Anyone know who it was?
I tried searching but came up with WAY too many results....
Cheers,
Neil
Someone on this board built a CD 25 rudder.....
Moderator: Jim Walsh
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neil
- Posts: 168
- Joined: Feb 5th, '05, 10:19
- Location: Splendid,
Cape Dory 25, hull # 253
Key West, The Conch Republic. - Contact:
Someone on this board built a CD 25 rudder.....
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Tynaje
- Posts: 14
- Joined: Nov 2nd, '06, 20:28
- Location: Cape Dory Typhoon Weekender(a friend suggested naming the boat DNR) no name, Westerly Rhode Island
- Contact:
HMMMMM,
How did I mess that up?
(ah, I quoted the other post and incorrectly replied there, sorry to all)
Hi Brian A,
You are not alone with a rudder problem. Through the years, I know of several owners who had rudder problems.
I have no idea how handy you are to build a new rudder for yourself, or if you have any friends who are able and competent to build one for you.
I wonder if Foss Foam gave you an estimate for how much a new rudder assembly will cost? Whatever they will charge, you or a local person can build your own complete rudder assembly for a small fraction of what a commercial contractor would charge. (And save a bundle on shipping charges, too.)
FWIW, there is quite a bit of info on design and construction of a CD 25 rudder, along with pictures, in the archives. For anyone who is interested, go to Search, type in "New Rudder - Cape Dory 25" and scroll down to a post submitted by Chris Robin.
I had trouble raising the post, so I clicked on the last post of the thread by Carter and then worked my way back to page #1 and the original post.
I'll be dipped if I can remember the title or heading of the post in which I submitted pictures of the construction stages as the rudder was being built, but they're in the archives somewhere.
Consider using your options there's more than one way to skin a cat.
Good luck,
O J (John Dunn)
Neil,
I also searched using many different angles, still got nothing to be helpful to you. Johns post is from 05.. IF you dont have any luck in your search, send me an e-mail and I can lay out a very very easy approach to building your own, using affordable materials etc. readily available in your neck of the coral.
I usually build high end carbon parts but this done correctly can be fun.
BTW, I like the photo of fellow yard residents in your www photo. classic.
How did I mess that up?
(ah, I quoted the other post and incorrectly replied there, sorry to all)
Hi Brian A,
You are not alone with a rudder problem. Through the years, I know of several owners who had rudder problems.
I have no idea how handy you are to build a new rudder for yourself, or if you have any friends who are able and competent to build one for you.
I wonder if Foss Foam gave you an estimate for how much a new rudder assembly will cost? Whatever they will charge, you or a local person can build your own complete rudder assembly for a small fraction of what a commercial contractor would charge. (And save a bundle on shipping charges, too.)
FWIW, there is quite a bit of info on design and construction of a CD 25 rudder, along with pictures, in the archives. For anyone who is interested, go to Search, type in "New Rudder - Cape Dory 25" and scroll down to a post submitted by Chris Robin.
I had trouble raising the post, so I clicked on the last post of the thread by Carter and then worked my way back to page #1 and the original post.
I'll be dipped if I can remember the title or heading of the post in which I submitted pictures of the construction stages as the rudder was being built, but they're in the archives somewhere.
Consider using your options there's more than one way to skin a cat.
Good luck,
O J (John Dunn)
Neil,
I also searched using many different angles, still got nothing to be helpful to you. Johns post is from 05.. IF you dont have any luck in your search, send me an e-mail and I can lay out a very very easy approach to building your own, using affordable materials etc. readily available in your neck of the coral.
I usually build high end carbon parts but this done correctly can be fun.
BTW, I like the photo of fellow yard residents in your www photo. classic.
This is from a posting I made last November regarding the repair of Simpatico's damaged rudder. I hope this helps:
"I can empathize with your misfortune. The rudder on my CD25 was seriously damaged when she came off her mooring in a storm last year. The SS post was bent and the glass along the forward and bottom edges was badly cracked. After considering several alternatives, I elected to have my yard do the repair in-house. They sent the old rudder post to a local metal fabricator for reproduction. The only difference in the new post is that the internal "spokes" are beefier than the original. The yard then laid the new post into the old glass outer shell and sandwiched the whole thing back together. The finished rudder was reglassed and faired. It looks and feels better than the original. I have only done in-water inspections since she was launched last Spring and everything looked fine. I'll have the opportunity to conduct a closer inspection when she is hauled in a few weeks. I don't recall what the cost of the rudder repair was, but the tab for all the repairs was over $10k. I could have had the boat declared a total loss, but just couldn't bear to do it. I'm happy to report that Simpatico is back and better than ever. I'll try to put up a post with photos in the near future."
P.S. The rudder still looks fine. The total repair cost included more than just the rudder. The other work included replacement of teak, reglassing the bottom of the keel, and other misc. yard fees. Cheers, Brian
"I can empathize with your misfortune. The rudder on my CD25 was seriously damaged when she came off her mooring in a storm last year. The SS post was bent and the glass along the forward and bottom edges was badly cracked. After considering several alternatives, I elected to have my yard do the repair in-house. They sent the old rudder post to a local metal fabricator for reproduction. The only difference in the new post is that the internal "spokes" are beefier than the original. The yard then laid the new post into the old glass outer shell and sandwiched the whole thing back together. The finished rudder was reglassed and faired. It looks and feels better than the original. I have only done in-water inspections since she was launched last Spring and everything looked fine. I'll have the opportunity to conduct a closer inspection when she is hauled in a few weeks. I don't recall what the cost of the rudder repair was, but the tab for all the repairs was over $10k. I could have had the boat declared a total loss, but just couldn't bear to do it. I'm happy to report that Simpatico is back and better than ever. I'll try to put up a post with photos in the near future."
P.S. The rudder still looks fine. The total repair cost included more than just the rudder. The other work included replacement of teak, reglassing the bottom of the keel, and other misc. yard fees. Cheers, Brian
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Oswego John
- Posts: 3535
- Joined: Feb 5th, '05, 20:42
- Location: '66 Typhoon "Grace", Hull # 42, Schooner "Ontario", CD 85D Hull #1
CD 25 Rudder
Hi,
I've made several rudders for others, and have sent patterns, sketches and construction info to many other CD owners.
The average cost of a new rudder system is under $500 if you do most of the work yourself or have a handy person help you. It really isn't that difficult to do. This cost included SS welding. It excluded shipping costs.
I did send photos by snail mail to one person that I made a rudder for. The photos showed, in detail, the successive steps involved in constructing a rudder system. This included upgrading the original SS tangs inside the rudder blade. At one time, these photos and instructions were added to the archives.
I have a vague idea that perhaps the detailed info and photos in the archives were possibly erased, for whatever reason I haven't a clue. I don't even know if anyone can erase archive material.
Whatever, I have many original photos of rudder repair floating around, somewhere. All carefully filed away. Lol
Alas, one of my greatest disappointments in life is that I never learned how to transmit photos and sketches via internet. It would make life so much easier if I had that skill. (I do fondly remember certain kind souls who have offered to send my photos in to the board for me.) But I seem to be a belligerently independent sort of cuss who is bound and determined to learn how to do things for myself. So hang in there, they're coming. (Just don't decide to hold your breath until the pix arrive.)
Best regards to all, (hello Jakob)
O J
(John Dunn)
I've made several rudders for others, and have sent patterns, sketches and construction info to many other CD owners.
The average cost of a new rudder system is under $500 if you do most of the work yourself or have a handy person help you. It really isn't that difficult to do. This cost included SS welding. It excluded shipping costs.
I did send photos by snail mail to one person that I made a rudder for. The photos showed, in detail, the successive steps involved in constructing a rudder system. This included upgrading the original SS tangs inside the rudder blade. At one time, these photos and instructions were added to the archives.
I have a vague idea that perhaps the detailed info and photos in the archives were possibly erased, for whatever reason I haven't a clue. I don't even know if anyone can erase archive material.
Whatever, I have many original photos of rudder repair floating around, somewhere. All carefully filed away. Lol
Alas, one of my greatest disappointments in life is that I never learned how to transmit photos and sketches via internet. It would make life so much easier if I had that skill. (I do fondly remember certain kind souls who have offered to send my photos in to the board for me.) But I seem to be a belligerently independent sort of cuss who is bound and determined to learn how to do things for myself. So hang in there, they're coming. (Just don't decide to hold your breath until the pix arrive.)
Best regards to all, (hello Jakob)
O J
(John Dunn)
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neil
- Posts: 168
- Joined: Feb 5th, '05, 10:19
- Location: Splendid,
Cape Dory 25, hull # 253
Key West, The Conch Republic. - Contact:
Ahhh....
Thanks guys.
Since I got my boat there damage to the rudder cap and tiller strap, the strap was bent and the aft bolt hole in the cap was broken. When I hauled my boat I noticed that there was a bit of cracking along the rudder where the glass meets the shaft which I repaired with no problem and asked my friend Jim to have a look at the bronze parts, he fixed them in no time flat and I thought I was all set BUT NOOOOO.
My rudder is actually a bit bent, which is great on one tack, but annoying as hell on the other: on one the tiller sits nicely dead center in the cockpit and on the other it spends a good deal of time in my armpit!
This problem also drives my auto pilot insane....
Aside from rebending the rudder and thereby making it weaker I was thinking that maybe I could make the key-way wider to the exact angle that the rudder is bent to (about 3-5 degrees) and make a bigger key thus putting the tiller back where its supposed to be....
However I am now wondering if replacement is a better option...
MUMBLE MUMBLE THINK THINK THINK...........
I just dont know.....
Very annoying....
John, you said it costs about $500-ish to build? I could do that, but I dont think my glassing skills are quite there yet....
How much would you charge including shipping and your time and all that, and is there any way you could make it MUCH stronger?
Cheers,
Neil
Thanks guys.
Since I got my boat there damage to the rudder cap and tiller strap, the strap was bent and the aft bolt hole in the cap was broken. When I hauled my boat I noticed that there was a bit of cracking along the rudder where the glass meets the shaft which I repaired with no problem and asked my friend Jim to have a look at the bronze parts, he fixed them in no time flat and I thought I was all set BUT NOOOOO.
My rudder is actually a bit bent, which is great on one tack, but annoying as hell on the other: on one the tiller sits nicely dead center in the cockpit and on the other it spends a good deal of time in my armpit!
This problem also drives my auto pilot insane....
Aside from rebending the rudder and thereby making it weaker I was thinking that maybe I could make the key-way wider to the exact angle that the rudder is bent to (about 3-5 degrees) and make a bigger key thus putting the tiller back where its supposed to be....
However I am now wondering if replacement is a better option...
MUMBLE MUMBLE THINK THINK THINK...........
I just dont know.....
Very annoying....
John, you said it costs about $500-ish to build? I could do that, but I dont think my glassing skills are quite there yet....
How much would you charge including shipping and your time and all that, and is there any way you could make it MUCH stronger?
Cheers,
Neil
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Oswego John
- Posts: 3535
- Joined: Feb 5th, '05, 20:42
- Location: '66 Typhoon "Grace", Hull # 42, Schooner "Ontario", CD 85D Hull #1
CD 25 Rudder
Hi Neil,
This is the kind of reply that has both good news and bad news. Actually, the bad news isn't very bad.
When I mentioned that a rudder repair would/could cost roughly $500, that figure was the high end. As low as it is, compared to quotes ranging from $1,600 to as high as $2,900, $500 is comparatively cheap.
I don't like to see people suffer from sticker-shockitis. So I quote the high end and if the job comes in lower, they are elated no end.
From what I read, your rudder job should cost no more than half of $500, or thereabouts. Now, I think that that is fairly good news.
BTW, FWIW, I never made a nickel of profit when I made rudders for other CD owners. I only charged for material. That is for marine plywood, SS, epoxy and fiberglass cloth and tape. One quart of epoxy is not enough and a gallon is too much. We can't forget shipping costs. UPS, Fed Ex, etc.
If the rudder post is bent, I usually make a new one, ($50±). I don't rely on tangs welded to the shaft. I generally weld a trapezoid blade of the same metal to the rudder post. Without seeing it, I suppose that you have a SS post, 1" diameter.
Then I make a sandwich of 3/8" marine plywood, 3/4" total width, for the rudder blade. Then everything is glassed in with epoxy. I also wrap glass, forward from the port side of the blade around the post and back on the stb'd side of the blade to help seal out water pressure from entering the plywood sandwich.
This process is something a boatowner can do himself. If not sure, an experienced friend or hired hand can help over the troublesome spots.
The bad news, if you call it that, is that I'm not working anymore. Because of medical constraints, the good doctor has me 99% retired. I still putter around on the schooner we built. If I rest, I rust.
If it were me, I wouldn't recut my rudder post/tiller keyway and use a wider key. If you widen the keyway in the post, you'll also have to widen it in the tiller cap fitting.
I'm trying to envision how or why your tiller isn't in line with your rudder blade. I think that you should first ascertain what's going on, and then it's easier to diagnose and cure the problem. There is more than one way to skin a cat.
Tell us more.
O J
This is the kind of reply that has both good news and bad news. Actually, the bad news isn't very bad.
When I mentioned that a rudder repair would/could cost roughly $500, that figure was the high end. As low as it is, compared to quotes ranging from $1,600 to as high as $2,900, $500 is comparatively cheap.
I don't like to see people suffer from sticker-shockitis. So I quote the high end and if the job comes in lower, they are elated no end.
From what I read, your rudder job should cost no more than half of $500, or thereabouts. Now, I think that that is fairly good news.
BTW, FWIW, I never made a nickel of profit when I made rudders for other CD owners. I only charged for material. That is for marine plywood, SS, epoxy and fiberglass cloth and tape. One quart of epoxy is not enough and a gallon is too much. We can't forget shipping costs. UPS, Fed Ex, etc.
If the rudder post is bent, I usually make a new one, ($50±). I don't rely on tangs welded to the shaft. I generally weld a trapezoid blade of the same metal to the rudder post. Without seeing it, I suppose that you have a SS post, 1" diameter.
Then I make a sandwich of 3/8" marine plywood, 3/4" total width, for the rudder blade. Then everything is glassed in with epoxy. I also wrap glass, forward from the port side of the blade around the post and back on the stb'd side of the blade to help seal out water pressure from entering the plywood sandwich.
This process is something a boatowner can do himself. If not sure, an experienced friend or hired hand can help over the troublesome spots.
The bad news, if you call it that, is that I'm not working anymore. Because of medical constraints, the good doctor has me 99% retired. I still putter around on the schooner we built. If I rest, I rust.
If it were me, I wouldn't recut my rudder post/tiller keyway and use a wider key. If you widen the keyway in the post, you'll also have to widen it in the tiller cap fitting.
I'm trying to envision how or why your tiller isn't in line with your rudder blade. I think that you should first ascertain what's going on, and then it's easier to diagnose and cure the problem. There is more than one way to skin a cat.
Tell us more.
O J