Westerbeke W13 raw water pump rebuild

[Carter Brey]

I'm wondering if anyone here has rebuilt the water pump #24143 for the Westerbeke W13.

I removed it from the engine block last night and brought it home. I have the rebuild kit here, consisting of two shaft seals, a carbon bushing, a shaft, a cam, and an impeller.

Once I'd removed the impeller, the shaft simply slid out of the pump body by hand, requiring no extra effort or use of a drift.

Now I have a pump body with bushing, slinger washer, and two shaft seals still securely in place. I need somehow to pop these seals and the bushing out so that I can replace them.

The shop manual says to use "an appropriate puller" to hook out the seal at the engine end, after which, as I can see, I am to use some sort of lubricated drift-- a deep well socket, perhaps-- to press out the bushing. But-- and this is my question-- what is an "appropriate puller"? Clearly something that will exert pressure on the seal's surface from inside. A bent wire coathanger? A dental tool? A vaudeville hook? I assume I should not stick a screwdriver through the hole in the seal and "pry" it out.

Thanks,
Carter Brey
1982 S28 MkII #532
City Island, NY

[marilou]

It has been quite a few years since I did this, but I believe that I carefully "knocked" them out using a piece of wood to prevent damaging the shaft. I did not use a "puller". However, I would think that Harbor Freight ,Northern Tool or an auto parts store would have a small appropriate puller - one of those things that has "grasps" and you turn a "wing nut" to pull back what (like a pulley, fan blade, seal ...) you are trying to remove from a shaft???

[Warren S]

DISCLAIMER: As a former machinist, I really do believe in "the right tool for the job", but i needed to get this done with the tools on board. It was either complete this job, or cancel my 4 day solo before hauling the boat for P.M. - so the pressure was on.

My pump had begun seeping water on a steady drip from the aperture where the "slinger" was - had to shut the engine seacock before leaving the boat (probably good practice anyway).

The innermost seal (closest to engine) came easily enough just prying with a small open end wrench (using a jaw to hook the seal) protecting the casting. The outermost seal - really the water seal whilst in operation, was a different story. It was rusted in place. I located a long, stout flathead bolt, so that I could catch the seal and drive it out. The bolt shaft will be brought up through the carbon bushing. it will take patience, and this seal may be rusted in as mine was. Soak it first with penetrating oil, and be assured it will probably be destroyed coming out. The idea here is that you are using the head of the bolt to hook the interior of the seal. Clearly, you will have to work the "punch" around the interior of the "workpiece" in order to try to drive it out evenly.

The carbon bushing will chip if you are not careful, but since you are going to replace it, then no worries. I didn't need to replace mine, but when I do, I will not mess around and locate an arbor press. Unless the shop manual says otherwise, you will need to *press* the new one in. If you tap it in, you will destroy it. A dead-blow and a soft drift *may* work, but it's a risk.

Driving the new seals back in required another improv: use of a socket (forgot the size) as a jig to distribute the hammer blows and not deform the seals going in. Remember to add a film of oil/grease to new seals going in.

Good luck!!

P.S. I was the cause my problem by accidentally yanking the entire impeller shaft out during an impeller change. i didn't know there was a "slinger" and when I replaced the shaft, tore the slinger with pieces ending up in the bearing race that you no doubt have an intimate relationship with by now.

[marilou]

Yes it can be done, without special tools.

[Warren S]

I should have stated "First take M.Lou's advice and get the right tool. Barring that..."

My late uncle was a chief engineer aboard oil tankers. He had a reputation for "fixing" systems at sea. Did you know, for example, they used to keep tropical hardwoods an board (lignium vitae was one) with which to make emergency bearings?

[Boyd]

Hi Carter:

I just looked up the diagram for your pump and find it much simpler to rebuild than pump on the 21A.

I typically use a screw driver backed by a small wood piece against the block to pry out old seals. Yes its not the right tool but it works. Work it from several directions. Press in the new seal with the appropriate size socket and a few gentle hammer blows, being careful to keep the seal square with the opening. A bit of grease helps.

The most important part of rebuilding these pumps is to make sure you put the old seals and slingers in the correct orientation. Putting them on the shaft backwards will cause them to leak prematurely. Naively during my first rebuild I carefully took notes on the orientations and put the new back together exactly only to have the pump fail prematurely again. Turns out the previous mechanic put the pump together wrong and I just copied his mistakes. I didn't find out what was wrong till I bought a new one for a spare and discovered that the seals were supposed to be installed opposite. Quite a surprise. Dent want to make you paranoid, as the chances of that happening are quite slim.

Boyd
s/v Tern
CD30 MkII
Fort Lauderdale, Fla.

[Carter Brey]

Thanks to all of you gentlemen. This has been extremely helpful.

Boyd, thank you for chiming in; I had printed out and saved a post of yours on this topic from some years back, but as soon as I began this project I realized that you had been writing about a different model pump. I appreciate your having gone to the trouble of looking up the diagram for my particular unit.

Carter
1982 S28 MkII #532
City Island, NY

[Carter Brey]

Realizing that it was impossible to pry the old seals out, I decided to approach the problem from the opposite direction. I used a 17mm socket and a hammer to knock the inner seal inward until it was even with the drain slot. The seal was exactly the right width to slide right out through the slot.

The outer seal-- the one located deeper inside-- was obviously a problem. It seemed to be rusted in place and in any case there was no way to get a purchase on it. So I found an extension socket exactly the right diameter to fit over the graphite bushing, and commenced hammering on that. As the bushing (shedding flakes as I went) moved inward, it pushed the second seal out ahead of it, following it like the birth of a twin.

I wire-brushed and cleaned up the pump body and it's pretty as you please, ready for new seals and bushing.

Problem: no slinger washer anywhere in evidence. It never made its presence known. I wonder if it's possible that it fell out through the drain hole when I pulled the pump from the engine block? Naturally it's the one part not included with the rebuild kit. I've written to Torresen Marine to ask if they might send me one.

Thanks again,
Carter

[Warren S]

A whopping $2.64 ea.

You encountered the same experience as I, only I didn't have a replacement carbon bushing, hence the "work around" described above.

Good luck.

[Carter Brey]

A whopping $2.64 ea.

You encountered the same experience as I, only I didn't have a replacement carbon bushing, hence the "work around" described above.

Good luck.

Okay, I have the graphite bushing and the first lip seal installed. They call this a "slight" force fit. Hah. Even with putting the parts in the freezer and slathering the mating surfaces with Morey's and silicon lube, and using a press, this was a very difficult job.

Now... before installing the second lip seal, I have to put the slinger washer in. As you will observe from the photograph, the slinger is dome-shaped. Which way does the convex end go? Facing the impeller-side seal or the oil-side seal? The exploded drawing shows a simple object (#12) with bilateral symmetry, but this is the correct part and it is not symmetrical. The lip seals (#11) both present the same face to the slinger.



The shop manual exploded drawing:



Thank you very much!

Carter Brey

[Rollergirl]

And of course, it isn't exactly your pump.
But you might find some useful tips.
http://www.pbase.com/mainecruising/raw_ ... ump&page=1

This guy Maine Sail is very well grounded.

Bill

[Warren S]

This won't instill a whole lot of confidence, but I put mine back in the same position as the one that came out: with convex end facing the water seal.

If I knew what this thing actually did, we might be able to make an edu-micated guess! is it supposed to sling leaking oil, or leaking water?

[Carter Brey]

This won't instill a whole lot of confidence, but I put mine back in the same position as the one that came out: with convex end facing the water seal.

If I knew what this thing actually did, we might be able to make an edu-micated guess! is it supposed to sling leaking oil, or leaking water?

I did the same as Warren, if only because with the slinger in that position, I could work the shaft through, whereas with the convex end pointing toward the oil seal, it would try to worm its way through the rubber of the lip seal as I pushed the shaft against and through it.

Bill, yes, that website's a wonderful resource. I also used my Dremel to bring back that magic shine.

Thanks, everyone. I think I'm done with water pump rebuilding for now.

Carter

[Sea Hunt]

Hello Carter:

What model Dremel and attachment did you use to "bring back that magic shine" I have a couple of winches and a bowsprit( ) that I believe are all bronze and that I would like to return to "magic shine" condition if possible.

I currently have the Dremel Multi-Max (#6300-01) with the standard attachments.

I assume there also must be some chemical, paste or solution that is applied before, during or after application of the Dremel.

Your suggestions are much appreciated. Thanks