What causes leaks in a 28?

GrFa · Post by **GrFa** » Jul 29th, '07, 11:04

Well it seems that our 28 is taking on an inordinate amount of water, or at least less than it should. It is now so close by that I can go and check on it more often. It used to be that I would only see the boat 3 times a season.

Anyway I have gotten into the habit of pumping the bilge out manually because I can get it almost completely dry. At 11am yesterday I pumped it dry. I then realized I had left the battery switch on and went back around 9pm. At this time the bilge had already filled up to the where the bilge pump float is, right under the access hatch. The bilge pump could have already been cycling as well. At that level ut takes about 50 pumps of the manual pump to get it completely pumped out.

Anyway, any ideas what would allow that quantity of water to come in, in that amount of time? The boat is my fathers and as far as I know there hasn't been any stuffing box maintenance/adjustment and I don't have any idea how that even works. I believe none of the thru hulls are leaking. Can the rudder shaft leak? I appreciate any opinions. Thanks

Oswego John · Post by **Oswego John** » Jul 29th, '07, 12:53

GrFa,

Maybe check for a siphon?

Good luck,
O J

Tom in Cambria · Post by **Tom in Cambria** » Jul 29th, '07, 13:16

To answer your question, the rudder shaft and prop shaft can leak. Tightening the stuffing box fixes the prop shaft leak. There are a lot of posts in the archives about rudder shaft leaks. If you're taking on saltwater rather than rain water you can probably see it or hear it running. Nose around with your flashlight and listen carefully to see if you can find it. If it's a slow leak you can dry the inside of the hull and then sprinkle flour or talcum powder where you think it might be leaking. Water running in will leave a track. I can't remember the 28 very well, but I think the top of the rudder shaft is above the water line, so you probably wouldn't get water there except underway. Good luck.

bill2 · Post by **bill2** » Jul 29th, '07, 14:41

FWIW -

Besides the prop shaft ( a strong candidate ) and rudder shaft ( been hit lately ) here's a couple more

> lots of heavy t-storms lately ( not as likely but do you have stains inside the cabin - esp nooks and crannies )

> siphoning - besides checking the head and such don't forget to give the engine a good/thorough look see - is its seacock closed, is the eng drain pan full before the bilge fills up ( would be engine compartment maybe prop shaft)

> all hoses below the waterline are candidates ( don't forget the chance of the freshwater tank(s) leaking though not common )

Good Luck

Paul D. · Post by **Paul D.** » Jul 29th, '07, 17:16

I would add checking all seacocks and if a new to you boat, look for any seacocks you don;t know about. It could be they are either weeping (not likely to allow that much water to enter in so short a time) or actually leaking. I close my three non-cockpit drain seacocks and two actually weep some, but I feel good having them closed when away from the boat.

Best of luck but that does sound suspicious for any fibreglass boat.

All the best,
Paul

Gary M · Post by **Gary M** » Jul 29th, '07, 19:00

To eliminate the raw water pump as a candidate just close the intake valve, but just looking around the pump will find the leak. A raw water pump going bad can leak a lot of water into a boat.

BTW, I don't think you said if we're looking at salt water or fresh water.

Man that sounds like a lot of water, maybe its time to get a professional over or maybe a pump watcher.

Gary

bottomscraper · Post by **bottomscraper** » Jul 30th, '07, 09:30

Is it maybe a fresh water leak from an onboard tank or hose? Check you tank levels.

Dean Abramson · Post by **Dean Abramson** » Jul 30th, '07, 12:16

I am not sure about the configuration on the 28, but I would determine if the engine's drip tray is filling (and THEN overflowing into the bilge). Pump/dry out the drip tray next time you pump the bilge, and see if it is full when you return. If it has drain hole in it, plug that drain hole so that it has to fill up before water then overflows into the bilge. If the drip tray is full when you return, then you have taken on the capacity of the drip tray, the capacity of the bilge below your float switch, and the unknown quantity of water that the bilge pump automatically pumped out. That could add up to quite a lot of water.

Right now, my boat is taking on about 5 gallons a week, via the drip tray, so I am pretty sure that is a stuffing box issue. That is way too much in my book, and the stuffing box is on the top of my project list at the moment. I'd seriously look into the stuffing box possibility, since that is the one thing on the boat that is meant to leak...some.

Dean

Bruce Barber · Post by **Bruce Barber** » Jul 30th, '07, 12:18

I've had my fresh water tank siphoned into the bilge on a couple of occasions.

Dean Abramson · Post by **Dean Abramson** » Jul 30th, '07, 12:27

GrFa,

It's a bit gross, but tasting a drop of the water on the end of your finger is going to tell you whether you can eliminate fresh water sources. That will cut the possibilities in half. It's what I do...

Dean

John Vigor · Post by **John Vigor** » Jul 30th, '07, 19:19

Dean, I sure hope that wasn't how you discovered your holding tank was leaking.

You are a brave man.

Cheers,

John V.

Bill S · Post by **Bill S** » Jul 30th, '07, 19:48

If it is the shaft stuffing box, it's easy and fun to fix. To determine if the leak is at the stuffing box, either hang over the engine or hang upside down in the lazerette with a flashlight pointed at the box. If you see a drip, it needs some adjustment. If it has been a while, change the flax (dripless is nice - water will be coming into the boat while you work so work fast). If not, loosen the lock nut, tighten the stuffing box nut, tighten the lock nut. It's easy if you have the right size wrench and are small enough to fit in the lazerette. I always preferred the port side. Make sure to take everything out first, get in with your head toward the shaft and have a good time. Try to get the job done before all the blood rushes to your head.

Bill S.

Dean Abramson · Post by **Dean Abramson** » Jul 30th, '07, 22:01

John, fortunately in that case, my nose suggested I proceed directly to the food coloring stage.

FYI, when I DO do that, I just touch it to my tongue, then I immediately stick my tongue under the tap and rinse it. I never swallow. This is way more than you folks want to know.

Dean

bottomscraper · Post by **bottomscraper** » Jul 31st, '07, 08:03

Dean Abramson wrote: FYI, when I DO do that, I just touch it to my tongue, then I immediately stick my tongue under the tap and rinse it. I never swallow. This is way more than you folks want to know.

Dean

Might not RUM or some other distilled beverage be a better choice to rinse your tongue with? Swallowing is recommended stricktly for it's disease prevention properties!

Dean Abramson · Post by **Dean Abramson** » Jul 31st, '07, 08:58

I will have to bow to Rich's expertise in this (after all, the man is an electrical engineer), and I hereby switch to his routine. I saw him doing this, but had no idea it was related to boat maintenance.

Seriously, though, GrFa, have you determined yet whether it is salt or fresh water? You are not required to divulge how you know.

Dean

The Cape Dory Board

What causes leaks in a 28?

What causes leaks in a 28?

Hull Leak

Rudder shaft leak

all wet

Raw water pump is another possibility

Suspect Mice Not Elephants?

My guess

Yuck

Finger-taste

Fun in the lazerette

Can I embarass myself more?

Disease Prevention