Sovereign America 24

[Sea Hunt]

I am reluctant to publish this post because I feel somewhat like a "traitor". I have been looking for a Cape Dory for almost 2 years.

So far, I have not found my dream. The few times I have come close, someone has been there before me. Bad luck.

Recently, a good friend, and very experienced sailor, recommended that I look at a Sovereign America 24 (1991) being offered for sale for $20,000. I have never heard of these sailboats. This of course is not surprising. I am a rookie/tadpole/squid sailor.

Does anyone know anything about a Sovereign America 24? I am almost embarrassed to be asking on this CDSOA board, but I have learned to truly value the experience and advise offered here.

Thanks,

[Carl Thunberg]

Robert,
Since no one has picked this one up, I thought I'd give it a shot. Google came up completely blank. I found a couple second-hand references to a Sovereign America 24, but nothing about the boat itself. Evidently very little has been written about them. I guess you'll have to rely on the advice of experienced sailors like your friend, and of course, your surveyor.

May I be so bold as to suggest that perhaps one of the reasons you've missed out on some of the boats you've looked at is because others are more decisive? I hope you take this in the spirit I intend; as friendly advice. There will always be a reason not to buy. But faint heart never won fair lady.

[Sea Hunt]

Hello Carl:

Unfortunately, I must agree with your comments and take no offense. The truth is the truth. It seems the older I get the more cautious I am. I have been looking at buying a new TV for more than 3 years!!!. The Admiral thinks (actually knows) I am nuts. She too refers to me as indecisive (have you two been communicating??) and wonders how I ever got the nerve to first ask her out.

As for the Sovereign 24, before posting my inquiry on this board, I too researched Google, and several other search engines and boating sources, trying to find out something about them. I came up with "zero", "squadooch", "nada", "zilch", "bupcus". The fact that no one on this experienced board knows anything about them is also very telling.

I am retired, so a day spent looking at her is not really wasted. She is in the Florida Keys. A pleasant drive from Miami.

I will also be looking at a Cape Dory 27 on the same trip.

I will let you know what I find out.

Again, my thanks for your efforts.

[barfwinkle]

Hi Sea Hunt

Before buying my 25D I considered a Sovereign 24. I am not too sure if it is the same boat or not, but I still like the boat and as I recall (its been 10 years now) it was fairly well made. But hey, I have slept since then.

Good luck
http://old.cruisingworld.com/ssbk/sovere24.htm

[Sea Hunt]

Hello Bill:

Thanks for the information. I too checked out Yachtworld.com last week and saw their listings for Sovereigns. Interestingly, the pictures the owner has sent me show her to be a little different from the pictures of the Sovereign 24s shown on Yachtworld, even for the same year of mfg. - number of ports, cabin configuration.

Anyways, I have very much fallen in love with Cape Dorys and feel almost like I am "cheating" to even look at anything else. But, it is a pleasant distraction. As the Admiral says - "as long as that is the only cheating you do".

[bottomscraper]

Our previous boat was an S2 23 (also known as a 7.0). This was one of the first sailboats S2 made. S2 didn't make it for long and sold the molds to Sovereign. (I think for a reason) Sovereign sold basically the same boat as the Sovereign 23. It had different ports and interior changes but otherwise was the same. Our S2 did NOT sail well. We only kept it only one season. The link that barfwinkle posted looks like the same hull with a different cabin and maybe a short bowsprit to make it 24ft. All of the other numbers are the same as the S2 23 / Sovereign 23.

There appears to be several different boats on Yachtworld all called a Sovereign 24. If it's a shoal draft like the one in barwinkle's link I would say avoid it.

Note that S2 did make some good boats but the 7.0 / 23 was not one of them.

[Sea Hunt]

Hello Rich:

Yes, the specs on the one I will look at next week are identical to the specs in Barwinkle's (Bill's) link, including LOA, beam and shoal draft - all are identical.

I will still drive down and take a look at her but, given your experience with these boats (or the similar S2) and your knowledge of their sailing characteristics, I will NOT make an offer. I will have enough to deal with as a newbie owner of a sailboat without worrying about inherently bad structural sailing characteristics.

I still have a CD 27 to look at in the Keys. I am told they sail pretty well.

Thanks again for everyone's terrific input. This really is a great group of sailors

[Drew]

Sea Hunt - You say you live in S. Florida? Good God, man, go look at the 27 that is posted for sale here! It appears, from the website, to be among the best-cared for, smallish Cape Dorys I have ever seen. And it's moored in your back yard!

I am "in the hunt" as well, but have a current boat that I must sell first. That will not happen 'till spring (I hope) so you've got 6 months before the competition heats up Go start the car and point it south!

[Sea Hunt]

Hello Drew:

Yes, I have already scheduled a meeting with the owner of the CD 27 for next week.

My biggest concern with the CD 27 is its size. This will be my first sailboat ownership and my sailing experience is somewhat limited.
I will also be single handing her. I was hoping for a CD 22 but have expanded my search to include Ty Weekenders, CD 25Ds and CD 27s.

Thanks for the encouragement and the heads up about "the competition" in few months.

[SeaBelle]

Years ago after being w/o a boat for several years, I joined my best friend in a partnership with his brother on a shoal draft Columbia 26.

Her sole redeeming value was that she cost me 1/3 of cheap and got me on the water again. We sailed first out of Portland, ME then out of Muscoungas Bay. BUT SHE DIDN'T SAIL WORTH A DARN! Mostly because of that keel.

1. She didn't point well.
2. She tacked through about 120 degrees (at best)
3. She 'crabbed'.

Countless times this stubborn Captain tacked for an hour or more and after making no way dropped sail and turned on the outboard, realizing yet again that I was dumber than ballast.

2 lessons learned: if possible, own a boat you can love, one that sails reasonably well and, secondly, sail the boat as she is not how you want her to be.

[Duncan Maio]

My biggest concern with the CD 27 is its size. This will be my first sailboat ownership and my sailing experience is somewhat limited.
I will also be single handing her.

Ten years ago we were in your shoes. Go for the CD27. She will take better care of you than you will of her, no matter how good you are to your boat. She also singlehands just fine.

Happy hunting.

[Clay Stalker]

Sea Hunt:

I would avoid purchasing any boat that is not well known and well-respected, especially as a new sailor and boat owner. Boats have a remarkable way of shrinking in the water, and if you get the fever, you might find yourself looking for more room and/or performance sooner than you think. Or you might just end up like me, whose tastes and requirements change every few years....in any event, having a boat that is sought after and easy to sell will make your life a lot easier. Cape Dorys definately fit into this category.

Clay Stalker

[Sea Hunt]

Hello Jack, Duncan and Clay:

Thanks very much for the information and advise. It is much appreciated.

When I was first told about the Sovereign 24 by my sailing friend, I tried to find out what I could on Google and various sailing websites. I came up with nothing. This was a big caution flag for me.

Now reading your comments and those of other CDSOA members, I understand why I could not find anything - apparently very, very few of these boats were actual launched because they did not (do not) have good sailing characteristics.

There is also a CD Ty Weekender in Northern Florida I looked at several weeks ago. I may go back for a second look. I had an ankle injury a few weeks ago and this curtailed my boat search efforts - no climbing onto boats. Things are much better now.

Again, my thanks to everyone on this board for their insights and suggestions.