Cockpit padeyes

[Warren Kaplan]

When sailing alone, or in rough weather, or with the autopilot engaged, many sailing safety gurus advise wearing a harness and clipping in to something substantial to keep you aboard....just in case. They suggest this even if you remain in the cockpit. I've got jacklines that will run from the bow down both sides of the deck to the cockpit. I really don't want to bring anymore lines into the cockpit to clutter things up. I have read where some sailors have padeyes strategically located throughout the cockpit to clip in to. Obviously the number of padeyes necessary will depend on the size of the cockpit. I have a CD27 with a tiller. I was thinking of installing a padeye on each side of the cockpit on the vertical wall of both the port and starboard cockpit lockers. I'd put a big backing plate in to spread out the load. I might even put one thru the wall of the stern cockpit locker, the same way, thereby allowing me to place the port and starboard padeyes a little more forward in the cockpit. A couple of questions. First, do you think good, solid padeyes are a good idea over running jacklines into the cockpit? Second, do you think the walls of the cockpit's lockers are strong enough for this purpose if a large backing plate is also installed? Third, are there any drawbacks to doing this? I anxiously solicit your comments or alternatives!
Thanks guys,
Warren Kaplan
Sine Qua Non
Cd27 #166 1980



Setsail728@aol.com

[john doyle]

When sailing alone, or in rough weather, or with the autopilot engaged, many sailing safety gurus advise wearing a harness and clipping in to something substantial to keep you aboard....just in case. They suggest this even if you remain in the cockpit. I've got jacklines that will run from the bow down both sides of the deck to the cockpit. I really don't want to bring anymore lines into the cockpit to clutter things up. I have read where some sailors have padeyes strategically located throughout the cockpit to clip in to. Obviously the number of padeyes necessary will depend on the size of the cockpit. I have a CD27 with a tiller. I was thinking of installing a padeye on each side of the cockpit on the vertical wall of both the port and starboard cockpit lockers. I'd put a big backing plate in to spread out the load. I might even put one thru the wall of the stern cockpit locker, the same way, thereby allowing me to place the port and starboard padeyes a little more forward in the cockpit. A couple of questions. First, do you think good, solid padeyes are a good idea over running jacklines into the cockpit? Second, do you think the walls of the cockpit's lockers are strong enough for this purpose if a large backing plate is also installed? Third, are there any drawbacks to doing this? I anxiously solicit your comments or alternatives!
Thanks guys,
Warren Kaplan
Sine Qua Non
Cd27 #166 1980

If you can hook on to 1 of the jack lines while still in the cockpit, it would be best. that way you don't have to unhook to go on deck. I run my jack lines to the quarters on both sides.
John Cd31 Bonnie blue



redzeplin@yahoo.com

[Dennis]

If you can hook on to 1 of the jack lines while still in the cockpit, it would be best. that way you don't have to unhook to go on deck. I run my jack lines to the quarters on both sides.

Are you able to hook into your jacklines from the cabin?

FWIW:
My boat came (to me) with a padeye on each side of the companionway and one near the stern. I haven't used them except for the kids and have not looked at the backing (good idea).

Dennis

[Larry DeMers]

Warren,
Your idea of mounting them on the cockpit locker vertical walls, using a large backing plate is a good one. I would be using a stiff piece of aluminum, about 6x6 in. sq. for that backing plate though.
I have run our jacklines back to the cockpit, in the stern quarters, where I mounted 2 large bronze padeyes (from Spartan), and these jacklines pass underneath the winches in the process of getting back to the padeye provided for it. When we use the jacklines, we trail the tether behind us until in the cockpit, then we disconnect and reconnect to the padeye directly if needed (usually we do not clip on while in the cockpit though).

Cheers,

Larry DeMers
s/v DeLaMer
Cape Dory 30 Lake Superior

When sailing alone, or in rough weather, or with the autopilot engaged, many sailing safety gurus advise wearing a harness and clipping in to something substantial to keep you aboard....just in case. They suggest this even if you remain in the cockpit. I've got jacklines that will run from the bow down both sides of the deck to the cockpit. I really don't want to bring anymore lines into the cockpit to clutter things up. I have read where some sailors have padeyes strategically located throughout the cockpit to clip in to. Obviously the number of padeyes necessary will depend on the size of the cockpit. I have a CD27 with a tiller. I was thinking of installing a padeye on each side of the cockpit on the vertical wall of both the port and starboard cockpit lockers. I'd put a big backing plate in to spread out the load. I might even put one thru the wall of the stern cockpit locker, the same way, thereby allowing me to place the port and starboard padeyes a little more forward in the cockpit. A couple of questions. First, do you think good, solid padeyes are a good idea over running jacklines into the cockpit? Second, do you think the walls of the cockpit's lockers are strong enough for this purpose if a large backing plate is also installed? Third, are there any drawbacks to doing this? I anxiously solicit your comments or alternatives!
Thanks guys,
Warren Kaplan
Sine Qua Non
Cd27 #166 1980

demers@gi.com

[Kevin LeMans]

I have a single padeye on the forward bulkhead of the cockpit footwell. I also run jack lines from the bow cleats to the stern cleats, however, the harness teather tends to foul around the winches when you move towards the rear of the cockpit. The padeye avoids this problem, as long as you don't have to leave the cockpit. I would also suggest that you don't want the padeye too close to your steering position, or you will be tripping on the teather. Having the padeye forward reduces the amount of slack around your feet.

Frankly, I hate moving around the boat with a teather, but I also have two kids and would not think of going outside the Golden Gate without wearing my harness and teather. And I mean, in ANY conditions, single handed or not. Around here, if you fall overboard and drown, the sailing press will not offer much sympathy if you weren't wearing at least a flotation device, if not a harness. There's a reason why offshore racing rules require them.

Fair Winds,

Kevin LeMans
CD30 Raconteur

When sailing alone, or in rough weather, or with the autopilot engaged, many sailing safety gurus advise wearing a harness and clipping in to something substantial to keep you aboard....just in case. They suggest this even if you remain in the cockpit. I've got jacklines that will run from the bow down both sides of the deck to the cockpit. I really don't want to bring anymore lines into the cockpit to clutter things up. I have read where some sailors have padeyes strategically located throughout the cockpit to clip in to. Obviously the number of padeyes necessary will depend on the size of the cockpit. I have a CD27 with a tiller. I was thinking of installing a padeye on each side of the cockpit on the vertical wall of both the port and starboard cockpit lockers. I'd put a big backing plate in to spread out the load. I might even put one thru the wall of the stern cockpit locker, the same way, thereby allowing me to place the port and starboard padeyes a little more forward in the cockpit. A couple of questions. First, do you think good, solid padeyes are a good idea over running jacklines into the cockpit? Second, do you think the walls of the cockpit's lockers are strong enough for this purpose if a large backing plate is also installed? Third, are there any drawbacks to doing this? I anxiously solicit your comments or alternatives!
Thanks guys,
Warren Kaplan
Sine Qua Non
Cd27 #166 1980

lemans@gte.net

[Michael Heintz]

Warren,

If you solo, then definatly harness up !!!!!!!

I do a lot of solo sailing, and always have my Jack Lines rigged bow to stern. Even when in LIS on a calm day, you never know.... I always fear seeing Macht Nichts sailing away with autopiolet engaged and me in the water. By the way I also ALLWAYS wear my sos auto inflayted PFD (for those times I'm not snapped on to Jack lines), with whistle, flashlight and my handheld VHF totally submersible. I'd like to be able to call for help if I go over!!!!

Safty Safty Safty

I like the idea of a few pad eyes aft, might consider doing that.

Michael Heintz
Captain Commanding
Macht Nichts CD 30 MK II



Mzenith@aol.com

[Warren Kaplan]

Just a little more of my thinking. I prefer to get my attachment point for my harness ( one of the sospenders inflatables and harness in one) as close to the centerline of the boat as I can. My tether is a standard size...not very long and thats good. But my wife and I had the jacklines set up one day from the bow to the cockpit, along the deck flush where the coachroof meets the deck. We had them pretty tight. But my wife was very upset because I lost my footing at the mast and started to fall back. I regained my balance but my wife said that there was no way I wouldn't have careened over the the life lines and over the side with that setup. I would have been hanging by my tether over the side of the boat. Now perhaps the jacklines were too loose, but I don't think so. My idea of safety with these devices is to be yanked back by the tether before I even come near the lifelines. The padeyes near the center of the cockpit (on the locker walls) should accomplish that. I also think that I have to route the jacklines from the bow, down the centerline of the boat, onto the cabin top and secure them up there somehow. Running along the deck along side the cabin just won't preven me from going over the side. What do you think!

Warren



Setsail728@aol.com

[Steve Alarcon]

Warren,

We have padeyes installed by a previous owner on the cockpit walls , and I think they are a great idea. However, make sure you get the type that fold flat or you will have bruised shins from time to time.

Steve Alarcon
CD36 Tenacity
Seattle



alarcon3@prodigy.net

[Kevin LeMans]

I have read commentary by serious offshore types who believe that the jack lines should run down the centerline of the boat so that as you suggest, you can't fall past the lifelines. Particularly when singlehanding, if you go over, even if you're tied to the boat, getting back on board can be almost impossible. Some suggest trailing a rope or web ladder over the side from each point where the jack lines end.

The problems I see with running the jacklines down the centerline are that you will need multiple attachment points to keep the line centered under load, and these attachment points mean having to dis-connect and re-connect to the jackline to move around. You also have things like the mainsheet traveler to work around. Hence, the double-teather leashes sold by West Marine and others allowing you to be attached on both sides of an obstacle.

Good Luck.

Kevin LeMans
CD30 Raconteur

Just a little more of my thinking. I prefer to get my attachment point for my harness ( one of the sospenders inflatables and harness in one) as close to the centerline of the boat as I can. My tether is a standard size...not very long and thats good. But my wife and I had the jacklines set up one day from the bow to the cockpit, along the deck flush where the coachroof meets the deck. We had them pretty tight. But my wife was very upset because I lost my footing at the mast and started to fall back. I regained my balance but my wife said that there was no way I wouldn't have careened over the the life lines and over the side with that setup. I would have been hanging by my tether over the side of the boat. Now perhaps the jacklines were too loose, but I don't think so. My idea of safety with these devices is to be yanked back by the tether before I even come near the lifelines. The padeyes near the center of the cockpit (on the locker walls) should accomplish that. I also think that I have to route the jacklines from the bow, down the centerline of the boat, onto the cabin top and secure them up there somehow. Running along the deck along side the cabin just won't preven me from going over the side. What do you think!

Warren

lemans@gte.net

[Warren Kaplan]

I have read commentary by serious offshore types who believe that the jack lines should run down the centerline of the boat so that as you suggest, you can't fall past the lifelines. Particularly when singlehanding, if you go over, even if you're tied to the boat, getting back on board can be almost impossible. Some suggest trailing a rope or web ladder over the side from each point where the jack lines end.

The problems I see with running the jacklines down the centerline are that you will need multiple attachment points to keep the line centered under load, and these attachment points mean having to dis-connect and re-connect to the jackline to move around. You also have things like the mainsheet traveler to work around. Hence, the double-teather leashes sold by West Marine and others allowing you to be attached on both sides of an obstacle.

Good Luck.

Kevin LeMans
CD30 Raconteur

Kevin,
Of course part of the problem is that even though all sailors may wear a 3-6 ft tether, you can easily go over the side if the beam of the boat is only 8'6" at its widest, like the CD27. That same sailor might never get near the lifelines on a boat with an 11 ft beam. I really do have to have my attachment points as close to the centerline as possible in order to have any chance of staying aboard if some wave pitches me ass over tea kettle!

Warren



Setsail728@aol.com

[Neil Gordon]

>>...jack lines should run down the centerline of the boat so that as you suggest, you can't fall past the lifelines.<<

One of the things you want is to fall as short a distance as possible. In theory, if you clip onto a windward jackline, you'll fall to leeward and be stopped well before you would be if you were attached at the centerline. Also, I agree that on a smaller boat, a jackline down the center of the boat won't always stop you beofore you're over the side.

>>Particularly when singlehanding, if you go over, even if you're tied to the boat, getting back on board can be almost impossible.<<

It's worse if the boat's not set up to stop!


Regards, Neil
s/v LIQUIDITY
Cape Dory 28 #167



cdory28@aol.com

[Neil Gordon]

It's not very far from the cabin to jacklines along the deck. If you keep a tether attached to the jackline, or two, port and stbd, you can clip onto the tether before you leave the cabin.

I run my jacklines from the bow cleats to the winch bases.


Regards, Neil
s/v LIQUIDITY
Cape Dory 28 #167



cdory28@aol.com

[Bristol Bronze]

When sailing alone, or in rough weather, or with the autopilot engaged, many sailing safety gurus advise wearing a harness and clipping in to something substantial to keep you aboard....just in case. They suggest this even if you remain in the cockpit. I've got jacklines that will run from the bow down both sides of the deck to the cockpit. I really don't want to bring anymore lines into the cockpit to clutter things up. I have read where some sailors have padeyes strategically located throughout the cockpit to clip in to. Obviously the number of padeyes necessary will depend on the size of the cockpit. I have a CD27 with a tiller. I was thinking of installing a padeye on each side of the cockpit on the vertical wall of both the port and starboard cockpit lockers. I'd put a big backing plate in to spread out the load. I might even put one thru the wall of the stern cockpit locker, the same way, thereby allowing me to place the port and starboard padeyes a little more forward in the cockpit. A couple of questions. First, do you think good, solid padeyes are a good idea over running jacklines into the cockpit? Second, do you think the walls of the cockpit's lockers are strong enough for this purpose if a large backing plate is also installed? Third, are there any drawbacks to doing this? I anxiously solicit your comments or alternatives!
Thanks guys,
Warren Kaplan
Sine Qua Non
Cd27 #166 1980

Dear Warren,

The pad eyes that you mention are a good idea. I make several sizes that are good and strong. Also, you might want to consider a "Flange Eye" instead of a pad eye. A flange eye has a round base instead of the diamond base of a pad eye. To some people them present a better appearance.

As far as the backing plate is concerned, also a good idea. But, don't use a Bronze pad eye or flange eye with an aluminum backing plate. The aluminum will go away in short order. Use either a piece of Bronze plate or a piece of hard wood. Either will spread out the load over a greater area and make the whole thing more secure.

Roger W.
Bristol Bronze
401-625-5224



rogerw@bristolbronze.com

[Ed Haley]

As a slight variation in rigging jacklines, I run jacklines from the bow cleat, then AROUND the base of the mast, then to the stern cleats on both sides of the boat. That way there isn't as much lateral travel in case I lose my balance and stumble toward the water side of the rail. If you really want to feel safe when unclipping from aft of the mast to forward of the mast, wear double-clipping tethers.



eghaley@twcny.rr.com

[John R.]

I am in total agreement with Neil regarding clipping on to the windward line. That is prudent in my opinion. My jacklines are webbing so they won't roll under foot and rigged similar to Larry's. However, at the bow on our 30 I run the webbing lines through the bases of the mooring cleats and the line is continuous from starboard aft quarter to the port aft quarter terminating at pad eyes like Larry described.

I saw a CD36 that had lines (lifeline wire) rigged along the lower cabin sides from one bronze diamond shaped padeye at the aft end run up to another at the forward end of the cabin side. Looked good and very shippy and neat. There was a turnbuckle at the aft end to adjust tension. The lines were located about one inch up from the deck. A very nice design which I may switch to on my 30. Sure as hell looks better. Maintenance though!

In the cockpit I installed two Schaefer cast stainless square based pad eyes with matching stainless backing plates. These pad eyes are the 4 bolt version. One pad eye is located on the center line of the boat just to the port side of the offset companionway entrance on the CD30 about midway up the height of the companionway opening. It is through bolted into the cabin utilizing the matching backing plate.

The other padeye (same kind and design) is located on the cockpit sole at the farthest point aft in the starboard corner. It is through bolted through the cockpit sole with backing plate. I have a teak helmsmans seat that bridges from one setee to the other and so the padeye is below it and thus not in the way. I use the 6 foot / 3 foot combo tethers with "positive" locking clips that secure with the barrel slide sleeve.

When sailing alone, or in rough weather, or with the autopilot engaged, many sailing safety gurus advise wearing a harness and clipping in to something substantial to keep you aboard....just in case. They suggest this even if you remain in the cockpit. I've got jacklines that will run from the bow down both sides of the deck to the cockpit. I really don't want to bring anymore lines into the cockpit to clutter things up. I have read where some sailors have padeyes strategically located throughout the cockpit to clip in to. Obviously the number of padeyes necessary will depend on the size of the cockpit. I have a CD27 with a tiller. I was thinking of installing a padeye on each side of the cockpit on the vertical wall of both the port and starboard cockpit lockers. I'd put a big backing plate in to spread out the load. I might even put one thru the wall of the stern cockpit locker, the same way, thereby allowing me to place the port and starboard padeyes a little more forward in the cockpit. A couple of questions. First, do you think good, solid padeyes are a good idea over running jacklines into the cockpit? Second, do you think the walls of the cockpit's lockers are strong enough for this purpose if a large backing plate is also installed? Third, are there any drawbacks to doing this? I anxiously solicit your comments or alternatives!
Thanks guys,
Warren Kaplan
Sine Qua Non
Cd27 #166 1980