So here I sit with a dilema. I have a CD25D that I finished making payments on in November. Because I am a private yacht Captain and am almost always everywhere but where my boat is, I haven't been able to sail her at all since I've paid it off. When I finally got a weekend to go up to the boat it wouldn't start. I went through all normal procedures (check battery power -good , change fuel filter, fill fuel tank, bleed fuel lines, check for obstruction of airflow -in and out). Still wouldn't start. I called the local Yanmar mechanic from Pompano Beach and he came down and quickly told me that there was a lack of compression. After a few quick checks he told me that my rings are most likely bad, and maybe a valve also. To have them do all of this work after labor and parts it would probably end up costing me upwards of $3000 or more. A new engine and transmission (and this is a 1GM10, so a couple more horses) is $4800.
I took the engine to another yanmar rep to get a second opinion and they said the same. (By the way, this is such an easy engine to remove!)
Does anyone have any other suggestions? Is there a cheaper way to get this rebuilt (without paying the pro fee of $100 per hour labor). If it does come to terms that I need to replace it, should I repower with this engine or is there a better, more powerful alternative?
Also, this all comes at the same time that I realised it was necessary to quit the boat I have been captaining for the past year. If the engine was working I would go take off to Central America for half a year, but I can't afford to do that if I need to replace this engine. I really want to do some travelling before I commit another year to another yacht. I bought this CD25D because I have this dream of circumnavigating in a small boat, and Vigor's book helped lead me this way. I won't be able to start this trip for 2 more years (roughly). I don't know if it makes sense for me to be paying dockage and insurance on a boat that I won't be able to use until 2 years from now. (Again, I won't be able to use it because I'm Captaining other peoples yachts between New England and the Bahamas and don't ever get planned time off). I'm wondering if I should just sell her and take a loss and then buy another boat closer to my departure date so I'm not paying 4 grand per year in dockage and insurance.
Looks like I need a bit of mechanical and situational counseling here right now. I know this is the right place, so lay it on me!
Brandon (aka Brenno)
1GM woes. Why oh why?
Moderator: Jim Walsh
-
Brandon
- Posts: 47
- Joined: May 1st, '06, 19:33
- Location: 1985 CD25D "Seamona" Hull#181
Fort Lauderdale, Fl
1GM woes. Why oh why?
The road goes ever on and on,
And I must follow it if I can,
Pursuing it with eager feet,
Until it meets some place
Where many paths and errands meet,
And whither then I cannot say.
B. Baggins
And I must follow it if I can,
Pursuing it with eager feet,
Until it meets some place
Where many paths and errands meet,
And whither then I cannot say.
B. Baggins
-
Dick Barthel
- Posts: 901
- Joined: Feb 5th, '05, 10:29
- Location: Dream Weaver, CD25D, Noank, CT
A few thoughts
You're going to take a beating selling her w/o a working engine but on the other hand you'd be saving $8,000. If you decide to repower consider a Beta Marine 13.5. They fit in nicely.
Decisions...decisions..
Dick
Decisions...decisions..
Dick
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Oswego John
- Posts: 3535
- Joined: Feb 5th, '05, 20:42
- Location: '66 Typhoon "Grace", Hull # 42, Schooner "Ontario", CD 85D Hull #1
Ailing 1GM Engine
Brenno,
Now that you're in between jobs, why not pay yourself $100 bucks an hour and do the job yourself? Now don't go telling us that you can't do the job. We're not buying that today. You can do it, even if you become the project manager and someone else does the actual work.
The 1GM engine is a relatively simple, easy engine to work on. The first thing I think that you should do is find out if you really do have low compression. Before testing, make sure your air intake is unobstructed, your throttle is wide open, and the battery is fully charged.
I hope that you have a repair and parts manual. If compression is low, using a feather or piece of tissue, while cranking the engine, look for a trace of compression leakage by passing the feather around the joint of the head/ block. Also check the oil sump for any water mixed in the oil. It might look tan and creamy, something like Bailey's Irish Cream.
After I wrote this, I reread your post and noticed that the Yanmar rep mentioned that you might need rings. Last time you ran it, was the engine smoking excessively?
One way to check for worn rings is a spoonful or so of heavy weight oil in the cyclinder to help briefly seal any leakage. If the rings are worn, it means a little more work that might prove to be a hidden blessing.
This description is getting long. More details can be given, but let me just say for now, pull the engine, pull the pan and piston assembly. With the engine out, more improvements can now be performed. With a little bit more effort and $$, you'll have a completely rebuilt engine. But we're trying to eliminate unnecessary steps, save time and $$ and get you back out sailing.
Any special tools needed, ie, ridge reamer, ring spreader, etc can be borrowed from most chain auto supply shops.
If it is determined that you have low compression, pull the head and have it checked for warpage. If necessary, have it milled. Look for signs of a blown head gasket.
With the head off, hit the starter briefly to check for cam shaft and valve operation. Observe the open/close operation. Use caution, without head compression that engine is going to fly. Clean up flying oil.
Check each valve. Look for excess wobble. Look for burnt edges of valve lips, especially exhaust. Replace parts where needed. Spin engine. adjust valve clearance. replace head gasket. Torque head bolts. Drain old liquids and replenish. Run engine. Retorque head bolts. Go sailing.
One more thing. Take a portion of the bundle of money you saved and give your mechanic a good tip. Take him sailing as crew and turn him on to CDs
This is as good a way as any to get to know your boat intimately. Roll up your sleeves and saddle up.
Good luck,
O J
Now that you're in between jobs, why not pay yourself $100 bucks an hour and do the job yourself? Now don't go telling us that you can't do the job. We're not buying that today. You can do it, even if you become the project manager and someone else does the actual work.
The 1GM engine is a relatively simple, easy engine to work on. The first thing I think that you should do is find out if you really do have low compression. Before testing, make sure your air intake is unobstructed, your throttle is wide open, and the battery is fully charged.
I hope that you have a repair and parts manual. If compression is low, using a feather or piece of tissue, while cranking the engine, look for a trace of compression leakage by passing the feather around the joint of the head/ block. Also check the oil sump for any water mixed in the oil. It might look tan and creamy, something like Bailey's Irish Cream.
After I wrote this, I reread your post and noticed that the Yanmar rep mentioned that you might need rings. Last time you ran it, was the engine smoking excessively?
One way to check for worn rings is a spoonful or so of heavy weight oil in the cyclinder to help briefly seal any leakage. If the rings are worn, it means a little more work that might prove to be a hidden blessing.
This description is getting long. More details can be given, but let me just say for now, pull the engine, pull the pan and piston assembly. With the engine out, more improvements can now be performed. With a little bit more effort and $$, you'll have a completely rebuilt engine. But we're trying to eliminate unnecessary steps, save time and $$ and get you back out sailing.
Any special tools needed, ie, ridge reamer, ring spreader, etc can be borrowed from most chain auto supply shops.
If it is determined that you have low compression, pull the head and have it checked for warpage. If necessary, have it milled. Look for signs of a blown head gasket.
With the head off, hit the starter briefly to check for cam shaft and valve operation. Observe the open/close operation. Use caution, without head compression that engine is going to fly. Clean up flying oil.
Check each valve. Look for excess wobble. Look for burnt edges of valve lips, especially exhaust. Replace parts where needed. Spin engine. adjust valve clearance. replace head gasket. Torque head bolts. Drain old liquids and replenish. Run engine. Retorque head bolts. Go sailing.
One more thing. Take a portion of the bundle of money you saved and give your mechanic a good tip. Take him sailing as crew and turn him on to CDs
This is as good a way as any to get to know your boat intimately. Roll up your sleeves and saddle up.
Good luck,
O J
Last edited by Oswego John on Mar 26th, '07, 16:09, edited 1 time in total.
Rebuild it
I concur with O.J. once you have determined its really compression, rebuild it yourself. Did anyone perform a compression test? If so what are the readings? Wet? Dry?
I did rings and valves on a Westerbeke 21A for about $1500 several years ago. Obviously I did most of the work myself. I hired a mechanic to do some portions of the work I didnt have the tools for. Ninety percent of the work is pure low skill wrench turning anyway. Since its out of the boat this should be an easy one.
She has run fine ever since, and its a great way to really learn your engine.
If it has compression problems you will get black soot out the exhaust when you crank it for an extended period of time.
Boyd
s/v Tern
CD30 MkII
Fort Lauderdale, Fla.
I did rings and valves on a Westerbeke 21A for about $1500 several years ago. Obviously I did most of the work myself. I hired a mechanic to do some portions of the work I didnt have the tools for. Ninety percent of the work is pure low skill wrench turning anyway. Since its out of the boat this should be an easy one.
She has run fine ever since, and its a great way to really learn your engine.
If it has compression problems you will get black soot out the exhaust when you crank it for an extended period of time.
Boyd
s/v Tern
CD30 MkII
Fort Lauderdale, Fla.
dig in
I'm in the OJ camp. You have the time you might as well pick up an engine repair manual and have at it.
But before you rip it apart are we to understand there were no preliminary symptoms - like steady degeneration of engine performance. If not you may want to try a couple more tests ( a complete list of causes would be in the repair manual ) like checking for sticking valves. A valve sticks even slightly open ( especially an exhaust since it vents to a place that is hard to notice the extra noise - the exhaust manifold ) and you get no compression. A burned valve could do the same thing.
Don't mean to challenge the experts on the scene - just want you to consider everything and you'll learn much much more by doing for yourself.
Good Luck
But before you rip it apart are we to understand there were no preliminary symptoms - like steady degeneration of engine performance. If not you may want to try a couple more tests ( a complete list of causes would be in the repair manual ) like checking for sticking valves. A valve sticks even slightly open ( especially an exhaust since it vents to a place that is hard to notice the extra noise - the exhaust manifold ) and you get no compression. A burned valve could do the same thing.
Don't mean to challenge the experts on the scene - just want you to consider everything and you'll learn much much more by doing for yourself.
Good Luck
-
Dick Kobayashi
- Posts: 596
- Joined: Apr 2nd, '05, 16:31
- Location: Former owner of 3 CDs, most recently Susan B, a 25D
Most Likely
"Valves are most likely bad" does not mean they are bad. What is odd about your story is that you do not describe progressive deterioration of performance which is more typical. If you pull the head you may find the problem is valves not rings - you can get a new head from Yanmar for about 1200 bucks plus or minus. I would take a very careful look at the engine and isolate the real problem - it might not be that bad. My 1 GM runs like a charm with its new head. All the advice of others on this thread make good sense too. And all of it points in one way or another to confirming the mechanics' diagnosis yourself.
Dick K
CD 25D Susan B #104
Mattapoisett, MA
Fleet Captain - Northeast Fleet 2014/2015
Tempus Fugit. And not only that, it goes by fast. (Ron Vacarro 1945 - 1971)
CD 25D Susan B #104
Mattapoisett, MA
Fleet Captain - Northeast Fleet 2014/2015
Tempus Fugit. And not only that, it goes by fast. (Ron Vacarro 1945 - 1971)
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Tom in Cambria
- Posts: 120
- Joined: Jan 29th, '06, 22:39
- Location: Cape Dory 31
Something puzzling
I'm confused. Do you mean that you heard this engine run and it ran fine during the trial sail and then it sat idle for an extended period while you did other things? Or do you mean that you bought this boat without ever hearing the engine run and now that you paid it off, you tried to start it for the very first time and it wouldn't start? It seems unlikely to me that an engine that was running would lose compression while it sat without being run. Fuel sitting for a long time tends to go bad and you can plug up even a new filter surprisingly quickly, but I would think that it would run for a little while before it plugged up again. If you suspect the fuel you can rig up a coffee can with a hose so that you can feed directly into the injector pump and thus bypass all the lines, filters and pumps completely.
If you've measured the compression and know that it's a compression problem the previous posts are all to the point. A fair amount of the cost of a rebuild is in taking the engine out and putting it back. This you can do yourself even with little time and no knowledge. It's just a matter of unbolting things and disconnecting hoses and so on. Once it's out on a bench and all cleaned up, a machine shop or mechanic can do the checks mentioned pretty quickly so that it isn't that costly even at $ 100 an hour. Yanmar provides exceptionally fine service manuals with everything you need to know, so that if you want to tackle it yourself, it's easier than with many engines. If you want to leave it to the experts, this is a good time to clean your tank, replace all the hoses, motor mounts, clean and paint the bilge etc which you will want to do anyway if you're spending the money on a rebuild.
Even with the usual wait for parts to be ordered and delivered they should be able to do this in a couple of weeks. Drop it off at the shop and by the time you get back with a pocketful of pay from the delivery it should be ready and waiting for you to set it back in place.
When you shut off an engine at least some of the valves will be open and this allows the salt air to enter at least one cylinder and go to work on the rings and walls of the cylinder which are plain steel and not stainless of course. I'm sure you know that a boat engine should be run every couple of weeks to circulate the oil and coat the interior of the engine because the saltwater environment attacks all that non-stainless metal and rusts it -- unlike a car that can sit in a garage for a long time and still start right up.
You didn't say how long it's been that you've been paying the boat off, but if you've been running the engine every two weeks all that time, it seems strange that all of a sudden it won't start and has no compression. If the engine is worn out, it seems like you would have come up against this before now and probably at the time of purchase. As the others have suggested, I'd make sure the engine is worn out before tackling a big project like a rebuild. It certainly sounds like there is something else going on here like you've blown out the head gasket, or sucked water back through the exhaust. Engines don't usually wear out sitting idle, but many other bad things can happen to them while idle or if you crank for a long time without the engine starting.
Just my two cents worth FWIW
If you've measured the compression and know that it's a compression problem the previous posts are all to the point. A fair amount of the cost of a rebuild is in taking the engine out and putting it back. This you can do yourself even with little time and no knowledge. It's just a matter of unbolting things and disconnecting hoses and so on. Once it's out on a bench and all cleaned up, a machine shop or mechanic can do the checks mentioned pretty quickly so that it isn't that costly even at $ 100 an hour. Yanmar provides exceptionally fine service manuals with everything you need to know, so that if you want to tackle it yourself, it's easier than with many engines. If you want to leave it to the experts, this is a good time to clean your tank, replace all the hoses, motor mounts, clean and paint the bilge etc which you will want to do anyway if you're spending the money on a rebuild.
Even with the usual wait for parts to be ordered and delivered they should be able to do this in a couple of weeks. Drop it off at the shop and by the time you get back with a pocketful of pay from the delivery it should be ready and waiting for you to set it back in place.
When you shut off an engine at least some of the valves will be open and this allows the salt air to enter at least one cylinder and go to work on the rings and walls of the cylinder which are plain steel and not stainless of course. I'm sure you know that a boat engine should be run every couple of weeks to circulate the oil and coat the interior of the engine because the saltwater environment attacks all that non-stainless metal and rusts it -- unlike a car that can sit in a garage for a long time and still start right up.
You didn't say how long it's been that you've been paying the boat off, but if you've been running the engine every two weeks all that time, it seems strange that all of a sudden it won't start and has no compression. If the engine is worn out, it seems like you would have come up against this before now and probably at the time of purchase. As the others have suggested, I'd make sure the engine is worn out before tackling a big project like a rebuild. It certainly sounds like there is something else going on here like you've blown out the head gasket, or sucked water back through the exhaust. Engines don't usually wear out sitting idle, but many other bad things can happen to them while idle or if you crank for a long time without the engine starting.
Just my two cents worth FWIW
Definitely rebuild it yourself.
The trick is to find a trustworthy auto machine shop to do all the hard stuff. They will micromeasure, tell you what is out of spec. and do things like rebuild the head and bore or resleeve (not sure which for a Yanmar) the cylinders, etc. and then give the components back to you for reassembly.
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Dick Kobayashi
- Posts: 596
- Joined: Apr 2nd, '05, 16:31
- Location: Former owner of 3 CDs, most recently Susan B, a 25D
Most Likely
"Valves are most likely bad" does not mean they are bad. What is odd about your story is that you do not describe progressive deterioration of performance which is more typical. If you pull the head you may find the problem is valves not rings - you can get a new head from Yanmar for about 1200 bucks plus or minus. I would take a very careful look at the engine and isolate the real problem - it might not be that bad. My 1 GM runs like a charm with its new head. All the advice of others on this thread make good sense too. And all of it points in one way or another to confirming the mechanics' diagnosis yourself.
Dick K
CD 25D Susan B #104
Mattapoisett, MA
Fleet Captain - Northeast Fleet 2014/2015
Tempus Fugit. And not only that, it goes by fast. (Ron Vacarro 1945 - 1971)
CD 25D Susan B #104
Mattapoisett, MA
Fleet Captain - Northeast Fleet 2014/2015
Tempus Fugit. And not only that, it goes by fast. (Ron Vacarro 1945 - 1971)
Just a thought
The GM series Yanmar has a compression release lever on the head. Did you check this and make sure it is closed?
Jim Davis
S/V Isa Lei
S/V Isa Lei
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Oswego John
- Posts: 3535
- Joined: Feb 5th, '05, 20:42
- Location: '66 Typhoon "Grace", Hull # 42, Schooner "Ontario", CD 85D Hull #1
Compression Release Lever
Whoa Nellie,
Now, wouldn't that be something. I hope the problem is as simple as that.
Sometimes you can't see the forest, the trees get in the way.
FWIW, I would hope that the Yanmar expert would pick up on the compression release. You never know. Darn trees.
O J
Now, wouldn't that be something. I hope the problem is as simple as that.
Sometimes you can't see the forest, the trees get in the way.
FWIW, I would hope that the Yanmar expert would pick up on the compression release. You never know. Darn trees.
O J
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Dean Abramson
- Posts: 1483
- Joined: Jul 5th, '05, 11:23
- Location: CD 31 "Loda May"
Don't assume the worst
Don't assume the worst. I also got a new head for the 1GM in my old 25D. After that, it ran fantastic.
Dean
Dean
Dean Abramson
Cape Dory 31 "Loda May"
Falmouth, Maine
Cape Dory 31 "Loda May"
Falmouth, Maine
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Dick Macdonald
- Posts: 2
- Joined: Jan 29th, '07, 12:13
- Location: SEVEN CD27 Hull No. 7 Palm Beach, FL
Same Problem
Brenno,
I am currently rebuilding a YSB8 that has the same problem, (low / no compression). I bought a CD27 that had been inactive and the engine was run at the dock at low power. What I found was corrosion on the back side of the exhaust valve and stuck rings.
The corrosion on the valve seat prevented a good seal. The cause of this is the salt water in the exhaust system. Running at low power probably allows more water to collect in the muffler than should be.
The stuck rings are most likely a combination of operating at low power and the salt water environment on the other side of the valve.
So, the problem really comes down to lack of use and the already hostile environment of a marine engine. I was actually very happy to see that my 30 year old engine really had minimal wear. Just some very specific problems, that could be fixed without major cost.
My cylinder head had corrosion in the exhaust valve seat and needed a new valve. The machine shop oversized the seats, pressed in new seat (inserts) and installed the new valve. The intake valve was resurfaced. Total cost will be less than $300. I have a new piston and ring set coming. New gaskets, some paint, and we’re good for another 30 years.
The point to my story is that your engine is not junk, it just needs some internal maintenance. By the way, these engine are NOT complicated. The fuel injection nozzle is the only thing that should be looked at by $100 / hour shop. Imagine the benefit of knowing how to disassemble and repair your engine as your voyaging away from home.
Good luck,
Dick Macdonald
I am currently rebuilding a YSB8 that has the same problem, (low / no compression). I bought a CD27 that had been inactive and the engine was run at the dock at low power. What I found was corrosion on the back side of the exhaust valve and stuck rings.
The corrosion on the valve seat prevented a good seal. The cause of this is the salt water in the exhaust system. Running at low power probably allows more water to collect in the muffler than should be.
The stuck rings are most likely a combination of operating at low power and the salt water environment on the other side of the valve.
So, the problem really comes down to lack of use and the already hostile environment of a marine engine. I was actually very happy to see that my 30 year old engine really had minimal wear. Just some very specific problems, that could be fixed without major cost.
My cylinder head had corrosion in the exhaust valve seat and needed a new valve. The machine shop oversized the seats, pressed in new seat (inserts) and installed the new valve. The intake valve was resurfaced. Total cost will be less than $300. I have a new piston and ring set coming. New gaskets, some paint, and we’re good for another 30 years.
The point to my story is that your engine is not junk, it just needs some internal maintenance. By the way, these engine are NOT complicated. The fuel injection nozzle is the only thing that should be looked at by $100 / hour shop. Imagine the benefit of knowing how to disassemble and repair your engine as your voyaging away from home.
Good luck,
Dick Macdonald
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Brandon
- Posts: 47
- Joined: May 1st, '06, 19:33
- Location: 1985 CD25D "Seamona" Hull#181
Fort Lauderdale, Fl
I'm convinced
Yes, I do think I may take this time between jobs to rebuild this myself. This of course is if I don't get the job I'm interviewing for this weekend. Or maybe I should just not take it... If I do the rebuild I think I might drive the engine up to my parents house in Wareham, Ma. and use their garage (If I can convince them to let me do so). Good reason to visit family, and I don't have anywhere on land down here in Florida that I can do this. I should be making my decision by this weekend.
To answer a few questions posted:
I've definitly seen the engine run, and quite a few times at that. I'd been sailing with the previous owner three times (and it had run beautifully) and when I was here still in South Florida I would start it up every weekend. But I left on my Boss's boat up to New England for the summer (July- November) and didn't have any time off! I paid off the boat in November, and the previous owner was supposed to be checking on it and starting her up every couple of weeks. This unfortunatly didn't happen. When I finally get a chance to start her up when I get back... nothing.
The first mechanic I had come down to the boat seemed a little to eager to sell me a new engine. I called the previous owner to ask him if he'd ever had problems, and he said no, and that he was shocked to hear of this problem. He's an insurance auditor and was auditing a local Diesel repair shop and asked them what they thought. I took the engine to them and the owner of the place said that these engines have a common problem. He said the exhaust elbow was made of a grade of steel that rusts very quickly and will create a back pressure that won't allow the engine to start. But I had already checked this possibility by removing the exhaust elbow while trying to start. You can easily tell there is a lack of compression becaust the engine turns over too easily. Another symptom found was that there was small amounts of exhaust coming out of the air intake while trying to start it. This suggests to me a stuck valve and/or back pressure? The owner of the shop that I brought it to said that he would try a trick that has helped him start these engines before. He said that he thought the rings were froze and weren't creating a seal that would allow the engine to start. He would spray in a small amount of oil into the air intake while trying to start it (not too much as it could create a hydraulic seizure -i know i didn't spell that right-). He said the oil would fill in the gaps around the rings and create a temporary seal that would allow the engine to start. After starting the rings would free up and all would be fine. I came back a week later and they said they couldn't start it and there would also be no charge for the service (because they wanted to be the next group to sevice the twin 1300hp MAN engines on the vessel I captain). I'm not sure how much effort they put into it though.
I do agree with all of you. I just need to do it myself. No better way to get familiar with the most complicated part of my boat.
To answer a few questions posted:
I've definitly seen the engine run, and quite a few times at that. I'd been sailing with the previous owner three times (and it had run beautifully) and when I was here still in South Florida I would start it up every weekend. But I left on my Boss's boat up to New England for the summer (July- November) and didn't have any time off! I paid off the boat in November, and the previous owner was supposed to be checking on it and starting her up every couple of weeks. This unfortunatly didn't happen. When I finally get a chance to start her up when I get back... nothing.
The first mechanic I had come down to the boat seemed a little to eager to sell me a new engine. I called the previous owner to ask him if he'd ever had problems, and he said no, and that he was shocked to hear of this problem. He's an insurance auditor and was auditing a local Diesel repair shop and asked them what they thought. I took the engine to them and the owner of the place said that these engines have a common problem. He said the exhaust elbow was made of a grade of steel that rusts very quickly and will create a back pressure that won't allow the engine to start. But I had already checked this possibility by removing the exhaust elbow while trying to start. You can easily tell there is a lack of compression becaust the engine turns over too easily. Another symptom found was that there was small amounts of exhaust coming out of the air intake while trying to start it. This suggests to me a stuck valve and/or back pressure? The owner of the shop that I brought it to said that he would try a trick that has helped him start these engines before. He said that he thought the rings were froze and weren't creating a seal that would allow the engine to start. He would spray in a small amount of oil into the air intake while trying to start it (not too much as it could create a hydraulic seizure -i know i didn't spell that right-). He said the oil would fill in the gaps around the rings and create a temporary seal that would allow the engine to start. After starting the rings would free up and all would be fine. I came back a week later and they said they couldn't start it and there would also be no charge for the service (because they wanted to be the next group to sevice the twin 1300hp MAN engines on the vessel I captain). I'm not sure how much effort they put into it though.
I do agree with all of you. I just need to do it myself. No better way to get familiar with the most complicated part of my boat.
The road goes ever on and on,
And I must follow it if I can,
Pursuing it with eager feet,
Until it meets some place
Where many paths and errands meet,
And whither then I cannot say.
B. Baggins
And I must follow it if I can,
Pursuing it with eager feet,
Until it meets some place
Where many paths and errands meet,
And whither then I cannot say.
B. Baggins