Motorsailing in dead calm

[M. R. Bober]

Winthrop I am not a member of the CDSOA. I try not to irritate members by excessive posting on this site.

John V.

John,
Except for the"every little once in a while" post.

Mitchell Bober
Sunny Lancaster (where oysters need irritation to make pearls), VA

[Oswego John]

Sorry folks,

I'm unable to comment on John's enigmal poser. You see, sadly I am cursed with the problem of sailing out of Oswego, NY. Oswego is situated on the eastern shore of Lake Ontario. Most of us have, somewhat, inured ourselves to the incessant westerlies that pester the sailing confraternity.

Sad to say,(sob, sob), we don't know what a calm day is. Even with a zephyr wafting in from Toronto, considering the almost 150 mile fetch, by the time it reaches the lee shore the conditions are anything but calm.

But don't trouble yourselves with feeling any pity for our windswept, local sailors. We continue to suffer in silence with our rails submerged (as Robert exclaims, yee haw). Consider it the penance imposed on us for continuing to sail in these parts. Some people will never learn. Sigh.

In regard to what River Rat mentioned by propelling the small sailboat by rocking and rolling the hull, there is another way some sailors can move the boat foreward when they undershoot the mooring or slip.

This is done by wig-wagging the tiller back and forth as if sculling the hull.

Sorry, you guys with wheels. Something tells me that this procedure won't work for you.

Yee haw
O J

[Steve Laume]

I had a Laser for a while and never stood on the bow rocking it like a crazed cave man when there was no wind or I just need to get out into deeper water before I set the rudder and sailed off. I had two methods that seem much more effective.

If I was alone I would lay on the foredeck and paddle it like a surf board. This not only propelled the boat nicely but also allowed me to control the direction of travel.

If I was sailing with my Lab, I would once again lay on the foredeck but instead of paddling simply grasp his tail and point in the direction I wanted to go. He made great auxiliary power and loved his job. Once I got squared away I would haul him aboard and off we would go.

At 90lbs he a added a good bit of rail meat. He also greatly contributed to the condition of my abs because his method of hiking out was to climb up on my chest. I think he knew he could gain a little leveage that way.

I think John must have poked at hornet's nests as a kid and finds this nearly as much fun and a lot less painful, Steve.

[winthrop fisher]

Dean, i think your right,

and steve i think my chinook breed of dog at 130pds, could beat your lab,

winthrop

[Oswego John]

Heh, my 38 pound Australian Cattle Dog pulls a CD 27 at hull speed, upstream on the Oswego River. (against the wind)

O J
(with the prop locked)

[Dean Abramson]

This thread is going to the dogs.

[Boyd]

I propose to Maine Sail that he put his strain gauge on a towing line and measure the load when towed both with the sail up and down dead into the wind. The difference in load should tell the tale.

Doing so would flush out the more subtile effects of upwash on sails, camber effects, and keel interactions that are the stuff of sailing.

Boyd
s/v Tern
CD30 MkII

[winthrop fisher]

winthrop

[Len]

The obvious advantage to leaving the mainsail up in dead calm when motorsailing is to my muscles. The energy required (in calories) to lower and than raise the sails is far greater than the energy ( in gallons) expended from leaving it up.

Maine sail... Is that really a digital strain gauge attached to the
pennant in your photo?

[Maine Sail]

I propose to Maine Sail that he put his strain gauge on a towing line and measure the load when towed both with the sail up and down dead into the wind. The difference in load should tell the tale.

Doing so would flush out the more subtile effects of upwash on sails, camber effects, and keel interactions that are the stuff of sailing.

Boyd
s/v Tern
CD30 MkII

Pointing directly into a steady wind on a mooring achieves the same outcome only with less room for variables and I have a known steady current and can watch the actual wind speeds and compare apples to apples to within .1 knot. The difference was like a locked three blade prop or dragging a bucket. 20-25 pounds is nothing to shake a stick at. When sailboats can move forward on the mooring with the main up and pointing directly into the wind maybe then Ill buy into the theory. So far in nearly 40 years on the water I have yet to see this happen...

[darmoose]

Mainsail


I agree totally with you, and, as I am sure you know already, your testing method will also disprove J V's earlier misguided ascertion regarding helicopters and propellers, don't you agree, by simply measuring the "strain" on your guage when freewheeling the propeller verses locking the propeller, while moored in a current (assuming that you have minimal friction on the propeller shaft or built into your drive train, which would otherwise hamper its ability to freewheel properly).

Now, ain't this so?

Darrell

[Joe CD MS 300]

I always thought the main reason for leaving the main sail up while motoring was for shade or at times lazyness with the hope the wind would pick up.

[Dick Barthel]

After having read all of the interesting responses from CDSOA members, it occurs to me that John's original email does not provide Cunliffe's rationale for the supposed "5% economy" and in fact the claim is only an allegation by another author without citation. Perhaps she is misconstruing? It would be interesting to find Cunliffe's pronouncement and to read it in full context. I've tried Googling for it to no avail. One can justifiably doubt that one as knowledgable as he ever actually made the claim.

Without his actual statement we're really just chasing our tails, strain gauges notwithstanding. But what else is new?

Dick