Leaving the dock

[Nigel Noble]

The marina where I'll be keeping my boat this summer has assigned me the same damn slip I had last year. I asked them to give me a new one that would make every departure a modicum of fun instead of the stomach churning nerve wracking experience I had last year. But nooooo!

So I asked to change it but I seriously doubt it will happen. I'm the new kid (aged 62) on the dock and have to earn my place.

Here's the problem. To leave the marina I have to head due west. The prevailing winds are from the west. The bow of the boat faces the dock in a northerly direction, with pilings level with the transom of my CD25. To the starboard resides a motor boat with two huge Mercury's, propellers out of the water, sticking out into the channel about 3 feet. Their is another dock opposite my stern also with motor boats, and monster engines, meaning I'm pulling out into about 30 feet of clear water. Having an inboard outboard I have no way of controlling the direction I go with a motor, and if their is any kind of westerly blow, my bows are soon facing into the marina instead of out -

so last year my solution was to use a spring line around the starboard piling, one end cleated off at the stern and leading through the fairleads at the stern, the other end in my hand. As I moved out into the center of the channel, I would let the rope slide until I felt I had cleared the monster Mercury's and then I'd pull on the spring, hoping the bow would not hit the other piling. Needless to say I was not always succesful and it was certainly never graceful.

If anyone has any suggestions, I would be most grateful. Anything that would help my summer boating start out pleasurably would be much appreciated.

[Neil Gordon]

I have exactly the same situation. My best solution has been assistance on the finger as I back out. The boat is held close to the dock as I leave the slip. As the bow clears, it's hauled around to windward with a dock line. That's usually enough to get the pointy end in the right direction and I can get enough boat speed to keep it there. It's very difficult to do without assistance.

Backing up the fairway might work if it's dead upwind.

Is there anywhere further downwind that would offer better spring line options? I might scope that this year.

[Carter Brey]

Hi there, Nigel--

I had exactly the same situation with my 25, and dealt with it by rotating the power head of the outboard to augment the rudder. Doesn't your motor rotate even a little bit?

For example, if I wanted to have my bow to the westerly wind after backing out to the south, I'd put the engine in reverse and rotate it so that the prop faced the direction I wanted the stern to go while holding the tiller hard over to port. To make things easier, I visualized the prop-engine-tiller line as continuous.

The spring line plan is a good one and I experimented with that as well, but taking advantage of the ability of the motor to rotate in the well worked the best. Apparently, with the great variation in motor size and design that one finds in CD25's, not all owners find they can steer with their motors. I used a Nissan 6hp 4-cycle. A fantastic little power plant, perfect for that boat, in my opinion.

I prefer mooring, by the way!

Best regards,
Carter

[Nigel Noble]

Neil, Maybe I'm a little dense at this time of night. I only had one Guinness with dinner, but assistance on the finger?? What do you mean, please?

I sail single handed most of the time. "As the bow clears, it's hauled around to windward with a dock line." Where is the dock line again please?

I tried backing up the fairway - oh boy - that can be really embarrassing.

Hi Carter.

I have a 9.9hp Mercury outboard and I may be able to shift it somewhat but is this a situation where even a tiny shift of the motor could help? Is the idea that the prop wash is hitting the rudder and pushing the stern around?

When I got the news about the dock I had received, mooring certainly may be the solution. Cheaper too by a ton in East Hampton.

[Carter Brey]

Nigel,

By "assistance on the finger," Neil meant a second person on the edge of the finger dock to push the bow off or handle warps.

Speaking of Neil, his appearance on this thread reminded me of this exchange of a few months ago. Perhaps it will unlock the chains of inspiration:

http://www.capedory.org/board/viewtopic ... l&start=15

Are you in Three Mile Harbor?

Best regards,
Carter

[drb9]

You should also complain to the marina about the outdrives on the motorboats. My marina requires that your entire boat be within the pilings--no bowsprits sticking out, no dinghys, no raised outdrives.

[Tod Mills]

talk with the occupants of slips you covet and see if anyone is agreeable to swap, and THEN approach the marina operator?

thought two: would it be helpful to BACK into your slip, working your springs from the western pilings? That way you, in the cockpit, are near the piling to get a line on/off when approaching and departing. One would need to get up to speed quickly to keep the bow from blowing off.

[img]http://www.todspages.net/images/LF-slip.jpg[/img]

If it were windy AND your outboard had sufficient backing power (my Honda 5 has a reverse throttle limit which greatly reduces available thrust in reverse) I sure wouldn't be too proud to back down the fairway. I often back quite a ways as it is and have often been puzzled as to why some people are so reluctant, when they are having trouble with the bow blowing off.

[Sea Hunt]

Mr. Noble:

When I read that you are a lover of Guinness (my favorite drink), I had to try to offer a suggestion.

I preface my remarks by noting that I am a “tadpole” sailor. Although I have been on the water a long time, I do not yet actually own a Cape Dory (or any other sailboat). Thus, my comments are worth less (or "worthless") than the proverbial "two cents". However, in fairness, I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last week.

My suggestion is as follows:

1. Rig a long “slip line.”

2. Attach one end of the slip line to a cleat (or a winch) on the port side amidships of your sailboat. Use a bowline or a loose cleat hitch that can be quickly released.

3. Run this slip line around the leeward piling furthest out on the finger dock and then around the bow cleat.

4. Bring this slip line back into the cockpit.

5. As you begin to back up, you tighten up on the slip line preferably from the end of the line that is free - not the end attached to the amidships cleat or winch, perhaps by wrapping it around the starboard winch.

6. The propeller “prop walk” in reverse, if a "clockwise" prop, should keep the port side of your sailboat close to the leeward side of the finger dock. Tension on the slip line should keep the bow parallel (and straight).

7. As your bow gets to the end of the finger dock, you can engage forward gear slightly and use the slip line as a “warp line” to bring you alongside the end of the finger dock with your starboard side next to the end of the finger dock.

8. You can then release the end of the slip line not attached or release the end attached to the amidships cleat or winch on the port side, pull in the line quickly and motor west into the wind.

If Neal, Carter and others find problems with this idea, apologize in advance. Just bear in mind, this comes from the mind of a person who does not own a Cape Dory yet, and is in the middle of enjoying a Guinness, but did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last week.

You just may want to test this out on day when there is no wind and the guy with the big engines is out on the water.

[Sea Hunt]

Mr. Noble:

Upon further reflection, it seems my idea is very similar to what you have been doing all along, except for running the spring line forward and around the bow cleat and back to the cockpit. I would think this would give you a little more control over the direction of the bow.

Enjoy your Guinness

[Bill Michne]

Having owned two CD's over the last dozen years, I have come to the conclusion that my boating pleasure was severely negatively impacted by the boats' pathetic performance when maneuvering under power. There have been days when we wouldn't take the boat out because of the mental anguish and potential property damage associated with getting in and out of the slip. So we finally said to hell with it and installed a bow thruster. Done. No more problems. The single best improvement I ever made. Worth every penny.

[Carl Thunberg]

I think everyone at one time or another has had a close call at a marina with all that potential property damage around you, and the unavoidable feeling that every eye is staring at your rather clumsy efforts at times. I was never so thankful as the day my name came up on the waiting list for a mooring. I miss the convenience of the marina, but not the stress.

For what it's worth, I followed Tod's advice and backed in. Only I did it slightly differently than Tod shows in his elegant sketch (nice work, Tod). I would over-shoot the slip and then steer away from the dock toward the center of the channel. My wife, who was a track star in college would jump off onto the dock, grab the stern line and back me right in. Call it cheating if you like, but it worked every single time and she never once fell in the water.

[Warren Kaplan]

I too feel your pain...and everyone's anguish to the point of making any excuse not to sail that day if the winds around the slip howled disaster pending.

I used a heavy line from my starboard side stern cleat, around the dock's dolphin pole and back to my cockpit when backing out. The line was 60 feet long (CD27) and when the bow of my boat cleared the last pole I haul on the line keeping my stern going to starboard while my bow went to port. When I was facing the right direction, I put her into neutral and hauled that 60 foot line aboard and off I went.

Tod Mills makes an excellent point about his marina's rule of having the entire boat and its appendages inside the slip. Here's why:

My old slip in Bay Shore Long Island was right across from a big power boat that backed in. It had a huge bowsprit with a rather large and intimidating anchor hanging down. The distance across the channel was narrow. In order for me to make the turn into my slip I had to literally brush by that bowsprit. On day as I was slowly going by a gust of wind blew me a little off course and closer to the behemoth power boat. That god damn anchor caught my starboard side shrouds!! I thought for sure Sine Qua Non was gonna be dismasted. Luckily I was going slow enough that the boat just stopped. Getting the anchor out from behind the shrouds was an interesting exercise to say the least. The upshot of this was that not only was there anguish psychologically when leaving the slip...I also spent all day worrying if I was gonna make it back into the slip with SQN in one piece.

[Nigel Noble]

I really appreciate everyone's suggestions.

Carter - the marina is east of the entrance to Three Mile Harbor, called Hog Creek. A lot cheaper than any of the marinas in Three Mile Harbor.
you have to belong the community of houses surrounding the inlet there.

Now I know what those little floating docks are called - fingers. Sorry - no finger docks in the part of the marina I have been assigned.

I certainly am going to speak to the marina about those appendages, as drb9 suggests.

I like the idea of backing in except I cannot get close to the outer pilings to pick up a line because of the boats in the neighboring docks, and then the fairway is quite a distance and I have never yet found a way to steer straight in reverse for very long. When I think I got it right, the boat would decide on its own an unexpected course.

I use a long oar to get out when the wind is light, but who wants to only go sailing when the wind is light.

I apologize - I sound like I'm whining like a kid. It helps to hear others have the same problem.

I like the idea Carter suggests from the previous post on the same subject. He writes: "With permission of your marina, you use your dink to run a mushroom anchor (essentially a mooring anchor, but with no floats or bridles of any kind) out to the middle of your fairway, the rode leading back to a cleat on the dock finger. As part of your departure routine, you rig a snatch block to a bow cleat, and pick up the anchor rode to run it through the snatch block.

As you back out, the rode runs through the snatch block, allowing you freedom of movement straight sternward but preventing your bow from falling off. As you reach a point near the anchor, you shift into neutral, allowing the wind to blow your stern downwind while the anchor holds your bow to windward.

You move nimbly to the foredeck, release the rode from the snatch block, move just as nimbly back to the cockpit and shift into forward gear before the bow has any chance to fall off.

The rode, absent any tension on it from your boat, sinks quickly to the bottom, posing no fouling threat to other boats. Perhpas an all-chain rode would ensure that it sank before your prop had any chance of fouling it."

Has anyone tried this?

I think if I suggest this to the marina operator they might suddenly find a more convenient spot.

[David VanDenburgh]

We had an awkward berth a couple of years ago - strong current runnning from right to left (with bow pointing in toward shore) and the channel exiting to the left. It was very difficult entering and exiting the slip across that current. I conceived an idea but we never implemented it because we moved to a different marina so I can't tell you anything from personal experience, but it seems like it should work.

In your situation you would run a piece of wire rope (could be cheaper galvanized, not stainless) along the left side of your slip (facing shore). Anchor it at each end and stretch it tight. (I assume you have pilings at each end of your slip.) Before attaching the ends to the pilings, slide a hefty block onto the wire rope so it can travel the whole length of the wire (like a "zip line"). Tie a piece of rope to your port stern cleat, run it forward to the bow, through an eye of some kind, through the pulley on the "zip line" and bring the bitter end back to the cockpit. Tension on this line will hold your bow close to the upwind (in your case, the west side) of your slip. Back out slowly, keeping enough tension on this line to hold your bow upwind. The pulley will travel from the shoreward end of your slip to the channel end of your slip. When you are all the way out of your slip you will be "hanging" from the upwind piling with your motor still in reverse. You should be able to let your stern blow downwind a bit (if necessary) while slacking the line, then quickly retrieving the line by hauling it through the pulley on the zip line, through the eye at the bow, and all into the cockpit - and do it all by yourself.

When returning to your slip you would need to rig the line on the boat before entering the marina, motor to your slip, lay your bow up on the upwind piling, hook the pulley and pass the line through the pulley and back to the cockpit so you can tension it while entering your slip. The pulley should travel the length of the cable, holding your bow up to windward the whole way.

Sounds good to me in theory. If you try it, let us know what happens.

[Nigel Noble]

Thanks David. I'll give it a try and let you know how that works. My concern would be keeping off the twin Mercurys on my starboard side as the stern swings in the wind and letting go the bow line at the same time, but that's why we love doing it all alone isn't it.