the salt.
After that you can do one of two things. You can then replace the fresh water in the bucket with antifreeze and let the engine suck the antifreeze through the engine and out the mixing elbow and exhaust. Turn the engine off while its still sucking antifreeze out of the pail to make sure that antifreeze is still in the bowels of the engine and not all out the exhaust.
A variation is this, especially if the engine is cold and you want to MAKE SURE the thermostat opens so all parts of the inner engine are protected.
Have the intake hose in the bucket of fresh water as in the first example. Now, detach the hose from the engine to the mixing elbow and replace it with a hose that is long enough to reach from the engine back to the bucket. Then start the engine. Antifreeze will be drawn in, go through the engine, and then be discharged back into the bucket. It will go round and round so you save on antifreeze costs, especially if your engine isn't warm. Just let it go round and round until you are sure the themostat opens and the antifreeze circulates through the opened thermostat. Once that's done, replace the original exhaust hose to the mixing elbow and let a little antifreeze circulate though the elbow and out the exhaust. All you have to do now is replace the intake hose (if you changed it to the longer one) and attach it back to the seacock and you're done. Letting the antifreeze circulate numerous times really washes out the inside of the engine of all the accumulated salt and crud.
FWIW
Get two short lengths of hose, a bucket and a gallon or so of antifreeze and a supply of fresh water.
Warm the engine up for a while. When the engine is warm (if you are still in the water) close the raw water intake seacock. Remove the the hose from the seacock (leaving it connected to the engine or replacing it temporarily with a longer hose if needs be to reach the bucket) Put the free end of the hose into a bucket of fresh water. Start the engine again. Sucking a few gallons of fresh water through a warm engine (read..thermostat open) will rinse out the salt.
After that you can do one of two things. You can then replace the fresh water in the bucket with antifreeze and let the engine suck the antifreeze through the engine and out the mixing elbow and exhaust. Turn the engine off while its still sucking antifreeze out of the pail to make sure that antifreeze is still in the bowels of the engine and not all out the exhaust.
A variation is this, especially if the engine is cold and you want to MAKE SURE the thermostat opens so all parts of the inner engine are protected.
Have the intake hose in the bucket of fresh water as in the first example. Now, detach the hose from the engine to the mixing elbow and replace it with a hose that is long enough to reach from the engine back to the bucket. Then start the engine. Antifreeze will be drawn in, go through the engine, and then be discharged back into the bucket. It will go round and round so you save on antifreeze costs, especially if your engine isn't warm. Just let it go round and round until you are sure the themostat opens and the antifreeze circulates through the opened thermostat. Once that's done, replace the original exhaust hose to the mixing elbow and let a little antifreeze circulate though the elbow and out the exhaust. All you have to do now is replace the intake hose (if you changed it to the longer one) and attach it back to the seacock and you're done. Letting the antifreeze circulate numerous times really washes out the inside of the engine of all the accumulated salt and crud.
FWIW
"I desire no more delight, than to be under sail and gone tonight."
(W. Shakespeare, Merchant of Venice)
(W. Shakespeare, Merchant of Venice)
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Oswego John
- Posts: 3535
- Joined: Feb 5th, '05, 20:42
- Location: '66 Typhoon "Grace", Hull # 42, Schooner "Ontario", CD 85D Hull #1
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Steve Laume
- Posts: 4127
- Joined: Feb 13th, '05, 20:40
- Location: Raven1984 Cape Dory 30C Hull #309Noank, CT
- Contact:
So Warren, I understand the benefits of recirculating the antifreeze but what happens to the exhaust system while it is not getting any cooling water? How long can you send hot exhaust through a plastic muffler before it creates problems?
I never drain my engine block as I consider it a situation where you run antifreeze through the system or drain everything. I feel much more confident about pumping antifreeze through the system than I do about being able to properly drain it completely.
My set up is that I run the engine until it is hot. I can then close the seacock and unscrew the cover on raw water strainer. I keep pouring antifreeze into it until the exhaust runs pink. I then shut her down and put the cover back on the strainer. I tend to do this several times a winter as we like to get out once in a while during the cold season. No hoses or drains to mess with. Just a few bucks worth of antifreeze, Steve.
I never drain my engine block as I consider it a situation where you run antifreeze through the system or drain everything. I feel much more confident about pumping antifreeze through the system than I do about being able to properly drain it completely.
My set up is that I run the engine until it is hot. I can then close the seacock and unscrew the cover on raw water strainer. I keep pouring antifreeze into it until the exhaust runs pink. I then shut her down and put the cover back on the strainer. I tend to do this several times a winter as we like to get out once in a while during the cold season. No hoses or drains to mess with. Just a few bucks worth of antifreeze, Steve.
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Warren Kaplan
- Posts: 1147
- Joined: Feb 5th, '05, 11:44
- Location: Former owner of Sine Qua Non CD27 #166 1980 Oyster Bay Harbor, NY Member # 317
So Warren, I understand the benefits of recirculating the antifreeze but what happens to the exhaust system while it is not getting any cooling water? How long can you send hot exhaust through a plastic muffler before it creates problems?
Steve,
I never really ran into problems along these lines. Truth be told, I never thought about it. Frankly, the amount of time the hose was disconnected from the exhaust elbow was very short.
My standard technique was to warm up the engine with the everything in place, like usual during the year. When the engine was warmed up, I'd close the raw water seacock, remove intake hose from the seacock but leave it attach to the engine, and then run a ton of fresh water thru the engine and out the exhaust (as normal) to rinse out all the salt. Once the engine was rinsed, I'd disconnect the exhaust hose from the elbow and stick that hose, along with the intake hose, into a bucket of antifreeze. I'd let that pump around and around for maybe a minute or two tops. That would actually circulate the antifreeze quite a few times through the engine. Then I would reconnect the hose to the exhaust elbow and let antifreeze circulate through the elbow and out the exhaust for about 30 seconds or "almost" until the pail ran dry. As long as there was still some antifreeze left in the pail I was sure that there was antifreeze in all parts of the engine.
So actually the exhaust elbow etc is deprived of liquid only a very short time.
Steve,
I never really ran into problems along these lines. Truth be told, I never thought about it. Frankly, the amount of time the hose was disconnected from the exhaust elbow was very short.
My standard technique was to warm up the engine with the everything in place, like usual during the year. When the engine was warmed up, I'd close the raw water seacock, remove intake hose from the seacock but leave it attach to the engine, and then run a ton of fresh water thru the engine and out the exhaust (as normal) to rinse out all the salt. Once the engine was rinsed, I'd disconnect the exhaust hose from the elbow and stick that hose, along with the intake hose, into a bucket of antifreeze. I'd let that pump around and around for maybe a minute or two tops. That would actually circulate the antifreeze quite a few times through the engine. Then I would reconnect the hose to the exhaust elbow and let antifreeze circulate through the elbow and out the exhaust for about 30 seconds or "almost" until the pail ran dry. As long as there was still some antifreeze left in the pail I was sure that there was antifreeze in all parts of the engine.
So actually the exhaust elbow etc is deprived of liquid only a very short time.
"I desire no more delight, than to be under sail and gone tonight."
(W. Shakespeare, Merchant of Venice)
(W. Shakespeare, Merchant of Venice)
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David van den Burgh
- Posts: 597
- Joined: Feb 5th, '05, 18:54
- Location: Ariel CD36, 1979 - Lake Michigan
- Contact:
Engine Winterization
I make no claim about being an expert on the subject, but here's a video I put together for fun this season while winterizing Ariel's engine. I've done it this way for 8 years without incident. Perhaps it might be of some value to this discussion.
<embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/F5SxA4tZlOk?version=3&hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="560" height="315" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true"></embed>
<embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/F5SxA4tZlOk?version=3&hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="560" height="315" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true"></embed>
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Duncan Maio
- Posts: 180
- Joined: Feb 5th, '05, 22:01
- Location: Cape Dory 27
I usually flush with fresh water and then run antifreeze through the system as described above, and have never had any freezing problems.
Seeing the posts here, I looked for the drain cock on Remedy, and found it exactly as pictured in the Yanmar manual. With one exception - the handle appears to be in the "open"position, pointing down instead of horizontal. It is also frozen in place.
I have ordered a replacement from Torresen, in anticipation of the inevitable result when I try to open (close?) the drain cock after at least 15 years. I would leave it alone if not for the unusual handle position.
Seeing the posts here, I looked for the drain cock on Remedy, and found it exactly as pictured in the Yanmar manual. With one exception - the handle appears to be in the "open"position, pointing down instead of horizontal. It is also frozen in place.
I have ordered a replacement from Torresen, in anticipation of the inevitable result when I try to open (close?) the drain cock after at least 15 years. I would leave it alone if not for the unusual handle position.
Duncan Maio
s/v Remedy
CD27 #37
Bristol, RI
s/v Remedy
CD27 #37
Bristol, RI
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Duncan Maio
- Posts: 180
- Joined: Feb 5th, '05, 22:01
- Location: Cape Dory 27
Never seen one like this . . .
I got the replacement valve from Torresen today. I have never seen a ball valve where the handle parallel to the flow is "closed." That is clearly the case with this valve, and probably the one on Remedy. The replacement is also very stiff to operate - a good thing in this application - which explains why I could not move the one on my boat, which hasn't been opened in at least 15 years.
Looking at the diagram in Maine Buzzard's post above, that valve would be in the "open" position on my boat. Go figure.
Odds are there is, of course, nothing wrong with the valve on my boat, so if anyone needs a spare . . . .
Looking at the diagram in Maine Buzzard's post above, that valve would be in the "open" position on my boat. Go figure.
Odds are there is, of course, nothing wrong with the valve on my boat, so if anyone needs a spare . . . .
Duncan Maio
s/v Remedy
CD27 #37
Bristol, RI
s/v Remedy
CD27 #37
Bristol, RI
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Duncan Maio
- Posts: 180
- Joined: Feb 5th, '05, 22:01
- Location: Cape Dory 27
Sure enough, putting the handle perpendicular to the outlet caused a small drip to come from the outlet (confirming the idea that it is a bit gunked up) and snapped the little handle off about halfway up (confirming the thought that I should have a spare on hand).
Odds are we won't be replacing the valve until spring.
Odds are we won't be replacing the valve until spring.
Duncan Maio
s/v Remedy
CD27 #37
Bristol, RI
s/v Remedy
CD27 #37
Bristol, RI
That is the drain valve and if you open it and nothing drains out, it is probably clogged. Mine had a twist knob rather than a toggle, so I would remove twist knob and just poke a thin screwdriver up into the valve to breakup any sediment and the water would flow out along with particles that were blocking the valve, then screw the knob back into the valve. I would do this once in spring and fall just to keep it clear.
Winterizing is simple. If I am on jackstands I have a large plastic bucket with a hole cut in the side near the top and position the bucket on the cabin floor just partially over the access to the bilge. I have a plastic plug (pvc connection with male and female ends and a couple o rings to create a water tight seal at the hole) thru the hole in the bucket so water rising in the bucket would just pour out the plug and spill into the bilge , with the float switch on auto. Put a garden hose into the bucket with a simple twist nozzle to regulate the flow of water to closely match the demand of the engine. The raw water intake line is removed and a clear plastic hose is attached to the water pump and the other end in the bottom of the bucket. You might have to put a little weight on the clear hose to keep it in the bottom of the bucket. Run the engine til it warms up. You dont have to keep monitoring the water in the bucket , the bilge pump takes care of the overflow. Its hands off at this point, just let her run. After its warmed up, shut off the hose and when the water level gets close to the bottom of the bucket , pour the anitfreeze in and wait til it comes out the exhaust. Shut down the engine and reattach the raw water hose to the pump and you are done.
Winterizing is simple. If I am on jackstands I have a large plastic bucket with a hole cut in the side near the top and position the bucket on the cabin floor just partially over the access to the bilge. I have a plastic plug (pvc connection with male and female ends and a couple o rings to create a water tight seal at the hole) thru the hole in the bucket so water rising in the bucket would just pour out the plug and spill into the bilge , with the float switch on auto. Put a garden hose into the bucket with a simple twist nozzle to regulate the flow of water to closely match the demand of the engine. The raw water intake line is removed and a clear plastic hose is attached to the water pump and the other end in the bottom of the bucket. You might have to put a little weight on the clear hose to keep it in the bottom of the bucket. Run the engine til it warms up. You dont have to keep monitoring the water in the bucket , the bilge pump takes care of the overflow. Its hands off at this point, just let her run. After its warmed up, shut off the hose and when the water level gets close to the bottom of the bucket , pour the anitfreeze in and wait til it comes out the exhaust. Shut down the engine and reattach the raw water hose to the pump and you are done.
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Duncan Maio
- Posts: 180
- Joined: Feb 5th, '05, 22:01
- Location: Cape Dory 27
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Maine_Buzzard
- Posts: 506
- Joined: Dec 22nd, '10, 21:15
- Location: Feet Dry, Olympia, WA
Water Bucket V2.0
Saw this mentioned, and had to try it out. Another person had run the valve through the bottom of the bucket, but I'm too cheap to splurge on a bucket.
Mounted the valve on a plywood sheet, then used 2x4s to shim it up. A few hoses and the on/off valve. Perhaps $15 in parts.
Block the wash tube on top. The 3/4" intake line can go farther down, to the bottom of the bucket. No need for reinforced hose, clear would work, as there is no real vacuum.
This thing worked like shiny things to a golddigger. I pulled the prime by sucking the water up by mouth and jamming the the hose on the transmission inlet. The valve ticked open every five seconds or so, and could easily keep up with almost any engine on this board.
I shut the water off after it warmed up, and filled with two gallons of antifreeze. The leftovers went in the head, and I had my bucket back. The wood wants to float, so I dropped a spare lead weight on the plywood while it was in use.
<a href="http://s793.photobucket.com/albums/yy21 ... ¤t=top.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i793.photobucket.com/albums/yy21 ... 50/top.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
<a href="http://s793.photobucket.com/albums/yy21 ... t=side.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i793.photobucket.com/albums/yy21 ... 0/side.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
<a href="http://s793.photobucket.com/albums/yy21 ... ¤t=end.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i793.photobucket.com/albums/yy21 ... 50/end.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
Mounted the valve on a plywood sheet, then used 2x4s to shim it up. A few hoses and the on/off valve. Perhaps $15 in parts.
Block the wash tube on top. The 3/4" intake line can go farther down, to the bottom of the bucket. No need for reinforced hose, clear would work, as there is no real vacuum.
This thing worked like shiny things to a golddigger. I pulled the prime by sucking the water up by mouth and jamming the the hose on the transmission inlet. The valve ticked open every five seconds or so, and could easily keep up with almost any engine on this board.
I shut the water off after it warmed up, and filled with two gallons of antifreeze. The leftovers went in the head, and I had my bucket back. The wood wants to float, so I dropped a spare lead weight on the plywood while it was in use.
<a href="http://s793.photobucket.com/albums/yy21 ... ¤t=top.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i793.photobucket.com/albums/yy21 ... 50/top.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
<a href="http://s793.photobucket.com/albums/yy21 ... t=side.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i793.photobucket.com/albums/yy21 ... 0/side.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
<a href="http://s793.photobucket.com/albums/yy21 ... ¤t=end.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i793.photobucket.com/albums/yy21 ... 50/end.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
