T - Eak!

[fmueller]

question to all ...

If you are going to coat teak that is weathered grey (with Cetol or traditional varnish), you need to sand down to new wood, do you not?

Fred

[Jim Walsh]

Note to Jim: Sorry to hear about your bum disc issue. I would hope you have a schedule to get it repaired, AND I will bet you are happier than a frog in a pond that you were not on your trip to Bermuda when it happened.
Best wishes to all.
Bob C

Thanks, Bob.

Here's a few pictures of the process. It wasn't easy but I enjoy projects where a favorable outcome is nearly assured. I did not attempt to hide all the battle scars and water stains. I didn't want to remove too much material....just enough to obtain a smooth surface. I know I could have bleached some of the darker stains to lessen their effect but chose to let some "character" remain.

[Jim Walsh]

question to all ...

If you are going to coat teak that is weathered grey (with Cetol or traditional varnish), you need to sand down to new wood, do you not?

Fred

Yes....very judiciously.

[Jim Walsh]

Jim W, your bowsprit looks fantastic. Both the before and after look much darker/richer than the sanded teak on my boat.

Thanks. Sometimes I'm lucky and a photograph just comes out right.

[tjr818]

Jim,
That teak is beautiful. I only wish I had the nerve to sand our teak again, the PO has it down to what I think is the minimum thickness. When I scrape the old finish off I can never quite get the clean look that you have achieved by sanding

[Jim Walsh]

I had the same overzealous sanding by a PO. I was VERY careful to remove the minimum amount of material necessary. In the future I should be able to get away with a heat gun and nearly no sanding.....hopefully that is several years in the future

This is a picture from 2013 when I had just applied my second coat of Gloss topcoat. The three decade old teak does look pretty good if you apply enough elbow grease.

[Astronomertoo]

question to all ...

If you are going to coat teak that is weathered grey (with Cetol or traditional varnish), you need to sand down to new wood, do you not?

Fred

------------
Hello all,
All of the pictures and advice are spot on and should be helpful to anyone not familiar with the task of making your teakwood glow with its inherent beauty. You just have to help let it be beautiful. I have also done it all the different ways, and they all start with appropriate preparation, which is the hard part. Varnishing is the final tedious part.
Teakwood is a hardwood, but like all other woods with grain it has softer parts intelaced with hard parts. If you bleach the wood the softer part will be eroded. If you light sand it you only clean the hard part, until you get the level down to the softer areas. Jim is correct in that unless you have a heavy chunk of teak, you want to sand only as much as you must, or you will be thinnning the wood, which is the case of the cockpit side boards can eventually become so thin they can split, then must be replaced with new full thickness boards. I have seen a few like that that were down to 1/4" thick! Obviously that not desireable.
I used bleach for years and kept my wood raw, or oiled it. In short order in Florida it would oxidize or mold to black. Yucky! Fresh raw teakwood will taked a stain, but it only stains well into the softer areas, then it is hard to get out unless you sand to the deeper part of the stain. I learned that for me the prettiest teakwood was that which was varnished deeply enough to both protect the wood, and to let the light penetrate deeply to be both reflected, and refracted thru the layers, showing the 3D like luster of the true beauty of the teakwood. If you go to a boat show you will see this everywhere. But it takes a lot of work, which is time and hard work, and I no onger want to do that much hard work. Traditionally the pros will tell you to start with sanded wood, then light or thinned coats of varnish, put on like 2 thick coats, then flat sand to level the high parts of the varnish to the lower levels to make it flat. Then continue more varnish until you get at least 6 coats, then repeat the sanding to flatten it out. Final varnishing will make it all perfect, and gorgeous, as in "Bristol yacht quality." If you start with a wood that is not prepared just right it will show up in the end. If the varnish is not sanded flat it will show up. The procedure is like a dance, and most of us either are not that much of a perfectionist, or do not have the time, or it just is not worth the effort and finess needed to make it perfect.
It can be an addiction to get it just right, and to get that you must be serious, or the sea gods must be aligned just right to make the weather cooperate for the days needed to do the job.
So those of us who are lucky will do it much like Jim has explained, and then take the most obvious locations which are often seen and touched, and make those look good enough to be a bit more proud of the extra effort.

My own acquired older CD 25 has been sanded too deeply by other POs in places like the companionway slide such that the screws are proud, and will require replacement, likely after all the more serious work is over with. They must not have ever sanded the lower deck/side wood as they all still look full thickness. Instead they stained all the teakwood with dark ugly mohagany stain, so it must be sanded out. I will not have it in the water like that. There are several other pieces of wood that must have been sanded every year. I suggest, like Jim, you sand no more than necessary, and if you want good looking varnished teakwood, like I do, then learn how to maintain it in good condition.
The following might help:
NEVER, ever, use polyurethane outside on teakwood (I will not use it inside either--to each his own)
If you go for moderate or thicker, you can sand off a coat yearly and add one to maintain your coating. Your sun exposure and climate (like double for Florida) will lead you to the required sanding and number of new coats. As Jim suggested, if you have the right amount of varnish and maintain it you will not need to sand the wood, or as often, and then only lightly as needed. Too little varnish or poor products will have you back sanding and recoating more often. You must find the right method for the product, that you are willing to maintain.
Cetol seems to be the most popular and logical trick now days, and I will be trying it out. I personnaly have never been a perfectionist in varnishing, but my best friends ran a Bristol 56 for the owner, and they did maintain the best varnish I have ever seen. It never looked normal, just perfect, and it was like that inside and out. I can do my 25!
Best wishes,
Bob C

[Sea Hunt Video]

I had the same overzealous sanding by a PO. I was VERY careful to remove the minimum amount of material necessary. In the future I should be able to get away with a heat gun and nearly no sanding.....hopefully that is several years in the future

This is a picture from 2013 when I had just applied my second coat of Gloss topcoat. The three decade old teak does look pretty good if you apply enough elbow grease.

Dear friend Jim:

In the photo of your coaming, about half-way down the coaming near the left side, there appears to be a scratch ( ) where a very small amount of Cetol has been removed, possibly from you Bermuda cruise. It is probably about 1/2" in length and less than 1/16" in diameter.

Did you want to attend to that now or wait until haul out

[Astronomertoo]

I had the same overzealous sanding by a PO. I was VERY careful to remove the minimum amount of material necessary. In the future I should be able to get away with a heat gun and nearly no sanding.....hopefully that is several years in the future

This is a picture from 2013 when I had just applied my second coat of Gloss topcoat. The three decade old teak does look pretty good if you apply enough elbow grease.

Dear friend Jim:

In the photo of your coaming, about half-way down the coaming near the left side, there appears to be a scratch ( ) where a very small amount of Cetol has been removed, possibly from you Bermuda cruise. It is probably about 1/2" in length and less than 1/16" in diameter.

Did you want to attend to that now or wait until haul out

-----
Ha ha ha ha ha, still laughing.
Btw, Roberto, Red sox? is that a farm team? Where from?
heh heh
Bob C

[Jim Walsh]

I had the same overzealous sanding by a PO. I was VERY careful to remove the minimum amount of material necessary. In the future I should be able to get away with a heat gun and nearly no sanding.....hopefully that is several years in the future

This is a picture from 2013 when I had just applied my second coat of Gloss topcoat. The three decade old teak does look pretty good if you apply enough elbow grease.

Dear friend Jim:

In the photo of your coaming, about half-way down the coaming near the left side, there appears to be a scratch ( ) where a very small amount of Cetol has been removed, possibly from you Bermuda cruise. It is probably about 1/2" in length and less than 1/16" in diameter.

Did you want to attend to that now or wait until haul out

Roberto,
I photoshopped that in so people wouldn't think I was a perfectionist.

[Capt Hook]

As stated previously I "wooded" all my exterior teak in the fall of 2013 (the perfect time of year for such a project in New England, low humidity, cool temps) and immediately applied three coats of the Cetol Marine Light topped with two coats of the Cetol Marine Gloss. My intention last year was to lightly sand everything and add a light coat of the Marine Gloss. I never got around to it and I didn't feel guilty since it looked perfect.
This year while I was in Bermuda I planned to get the job done but I must have fallen under a spell cast by my surroundings. I had everything I needed with me but I was enjoying my surroundings so much I never made time. Once again I decided to take advantage of our perfect fall weather.
Alas, "the best laid plans of mice and men"......in the first week of September I ended up with a herniated disc....I've been living on muscle relaxers and pain killers since.
Looks like I'll be getting to my brightwork maintainence in the spring
Sikkens says that a light sanding and a light top coat of the Gloss annually will extend the life of the finish for several years. From the look of things so far I believe them.
People make the mistake of not reading the manufacturers application instructions or ignoring them and complain about the results. With Cetol the UV inhibitors are in the Gloss top coat so it's use allows one to get the best results out of the finish.
It's not any fun getting the teak prepped for the application of ones chosen finish, so once you've selected a finish it only makes sense to follow the manufacturers application procedure to the letter.

What does "wooded" the teak mean?

Not familiar with that term. Does it mean you took it down to bare wood?

[jbenagh]

"wooded" means took off all the old varnish to make a solid base for the new. Usually done with a combination heat gun, scrapers, sandpaper and chemicals. As others have said, for long life of the teak, keep the use of scrapers and sandpaper (esp. the later) to a minimum. For long life of the owner keep the use of chemicals to a minimum!

Jeff

[adamganz]

I had a quick email exchange with a rep at interlux to get some Cetol info straight. Much of this will be review but it was helpful for me.

There are at least a couple of Cetol product families, but the Cetol Marine line includes only 4 four products. Interlux does not recommend using non-marine Cetol on boats.

The four products are the following (qualitative info is from the rep):
- Cetol Marine: satin finish, dark amber color, can be used alone or in conjunction with Cetol Marine Gloss to achieve a high gloss finish
- Cetol Marine Light: satin finish, light amber color, can be used alone or in conjunction with Cetol Marine Gloss to achieve a high gloss finish
- Cetol Marine Natural Teak: satin finish, rich golden color, can be used alone or in conjunction with Cetol Marine Gloss to achieve a high gloss finished
- Cetol Marine Gloss: high gloss finish, no color, cannot be used alone; can only be used on top of the three Marine colors listed above

While Cetol Marine, Marine Light and Marine Natural Teak are not considered stains, and Cetol does not penetrate the wood as deeply as a stain might, these Cetol products do contain a pigment. Interlux describes the finishes as translucent, as opposed to transparent, which is why some results can look orangy/milky.

Cetol is not a wood sealer; it is a breathable finish. It’s primary purpose (in addition to aesthetics) is a UV protector.

This is noted above, but I’ll mention it again. The three Cetol Marine tints/colors all have a satin finish and can be used on their own, without the gloss.

Adam

[Jim Walsh]

http://www.yachtpaint.com/literaturecen ... -guide.pdf

This link has been noted already. It is a concise product and application guide.

[tjr818]

"wooded" means took off all the old varnish to make a solid base for the new. Usually done with a combination heat gun, scrapers, sandpaper and chemicals. As others have said, for long life of the teak, keep the use of scrapers and sandpaper (esp. the later) to a minimum. For long life of the owner keep the use of chemicals to a minimum!
Jeff

For longer life of the owner and more time sailing you might want to keep the teak "wooded".
If the PO hadn't just Cetoled Slainte I would have let it go grey , but it sure does look pretty when you keep it Cetoled.