MOB Drill time
Moderator: Jim Walsh
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- Posts: 32
- Joined: Mar 30th, '05, 21:24
- Location: CD-27 "Impromptu" Pine Island Marina, Groton CT
MOB Drill time
Local daily newspapers in the Northeast yesterday and today report that a search has ended for a 65 year old man who fell off his 32 foot sailboat just off the Rhode Island coast at 5 pm Monday with seas around 1 foot and winds about 12 kts. He was hit by the boom; his wife was left on the boat.
Maybe the blow from the boom was what did him in, but we'll be doing some MOB drills on Impromptu this weekend. If you want more details on the accident, google "Bernard Mochan."
Maybe the blow from the boom was what did him in, but we'll be doing some MOB drills on Impromptu this weekend. If you want more details on the accident, google "Bernard Mochan."
Paul McCary
Impromptu
Pine Island Marina
Impromptu
Pine Island Marina
I've been promising myself and crew that MOB drills will be done regularly aboard "Puffin" this year, but we haven't had one yet... The elements I'm aware of are, 1. Throw a throwable 2. Assign one crew to watch the MOB continuously 3. Avoid gybing, better to bear off, round up, tack, bear off, approach MOB upwind 4. Sheet in boom to make the cockpit area safer 5. Throw the MOB line to the swimmer 6. Haul in the MOB 7. If the motor is on, make sure it's in neutral near the swimmer.
One sailor I know says his system is to immediately heave to and decide what to do.
Any comments would be appreciated.
Puffin is on Lake Superior now. On my last outting the weather observations included surface water temperature of 38 degrees. An article I read last winter in Sea Kayaker Magazine said that any water below 70 degrees can cause cold shock. Their conclusions about cold shock included, dress for the water temperature not the air temp, avoid shouting because cold shock puts the respiration rate into a very rapid and ineffective rate, and always wear a PFD.
I had decided against harnesses and safety lines, but I've begun to rethink that.
One sailor I know says his system is to immediately heave to and decide what to do.
Any comments would be appreciated.
Puffin is on Lake Superior now. On my last outting the weather observations included surface water temperature of 38 degrees. An article I read last winter in Sea Kayaker Magazine said that any water below 70 degrees can cause cold shock. Their conclusions about cold shock included, dress for the water temperature not the air temp, avoid shouting because cold shock puts the respiration rate into a very rapid and ineffective rate, and always wear a PFD.
I had decided against harnesses and safety lines, but I've begun to rethink that.
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Retrieval - The most neglected part
Dave,
You left off the most important step, and that's retrieval. Even if you can get them to the boat, if they can't board the boat they're still dead. We had a very sobering MOB drill on a MOORING once. It was a beautiful day, sun was shining, and we had everything going in our favor. A teenager went swimming and we went through the retrieval drill using a halyard and winch. It became very obvious that I was the only one on board strong enough to winch him on-board. That's when I realized if it was me in the water, my wife and children would not have been able to winch me aboard. In talking to other boaters, it seems very few people actually practice the retrieval part of the MOB drill. The other skills are important too, but the most important one (second to staying on the boat) gets neglected.
The lesson learned from this drill was, concentrate most of your efforts in ensuring you STAY ON THE BOAT![Exclamation :!:](./images/smilies/icon_exclaim.gif)
Oh, and service your winches regularly. You never know when the life of someone you love will depend on them.
You left off the most important step, and that's retrieval. Even if you can get them to the boat, if they can't board the boat they're still dead. We had a very sobering MOB drill on a MOORING once. It was a beautiful day, sun was shining, and we had everything going in our favor. A teenager went swimming and we went through the retrieval drill using a halyard and winch. It became very obvious that I was the only one on board strong enough to winch him on-board. That's when I realized if it was me in the water, my wife and children would not have been able to winch me aboard. In talking to other boaters, it seems very few people actually practice the retrieval part of the MOB drill. The other skills are important too, but the most important one (second to staying on the boat) gets neglected.
The lesson learned from this drill was, concentrate most of your efforts in ensuring you STAY ON THE BOAT
![Exclamation :!:](./images/smilies/icon_exclaim.gif)
Oh, and service your winches regularly. You never know when the life of someone you love will depend on them.
CDSOA Commodore - Member No. 725
"The more I expand the island of my knowledge, the more I expand the shoreline of my wonder"
Sir Isaac Newton
"The more I expand the island of my knowledge, the more I expand the shoreline of my wonder"
Sir Isaac Newton
another method
in reference to carls point about the strength it takes to lift the MOB back into the boat, here's an idea.
if you have a boom vang on board, it can easily be rigged to assist. the vang on my boat is a 4 t0 1 purchase which can reduce a 200lb man to 50lbs. you can also combine the vang with your winch for additional leverage.
this method, with a little practice should allow just about any member of the crew to handle the job if they know what to do.
darrell
![Smile :)](./images/smilies/icon_smile.gif)
![Idea :idea:](./images/smilies/icon_idea.gif)
if you have a boom vang on board, it can easily be rigged to assist. the vang on my boat is a 4 t0 1 purchase which can reduce a 200lb man to 50lbs. you can also combine the vang with your winch for additional leverage.
this method, with a little practice should allow just about any member of the crew to handle the job if they know what to do.
darrell
![Smile :)](./images/smilies/icon_smile.gif)
Lifting point with boom vang?
Darrell,
In using the boom vang for lifting, what do you use as a lifting point/attachment for the vang? Would the boom end or spinaker pole be appropriate? Since I'm new to "big" boats I have been pondering this.
Chris
In using the boom vang for lifting, what do you use as a lifting point/attachment for the vang? Would the boom end or spinaker pole be appropriate? Since I'm new to "big" boats I have been pondering this.
Chris
Practice Prevention
I encourage everyone to practice preventative measures to stay aboard. The difficulty of recovering a victim alongside cannot be overstated. The risk of injury is very high. Teach your crew these simple but often neglected practices:
1. CROUCH
Always crouch when walking fore and aft. Most lifelines are too low and the upper lifelines often come near the creases behind your knees - very dangerous. If you fall backwards, this helps propel you overboard. Crouch to bring your leg creases below lifeline height.
2. GRASP-LOOK-MOVE
Don't move unless you're holding onto something. This applies inport, at anchor or mooring or underway. People have died falling overboard inport with no one around.
3. POWER-GRIP
Strengthen your grip. Use a tennis ball or similar device. This takes little effort.
4. GET A PFD TO THE VICTIM
If a person goes into the water without a PFD, throw one to them right away (preferably a bulky Type I). Stow extra PFDs in aft lockers or lazarette. In water temperatures below 77F (cold water immersion), you have less than 4 minutes before you lose feeling in your hands. This is pre-hypothermic condition known as "loss of performance". You'll start losing the ability to grasp, clutch or hold onto objects.
5. TEACH YOUR CREW IN-THE-WATER PFD DONNING
You must train your crew how to don a PFD in the water. You cannot don an inflatable or Type I, II or III PFD in the water the same way you don one on land. I demonstrate this on dry land, on the knees with a table at chin height to simulate the water surface. Even neophyte crew members learn this vital procedure in about 2-3 minutes.
Best - Cap'n J
1. CROUCH
Always crouch when walking fore and aft. Most lifelines are too low and the upper lifelines often come near the creases behind your knees - very dangerous. If you fall backwards, this helps propel you overboard. Crouch to bring your leg creases below lifeline height.
2. GRASP-LOOK-MOVE
Don't move unless you're holding onto something. This applies inport, at anchor or mooring or underway. People have died falling overboard inport with no one around.
3. POWER-GRIP
Strengthen your grip. Use a tennis ball or similar device. This takes little effort.
4. GET A PFD TO THE VICTIM
If a person goes into the water without a PFD, throw one to them right away (preferably a bulky Type I). Stow extra PFDs in aft lockers or lazarette. In water temperatures below 77F (cold water immersion), you have less than 4 minutes before you lose feeling in your hands. This is pre-hypothermic condition known as "loss of performance". You'll start losing the ability to grasp, clutch or hold onto objects.
5. TEACH YOUR CREW IN-THE-WATER PFD DONNING
You must train your crew how to don a PFD in the water. You cannot don an inflatable or Type I, II or III PFD in the water the same way you don one on land. I demonstrate this on dry land, on the knees with a table at chin height to simulate the water surface. Even neophyte crew members learn this vital procedure in about 2-3 minutes.
Best - Cap'n J
- Cathy Monaghan
- Posts: 3503
- Joined: Feb 5th, '05, 08:17
- Location: 1986 CD32 Realization #3, Rahway, NJ, Raritan Bay -- CDSOA Member since 2000. Greenline 39 Electra
- Contact:
Use block & tackle on halyard...
Hi Carl,
As Darrell pointed out, you need to use a block and tackle (like the boom vang) attached to the LifeSling (every sailboat should be equipped with one), then hoisting someone aboard is relatively easy. I know because I've done it and I know Marcia can do it too.
If you don't want to use the boom vang (it has to be removed from the boom and mast/deck then attached to halyard), keep a block and tackle in the bottom of the LifeSling bag.
The tackle to hoist the victim is attached to any convenient halyard. A spinnaker halyard is the most convenient, otherwise, use the main halyard. The tip of the tackle, when hoisted, should be about 10 feet above the deck. The block and tackle, with the tail run through a block on the rail then to a sheet winch, will do the job.
The lower block of the tackle shackles into the loop in the LifeSling tether. The tail is put around the most convenient winch (it need not be the biggest) and the MOB hoisted clear of the water. It's a slow process with ALOT of cranking involved. So don't think that you'll have someone out of the water in just a couple of minutes.
Assuming the MOB is conscious and functioning, he should be able to help himself as soon as his feet get to the rail.
This is not a comfortable process for the MOB. They may complain that you're hurting them, but it's either put up with a little pain or die.
Take a look at this article from the Practical Sailor web site. There are illustrations that should help.
http://www.practical-sailor.com/marine/lifesling.pdf
Hope this helps,
Cathy
CD32 Realization, #3
Rahway, NJ
Raritan Bay
As Darrell pointed out, you need to use a block and tackle (like the boom vang) attached to the LifeSling (every sailboat should be equipped with one), then hoisting someone aboard is relatively easy. I know because I've done it and I know Marcia can do it too.
If you don't want to use the boom vang (it has to be removed from the boom and mast/deck then attached to halyard), keep a block and tackle in the bottom of the LifeSling bag.
The tackle to hoist the victim is attached to any convenient halyard. A spinnaker halyard is the most convenient, otherwise, use the main halyard. The tip of the tackle, when hoisted, should be about 10 feet above the deck. The block and tackle, with the tail run through a block on the rail then to a sheet winch, will do the job.
The lower block of the tackle shackles into the loop in the LifeSling tether. The tail is put around the most convenient winch (it need not be the biggest) and the MOB hoisted clear of the water. It's a slow process with ALOT of cranking involved. So don't think that you'll have someone out of the water in just a couple of minutes.
Assuming the MOB is conscious and functioning, he should be able to help himself as soon as his feet get to the rail.
This is not a comfortable process for the MOB. They may complain that you're hurting them, but it's either put up with a little pain or die.
Take a look at this article from the Practical Sailor web site. There are illustrations that should help.
http://www.practical-sailor.com/marine/lifesling.pdf
Hope this helps,
Cathy
CD32 Realization, #3
Rahway, NJ
Raritan Bay
- Lew Gresham
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- henry hey
- Posts: 192
- Joined: Oct 14th, '06, 00:48
- Location: Former owner: CD25 - 'Homeward Bound' hull #711. Now sailing with C. Brey aboard Sabre 28 Delphine
MOB
Ah the MOB procedures.
American Sailing Association teaches the figure 8 method -- which works quite well under sail:
1) appoint a spotter (if you have the personnel) who's only job is to keep an eye on the person overboard (and to keep themselves safe and aboard).
2) throw lots of stuff in the direction to create a debris field and perhaps allow them something to grab on to. The coast guard tells you to throw anything that floats -- with the idea that you will retrieve it all later.
3) sail off on a beam reach
4) tack around, release the jib and sail back on main alone
5) approach downwind and turn upwind of the victim at the last second - slowing enough (essentially stopping) and putting the boat to windward of the victim as to shelter the person from sea and swells and to assure that if there is drift it will be toward and not away from the victim.
Of course the coast guard teaches that you make a Williamson turn - turning a course to starboard at 60 degrees and then turning back to port on a reciprocal course.
This appears to be a fairly accurate representation of these procedures:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anderson_turn
The methodology for MOB procedure has been debated so many times and it's still often discussed.
I have a life sling aboard my boat. It allows you to make a circular course around the victim and therefore assure a good chance of retrieval. You can also (I believe) use the same line and attached sling to haul a victim aboard.
In any event. . you really can't get good at MOB without a lot of practice. . . and all of these folks are right that the hardest part will be getting that wet, tired, and possibly unconscious victim up over your freeboard.
One thing that I have seen people practice is the one handed bowline. This allows someone to toss you a line and for you to tie it around yourself in a bowline.
http://www.animatedknots.com/bowlineonehand/index.php
- henry
American Sailing Association teaches the figure 8 method -- which works quite well under sail:
1) appoint a spotter (if you have the personnel) who's only job is to keep an eye on the person overboard (and to keep themselves safe and aboard).
2) throw lots of stuff in the direction to create a debris field and perhaps allow them something to grab on to. The coast guard tells you to throw anything that floats -- with the idea that you will retrieve it all later.
3) sail off on a beam reach
4) tack around, release the jib and sail back on main alone
5) approach downwind and turn upwind of the victim at the last second - slowing enough (essentially stopping) and putting the boat to windward of the victim as to shelter the person from sea and swells and to assure that if there is drift it will be toward and not away from the victim.
Of course the coast guard teaches that you make a Williamson turn - turning a course to starboard at 60 degrees and then turning back to port on a reciprocal course.
This appears to be a fairly accurate representation of these procedures:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anderson_turn
The methodology for MOB procedure has been debated so many times and it's still often discussed.
I have a life sling aboard my boat. It allows you to make a circular course around the victim and therefore assure a good chance of retrieval. You can also (I believe) use the same line and attached sling to haul a victim aboard.
In any event. . you really can't get good at MOB without a lot of practice. . . and all of these folks are right that the hardest part will be getting that wet, tired, and possibly unconscious victim up over your freeboard.
One thing that I have seen people practice is the one handed bowline. This allows someone to toss you a line and for you to tie it around yourself in a bowline.
http://www.animatedknots.com/bowlineonehand/index.php
- henry
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- Joined: Nov 21st, '05, 08:20
- Location: CD28 Cruiser "Loon" Poorhouse Cove, ME
Guess I Need to Practice Some More
I really like the idea of putting a block and tackle in the bottom of the Lifesling. Well, if every boat should be equipped with one, mine isn't. But it will be. Thanks!
CDSOA Commodore - Member No. 725
"The more I expand the island of my knowledge, the more I expand the shoreline of my wonder"
Sir Isaac Newton
"The more I expand the island of my knowledge, the more I expand the shoreline of my wonder"
Sir Isaac Newton
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- Joined: Feb 5th, '05, 17:25
- Location: s/v LIQUIDITY, CD28. We sail from Marina Bay on Boston Harbor. Try us on channel 9.
- Contact:
Henry,
Several comments on MOB protocol:
>>appoint a spotter ...<<
If you're training crew, the person seeing the MOB yells, points and continues pointing. That's the responsible person until he's certain he's been relieved by someone else. By the way, my ship lost a MOB once. My friend had him in sight through the big binoculars until an officer told him to move aside so the officer could look. Visual contact was lost and so was the sailor.
>>The coast guard tells you to throw anything that floats -- with the idea that you will retrieve it all later.<<
Those square cushions are easily replaced. They do make good practice MOB "victims" but I suggest you not throw "anything that floats" when you are just practicing.
I suggest that MOB can be drilled in separate drills. One is to get the boat back to the MOB. Another is to get the MOB back on board.
>>sail off on a beam reach<<
This actually terrifies the person in the water. I thought conventional wisdom was to just turn the boat, toss the Lifesling and keep circling until the MOB and the Lifesling connect.
>>tack around, release the jib and sail back on main alone<<
Tack around, don't release the jib and keep circling.
>>Of course the coast guard teaches that you make a Williamson turn - turning a course to starboard at 60 degrees and then turning back to port on a reciprocal course.<<
That's good if you're driving an oil tanker with a big turning circle and you need to backtrack to find the MOB. I think that with a 28' boat, I can just turn around.
>>I have a life sling aboard my boat. It allows you to make a circular course around the victim and therefore assure a good chance of retrieval.<<
Which, I agree, makes more sense than trying to remember beam reaches and fancy turning schemes.
Several comments on MOB protocol:
>>appoint a spotter ...<<
If you're training crew, the person seeing the MOB yells, points and continues pointing. That's the responsible person until he's certain he's been relieved by someone else. By the way, my ship lost a MOB once. My friend had him in sight through the big binoculars until an officer told him to move aside so the officer could look. Visual contact was lost and so was the sailor.
>>The coast guard tells you to throw anything that floats -- with the idea that you will retrieve it all later.<<
Those square cushions are easily replaced. They do make good practice MOB "victims" but I suggest you not throw "anything that floats" when you are just practicing.
I suggest that MOB can be drilled in separate drills. One is to get the boat back to the MOB. Another is to get the MOB back on board.
>>sail off on a beam reach<<
This actually terrifies the person in the water. I thought conventional wisdom was to just turn the boat, toss the Lifesling and keep circling until the MOB and the Lifesling connect.
>>tack around, release the jib and sail back on main alone<<
Tack around, don't release the jib and keep circling.
>>Of course the coast guard teaches that you make a Williamson turn - turning a course to starboard at 60 degrees and then turning back to port on a reciprocal course.<<
That's good if you're driving an oil tanker with a big turning circle and you need to backtrack to find the MOB. I think that with a 28' boat, I can just turn around.
>>I have a life sling aboard my boat. It allows you to make a circular course around the victim and therefore assure a good chance of retrieval.<<
Which, I agree, makes more sense than trying to remember beam reaches and fancy turning schemes.
Fair winds, Neil
s/v LIQUIDITY
Cape Dory 28 #167
Boston, MA
CDSOA member #698
s/v LIQUIDITY
Cape Dory 28 #167
Boston, MA
CDSOA member #698
- Cathy Monaghan
- Posts: 3503
- Joined: Feb 5th, '05, 08:17
- Location: 1986 CD32 Realization #3, Rahway, NJ, Raritan Bay -- CDSOA Member since 2000. Greenline 39 Electra
- Contact:
Re: Guess I Need to Practice Some More
Hi Carl,
Cathy
CD32 Realization, #3
Rahway, NJ
Raritan Bay
Marcia will feel alot better knowing that she can hoist you out of the water and you'll feel even better knowing that she can save your life. The halyard/LifeSling/block & tackle/winch combination make it possible. Now all we (that's all of us) have to do is practice. Hope the water warms up.Carl Thunberg wrote:I really like the idea of putting a block and tackle in the bottom of the Lifesling. Well, if every boat should be equipped with one, mine isn't. But it will be. Thanks!
Cathy
CD32 Realization, #3
Rahway, NJ
Raritan Bay
Prepare Before the Event
I might suggest making up a separate block and tackle set and stowing it with your lifesling equipment. In an emergency, it might be difficult to try to disengage the vang and then slack ten feet of falls without fouling.
You'll also want to make sure you have enough line for the falls, and from the hauling part to the snatch block and back to the winch, with some tail left over. Nothing worse than getting your gear set up to find out you're short on line.
Making and Marking Your Tackle
* Make a double purchase. This takes two double blocks, one having a becket. This gives a 4:1 advantage when hoisting (rove to disadvantage).
* On the floor or pier, stretch out the falls ten feet between the blocks. Wrap velcro ties along the falls, staggered every few inches. This keeps the falls together and helps prevent fouling. In an emergency, it takes only a second or two to strip off the velcro straps.
* Remember to raise the tackle rove to disadvantage. Attach the block with the hauling part to your halyard. As Cathy suggested, use the main or spinnaker halyard.
* Mark that end of the tackle that attaches to the halyard. Use bright colored tape or paint. This helps in trying conditions, such as rough weather or nighttime.
Alternative Methods
You may also want to have the "Elevator Recovery Method" in your ditty bag of alternative overboard recovery methods.
What You'll Need
* long, large diameter line
* snatch block
* sheet winch
Action Steps
* Stop boat alongside person.
* Drop the lifelines in the recovery area.
* Attach one end of the line to a cleat forward of the recovery area.
* Loop the line into the water, under the persons feet and back up through the snatch block and back to the sheet winch.
* Have the person stand on the bite of the line and brace themselves on the hull or hold on to the gunwale.
* Slowly grind on the winch to raise the "elevator" high enough for recovery.
Best - J.
You'll also want to make sure you have enough line for the falls, and from the hauling part to the snatch block and back to the winch, with some tail left over. Nothing worse than getting your gear set up to find out you're short on line.
Making and Marking Your Tackle
* Make a double purchase. This takes two double blocks, one having a becket. This gives a 4:1 advantage when hoisting (rove to disadvantage).
* On the floor or pier, stretch out the falls ten feet between the blocks. Wrap velcro ties along the falls, staggered every few inches. This keeps the falls together and helps prevent fouling. In an emergency, it takes only a second or two to strip off the velcro straps.
* Remember to raise the tackle rove to disadvantage. Attach the block with the hauling part to your halyard. As Cathy suggested, use the main or spinnaker halyard.
* Mark that end of the tackle that attaches to the halyard. Use bright colored tape or paint. This helps in trying conditions, such as rough weather or nighttime.
Alternative Methods
You may also want to have the "Elevator Recovery Method" in your ditty bag of alternative overboard recovery methods.
What You'll Need
* long, large diameter line
* snatch block
* sheet winch
Action Steps
* Stop boat alongside person.
* Drop the lifelines in the recovery area.
* Attach one end of the line to a cleat forward of the recovery area.
* Loop the line into the water, under the persons feet and back up through the snatch block and back to the sheet winch.
* Have the person stand on the bite of the line and brace themselves on the hull or hold on to the gunwale.
* Slowly grind on the winch to raise the "elevator" high enough for recovery.
Best - J.
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- Location: Cape Dory 33 "Rover" Hull #66
Sharing The Obvious
One of the great things about this board is people sharing their ideas, frequently pointing out the obvious to those of us moving at a slower intellectual pace. We have always had a block and tackle available to use with the Lifesling, but it keeps diving deeper into the cockpit locker. I know it should be more readily available, but where to keep it? So Cathy says put it in the bottom of the Lifesling bag....Duh! Thanks.
Tom and Jean Keevil
CD33 Rover
Ashland OR and Ladysmith, BC
CD33 Rover
Ashland OR and Ladysmith, BC