Typhoon seacocks?

[wingreen]

So, I'm messing around in my Typhoon today, paying some attention to the seacocks when I notice some odd stuff...

First of all, they work fine. They're made out of brass, with a plastic 90-degree joint at the top that connects the hose to the bottom of the cockpit drain. They open and close fine, the movement is a little stiff, but smooth; but they're obviously not the kind of valve that opens and closes with every 90-degree turn of the handle. There are multiple turns of the handle between fully open and fully closed, more like a household valve.

So, does anybody know whether these are original equipment for a 1974 Typhoon, or are they a DIY job from a previous owner? If they're original, are they worth maintaining, or should they be replaced with something more modern? If they're worth maintaining, are these type of seacocks serviced the same way as a "normal" seacock? If they need to be replaced, what brand/ model should they be replaced with?

Thanks for your help and suggestions, I'd like to learn more before I disassemble everything only to find out that it was best left alone in the first place.

[Lew Gresham]

Yep, came on my TY. You can maintenance these valves simply. Take them apart and clean, then lubricate with never seize. If they are in good working order and nothing broken. They will be just fine. I am sure O. J. will reinforce the process.

[Oswego John]

Dems the real McCoy.

I've got (in some instances , had) them on my Tys. Even on the older models they used them for flush type head intakes that had no waste tanks but pumped directly through the hull. A larger size was used for the discharge.

The only difference between that setup and mine, to my recollection, I can't recall any plastic fittings being used. It seems that all the nipples ells and street ells were made of some brass or bronze alloy.

Up here in the Great Lakes, this point is now moot. I have a porta potti and the through hulls are capped off. I'm doing my part to go green.

The willows are showing color. That means that the winter tarps are coming off shortly.

O J

[RIKanaka]

Ah, the infamous OEM gate valves! Mine were frozen open when I purchased my Ty. I replaced them with the ball valves before my first season of ownership. The main advantage is the quickness with which the ball valves can be closed (a 90° turn of the handle) as opposed to the multilple clockwise turns of the gate valve). I believe that most, if not all, surveyors would recommend that gate valves not be used on below-waterline plumbing.

[wingreen]

The pics you posted, Lew, are exactly what I have. So, I'm ok w/ maintaining these. Thanks for the info., OJ and RI. The only plumbing these valves do is the cockpit drain, so I think I'm good for now. If she stayed in the water, then I might reconsider, but since she spends her time between outings on a trailer in my backyard, these will work fine.

[Oswego John]

Hi Bob,

It's hard to argue with that reasoning. Other than speed, I can only venture a guess as to why they used gate valves.

Many of the earlier, smaller sized sailboats had no use for valves of any sort. There was no auxiliary engine cooling water and many models had no self bailing features. Except for flush heads, actually there was no need for any holes made in the hull at all.

If push came to shove and I was somehow forced to guess why gate valves were initially used, if I looked long enough and hard enough, I wouldn't be surprised if the common denominator of the root cause of that decision was $$$.

But hold on a sec. One can't blame Cape Dory for being chintzy about cutting corners with the use of gate valves instead of sea cocks or whatever we deem as proper shutoffs. For that matter, my Tys aren't even Cape Dory Typhoons. No, it's not blasphemy.

The original Tys, as we know them, were made by Naugus Fiberglass Industries, located up in Salem, Massachusetts. The way I hear it was that some upstarts, with a gleam in their eye for the potential that loomed ahead, bought the rights and molds from Naugus and Cape Dory then first saw the light of day, sometime in the mid 1960s. But I digress.

Getting back to shutoff valves, I have never found any fault with using gate valves. In my mind, I think that ball valves are a notch or two better than gate valves. I also feel that a true seacock is best of the bunch.

But when you analyze the difference between a ball valve and a seacock, a ball valve's innards has a hole for passage in a ball, whereas a seacock has the same type of hole, but bored in a tapered cylinder. Now, getting back to $$$, ......

Think spring,
O J
Naugus Sloop #42

[wingreen]

... how many pieces are there, and how do they disassemble? From your picture, it looks like there is: the plastic 90-degree joint, the valve, the threaded through-hull fitting, and a threaded nut to hold the through-hull in place from the inside of the cabin. Which parts did you loosen first to get the whole thing out?

[kwf05001]

the problem is that if something gets into the valve (a stick, a rock, or anything) and you go to close the valve you won't be able to tell the valve is still open unless you count turns or something...
could be a disaster!
If it wasn't a trailer-sailed ty I would highly recomend changing them, but in the meantime just be sure to have a proper sized softwood plug and mallet nearby as insurance

PS: those are much more robust gate valves than what I've seen used as a seacock on other lower quality boats

[Lew Gresham]

Wingreen,

Hope my PM helped!

[wingreen]

Thanks Lew, your help was right on target. However, through no fault of anybody on this board except my own, I used a piece of metal on the exterior through-hull to hold it in place while I worked on removing the valve from inside the boat. This resulted in the ribs inside the through-hull starting to round and strip. I shoulda just went out and bought the right tool. Now I'm thinking that I should just go out and buy some proper seacocks and replace the whole thing.