Hi
Is a Mariner 5 hp enouph tp power a CD 25?
Thanks
JB
CD 25 motor
Moderator: Jim Walsh
Yes!
Yes! Plenty.
Didereaux- San Leon, TX
last owner of CD-25 #183 "Spring Gail"
"I do not attempt to make leopards change their spots...after I have skinned them, they are free to grow 'em back or not, as they see fit!" Didereaux 2007
last owner of CD-25 #183 "Spring Gail"
"I do not attempt to make leopards change their spots...after I have skinned them, they are free to grow 'em back or not, as they see fit!" Didereaux 2007
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Guest
dc25
Can I ask what you power your vessel with?
I am on eastern Lake Erie, it can get pretty nasty out here.
How do you like your CD25? I am in the market for one. They seem to be quite seaworthy and reasonably priced. I have 2 young children who I intend to mold into sailors as well.
Thanks for your feedback.
JB
I am on eastern Lake Erie, it can get pretty nasty out here.
How do you like your CD25? I am in the market for one. They seem to be quite seaworthy and reasonably priced. I have 2 young children who I intend to mold into sailors as well.
Thanks for your feedback.
JB
Maybe, it depends.
Sorry Didereaux, but I cannot give a definitive yes.
It depends on the conditions you will use it in. Fighting currents, 40+ kt storm conditions, and having to tow someone will demand more horses. 5hp will probably get you up to hull speed in normal conditions, no doubt, but I have found my 9.9 Honda to come in handy heading into 40+ kt winds on the Chesapeake. A little extra hp made a big difference trying to hold steerage. If you have a deal on a 5hp, I'd say go for it, but just realize your limitations. It will certainly rescue you went the wind dies and bring you to the dock after dropping your canvass. In my opinion, I'd go a bit higher, but that is because I have a history of finding storms. I have not heard of anyone fitting anything larger than a 10hp in a CD25. There are limitations, but if you search this board, you will find many examples of motor mount modifications that will help you to properly place up to 10hp. Is the motor you are looking at a long shaft? A std shaft will barely submearge the prop.
You will find many people who are very committed to their CD25s. They are indeed tough and based on this board's testimonials, very flexible cruisers. A frequent CD board poster (Winthrop) has sailed his as a bluewater vessel, and many daysail their CD25s. <I think I am providing an accurate account of Winthrop's resume. I am sure some will correct me otherwise.> Very few sailboats have such a great community as the Cape Dory boat owners. This is evidence in this site and the knowledge of the sailors posting. I am planning a refit this next year and you can find information on everything from rewiring to major structural repairs. The members of this board got me started off the right foot by encouraging me to get a marine survey, I'd certainly echo this back to you. My sailing experience prior to "Wind Song" was 12-18' centerboard boats, and I can attest that a CD25 is a forgiving vessel for learning sailing/cruising skills (good for your kids, and possibly you, depending on your experience). Likewise, CD25s are sturdy enough to let you make some mistakes without suffering dire consequances.
Best of luck to you on finding the boat that best suits your needs.
-Trey
It depends on the conditions you will use it in. Fighting currents, 40+ kt storm conditions, and having to tow someone will demand more horses. 5hp will probably get you up to hull speed in normal conditions, no doubt, but I have found my 9.9 Honda to come in handy heading into 40+ kt winds on the Chesapeake. A little extra hp made a big difference trying to hold steerage. If you have a deal on a 5hp, I'd say go for it, but just realize your limitations. It will certainly rescue you went the wind dies and bring you to the dock after dropping your canvass. In my opinion, I'd go a bit higher, but that is because I have a history of finding storms. I have not heard of anyone fitting anything larger than a 10hp in a CD25. There are limitations, but if you search this board, you will find many examples of motor mount modifications that will help you to properly place up to 10hp. Is the motor you are looking at a long shaft? A std shaft will barely submearge the prop.
You will find many people who are very committed to their CD25s. They are indeed tough and based on this board's testimonials, very flexible cruisers. A frequent CD board poster (Winthrop) has sailed his as a bluewater vessel, and many daysail their CD25s. <I think I am providing an accurate account of Winthrop's resume. I am sure some will correct me otherwise.> Very few sailboats have such a great community as the Cape Dory boat owners. This is evidence in this site and the knowledge of the sailors posting. I am planning a refit this next year and you can find information on everything from rewiring to major structural repairs. The members of this board got me started off the right foot by encouraging me to get a marine survey, I'd certainly echo this back to you. My sailing experience prior to "Wind Song" was 12-18' centerboard boats, and I can attest that a CD25 is a forgiving vessel for learning sailing/cruising skills (good for your kids, and possibly you, depending on your experience). Likewise, CD25s are sturdy enough to let you make some mistakes without suffering dire consequances.
Best of luck to you on finding the boat that best suits your needs.
-Trey
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Guest
You answered my question of whether or not I need a long shaft outboard.
I am in the process of looking at a couple CD25's. One is in a bit better shape than the other and prices are so reflected.
Im a bit reluctant to get into too much of a project however my boat budget requires it to a degree.
How much of a job is it to run new halyards and wiring?
I am in the process of looking at a couple CD25's. One is in a bit better shape than the other and prices are so reflected.
Im a bit reluctant to get into too much of a project however my boat budget requires it to a degree.
How much of a job is it to run new halyards and wiring?
halyards/wiring
Halyards are very simple. Assuming the mast is stepped, just take the old halyard and tape the new halyard to it (end to end). MAKE SURE you use a heavy tape and wrap it a few times.
Wiring...I'll let you know this summer. From what I have heard, it can be tricky because portions of the wiring is bonded to the boat, making "pull-through" difficult and impossible in places. Search "wiring" on the board...There is much conversation on this.
I ran into the same issue you are...I had a limited budget, but wanted a perfect boat. I bought as much as I could afford and planned on doing improvements as I could afford them. "Wind Song" has many years of sailing left in her the way she is, but to make her more worry free, I am going to do some serious work on her over the next year and a half. Basically a little investment to keep me on he water more and in the yard less. My goal is to do a refit on her now that will make her more low-maintenance and tight for another 28 years. I bought her about 2 years ago and it is a 1978 original (original everything). But she is was well taken care of (generally a solid foundation to work with).
IMHO, buy as much as you can afford, because when it comes time for you to make repairs/improvements...it will cost you more out of pocket than if you had bought a boat with a few bells and whistles. For example, A new dodger can cost anywhere from $1000 to $2000. But if you by a boat with a decent dodger, it is practically tossed into the selling price with out much notice. "Wind Song" was almost $6k, but I'll probably invest as much as $10-12k on her (including awlgripping, sails, dodger and all the other trimmings. Eric Woodman's "Allia" (CD25) is for sale, and she is wonderfully maintained. She is a boat that could sail for many years without the need for significant new owner repairs. Eric advertises "lots of extras" and that is generally what you get. I am sure he is selling at a sacrifice.
CD25s are generally tough. A marine inspection will point out any safety issues and structural problems (incl. seacock inspection and balsa-core water absorption). All our CD25s are getting older, and 30 years is approaching or beyond the reasonable life-expectancy of much of the equipment on any vessel. It is a tribute to CDs that there are so many "originals" in such good shape. It is amazing how the little things add up $$$. So while finding a tight/solid boat is paramount, the little things should be servicable or easily fixed...(knowing that a few weekends will be spend with your boat and a toolbox).
See what you might be able to work out with the owner of the boat in better condition. Perhaps get your surveyor to look at both and help you determine what is a more cost effective decision. I bought from the seacock owner, an older fellow, and he was very pleased that it was staying on the Chesapeake Bay. I offered 80% of his asking price, and so did someone else, but my "keeping her on the Bay" remark won me the boat.
Back to the motor, while I have a 9.9hp...I feel that a 6.0hp is the minimum in your open water conditions...but having children on board and wanting the added security... I think a 7.5-8.5hp is ideal. I am very pleased with my 9.9hp, except when it comes time to lift it out of the well.
My suggestions represent my own experience...I sure others might suggest to get the project boat and enjoy the process of fixing her up. Just keep in mind the good rule of thumb, that a boat on the water is more fun than a boat in the yard...and unfortunately you have to pay a little more up front for "water time."
-Trey
Wiring...I'll let you know this summer. From what I have heard, it can be tricky because portions of the wiring is bonded to the boat, making "pull-through" difficult and impossible in places. Search "wiring" on the board...There is much conversation on this.
I ran into the same issue you are...I had a limited budget, but wanted a perfect boat. I bought as much as I could afford and planned on doing improvements as I could afford them. "Wind Song" has many years of sailing left in her the way she is, but to make her more worry free, I am going to do some serious work on her over the next year and a half. Basically a little investment to keep me on he water more and in the yard less. My goal is to do a refit on her now that will make her more low-maintenance and tight for another 28 years. I bought her about 2 years ago and it is a 1978 original (original everything). But she is was well taken care of (generally a solid foundation to work with).
IMHO, buy as much as you can afford, because when it comes time for you to make repairs/improvements...it will cost you more out of pocket than if you had bought a boat with a few bells and whistles. For example, A new dodger can cost anywhere from $1000 to $2000. But if you by a boat with a decent dodger, it is practically tossed into the selling price with out much notice. "Wind Song" was almost $6k, but I'll probably invest as much as $10-12k on her (including awlgripping, sails, dodger and all the other trimmings. Eric Woodman's "Allia" (CD25) is for sale, and she is wonderfully maintained. She is a boat that could sail for many years without the need for significant new owner repairs. Eric advertises "lots of extras" and that is generally what you get. I am sure he is selling at a sacrifice.
CD25s are generally tough. A marine inspection will point out any safety issues and structural problems (incl. seacock inspection and balsa-core water absorption). All our CD25s are getting older, and 30 years is approaching or beyond the reasonable life-expectancy of much of the equipment on any vessel. It is a tribute to CDs that there are so many "originals" in such good shape. It is amazing how the little things add up $$$. So while finding a tight/solid boat is paramount, the little things should be servicable or easily fixed...(knowing that a few weekends will be spend with your boat and a toolbox).
See what you might be able to work out with the owner of the boat in better condition. Perhaps get your surveyor to look at both and help you determine what is a more cost effective decision. I bought from the seacock owner, an older fellow, and he was very pleased that it was staying on the Chesapeake Bay. I offered 80% of his asking price, and so did someone else, but my "keeping her on the Bay" remark won me the boat.
Back to the motor, while I have a 9.9hp...I feel that a 6.0hp is the minimum in your open water conditions...but having children on board and wanting the added security... I think a 7.5-8.5hp is ideal. I am very pleased with my 9.9hp, except when it comes time to lift it out of the well.
My suggestions represent my own experience...I sure others might suggest to get the project boat and enjoy the process of fixing her up. Just keep in mind the good rule of thumb, that a boat on the water is more fun than a boat in the yard...and unfortunately you have to pay a little more up front for "water time."
-Trey
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Guest
Thanks for your reply.
Your advice is much appreciated. Your dodger point, is a good one.
I am kind of leaning in the direction of spending a little more initially.
I have been crewing on other boats for 6 or so years and I am very much looking forward to having a boat of my own. To be able to head down to the dock in the mornings w/ a hot cup of joe and a newspaper to me seems priceless.
CD's just seem to have something about them, classic lines, salty look, the over-built thing, etc etc.
Regards
Good luck w/ your Wind Song.
JB
Your advice is much appreciated. Your dodger point, is a good one.
I am kind of leaning in the direction of spending a little more initially.
I have been crewing on other boats for 6 or so years and I am very much looking forward to having a boat of my own. To be able to head down to the dock in the mornings w/ a hot cup of joe and a newspaper to me seems priceless.
CD's just seem to have something about them, classic lines, salty look, the over-built thing, etc etc.
Regards
Good luck w/ your Wind Song.
JB
John Ring's CD25 History Website
Good luck to you and hope you see you on the board with a "new owner" announcement some day.
BTW, go to http://www.yachttantalus.com/CD25%20History.htm to read and see the history of the CD25 as written by former owner John Ring, now owner of "Tantalus," a CD28. His old CD25 "Sovereign" is now Roy J.'s "Auburn." Anyway...it is a great link (Thanks John... for keeping it on the web after selling your boat. It is a great resource!).
My boat is a 1978 production...after the '76 bridgedeck addition and just before the bronze ports.
Take Care,
Trey
BTW, go to http://www.yachttantalus.com/CD25%20History.htm to read and see the history of the CD25 as written by former owner John Ring, now owner of "Tantalus," a CD28. His old CD25 "Sovereign" is now Roy J.'s "Auburn." Anyway...it is a great link (Thanks John... for keeping it on the web after selling your boat. It is a great resource!).
My boat is a 1978 production...after the '76 bridgedeck addition and just before the bronze ports.
Take Care,
Trey
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Will Wheatley
Working on a 25
Hi JBAnonymous wrote:You answered my question of whether or not I need a long shaft outboard.
I am in the process of looking at a couple CD25's. One is in a bit better shape than the other and prices are so reflected.
Im a bit reluctant to get into too much of a project however my boat budget requires it to a degree.
How much of a job is it to run new halyards and wiring?
New halyards is no big deal at worst you will have to lower the mast. Since you have to lower the mast to redo the wiring anyway I would say it would work out OK
The wiring is dicey in places as Trey said. All the wiring for the mast and cabin and the forward nav lights run forward from the panel on the port side between the coach roof and the headliner. Right around the front of the overhead cut-out, the wiring is run through some sort of bulkhead support and glassed or glued in place before assembly is complete. The result is double negative. you can't use the old wiring to pull the new wires though and it is remarkably difficult to get new wires though this same path without damaging the headliner.
Bottom line is you will probably have to be creative. I wound up drilling a new 4 1/4 inch hole in the headliner just above the table. this helped me get the wires through to the mast etc. I covered the hole with a new dome light like the one near the panel.
For the forward nav and cabin lights you may have to run new wires under the berths and sole and come up to them from the bottom.
Rebuilding the panel is easy so is ordering a new one. Just do a wiring diagram to figure out acurate wire sizes and amp loads. The diagram and planning is easy compared to the install but it is not impossible. Just make sure you include all your new gadgets in the new plan. The original wiring only employs 3 or 4 of the eight swithches. you will easily fill the rest with electronics, bilge pump, spreader lights and anchor light which you will want to add as long as you are already doing the rest of it.
As for engines I think a 5 is fine. I know of a guy with a Bristol 27 with a Honda 5 and he says it goes at hull speed most of the time. I have a 6hp and have no complaints. When I repower I will look at the 6 and 8 hp engines from Tohatsu the 8 and 6 are supposedly on the same frame and block so they weigh almost the same.
Also a 20 inch shaft is reccomended but Jon Ring did refit his mount for a 15 inch and was happy. I may do this with the next motor so that I can use the same motor for the sailbaot and the dink. Right now I use the dink for trips overnight or longer and I have to bring a seperate motor.
Hope I helped some. Good luck and I hope we see you as a happy owner soon. Will Wheatley
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winthrop fisher
- Posts: 837
- Joined: Feb 7th, '05, 17:52
- Location: Typhoon Wk 75 "Easy Rider" &
cd 22 "Easy Rider Sr" 84
Re: CD 25 motor
Hi... yes a five hp can push your cd 25 just fine.....winthrop
Is a Mariner 5 hp enouph tp power a CD 25?
Thanks
JB[/quote]
Is a Mariner 5 hp enouph tp power a CD 25?
Thanks
JB[/quote]
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winthrop fisher
- Posts: 837
- Joined: Feb 7th, '05, 17:52
- Location: Typhoon Wk 75 "Easy Rider" &
cd 22 "Easy Rider Sr" 84
Re: Maybe, it depends.
Hi...
i saw a 4hp pushing a 32 footer in small gale going in to the channel, when ever one was just passing him up.
he told me that his main engine broke down and he was using his out board for his dingy, it work just fine, but real slow 3 knots...
winthrop
i saw a 4hp pushing a 32 footer in small gale going in to the channel, when ever one was just passing him up.
he told me that his main engine broke down and he was using his out board for his dingy, it work just fine, but real slow 3 knots...
winthrop
treyporter wrote:Sorry Didereaux, but I cannot give a definitive yes.
It depends on the conditions you will use it in. Fighting currents, 40+ kt storm conditions, and having to tow someone will demand more horses. 5hp will probably get you up to hull speed in normal conditions, no doubt, but I have found my 9.9 Honda to come in handy heading into 40+ kt winds on the Chesapeake. A little extra hp made a big difference trying to hold steerage. If you have a deal on a 5hp, I'd say go for it, but just realize your limitations. It will certainly rescue you went the wind dies and bring you to the dock after dropping your canvass. In my opinion, I'd go a bit higher, but that is because I have a history of finding storms. I have not heard of anyone fitting anything larger than a 10hp in a CD25. There are limitations, but if you search this board, you will find many examples of motor mount modifications that will help you to properly place up to 10hp. Is the motor you are looking at a long shaft? A std shaft will barely submearge the prop.
You will find many people who are very committed to their CD25s. They are indeed tough and based on this board's testimonials, very flexible cruisers. A frequent CD board poster (Winthrop) has sailed his as a bluewater vessel, and many daysail their CD25s. <I think I am providing an accurate account of Winthrop's resume. I am sure some will correct me otherwise.> Very few sailboats have such a great community as the Cape Dory boat owners. This is evidence in this site and the knowledge of the sailors posting. I am planning a refit this next year and you can find information on everything from rewiring to major structural repairs. The members of this board got me started off the right foot by encouraging me to get a marine survey, I'd certainly echo this back to you. My sailing experience prior to "Wind Song" was 12-18' centerboard boats, and I can attest that a CD25 is a forgiving vessel for learning sailing/cruising skills (good for your kids, and possibly you, depending on your experience). Likewise, CD25s are sturdy enough to let you make some mistakes without suffering dire consequances.
Best of luck to you on finding the boat that best suits your needs.
-Trey
I nearly lost steerage
I'll yeild to you guys' experience. You, Will, and Didereaux have the resume to back it up and I just have few experiences where I simply should not have been out in the water in such poor conditions. I found myself partially loosing steerage in a bad Chesapeake storm (might not have been the motor as much as the skipper). I hate that I have a 9.9 simply because it is a Cape Dory, not a McGregor...but having 1/2 the power at that given time would really concern me.
-Trey
-Trey
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Guest
CD 25
A friend of mine ( an typhoon owner ) is lending his eyes/opinions to me this week as I/we check out a couple of CD25's for sale.
As I mentioned, one is considerably less expensive than the other, however some significant scratching/gauging of fglass is evident in the cock pit along with some toe rail ugliness/abuse. The engine is also a bit scarey.
The other boat (approx 2-3K more) is a bit more polished and a few years newer. One thing that concerns me about this boat is a through hull fitting that looks a bit funky. It looks a bit separated from the hull. The cradle on the more expensive boat is also in poor shape...the cradle on the cheaper boat is in nice shape.
These are the thougts going through my mind as I lay down at night next to the Mrs. at night!
Im optimistic that I will be a new owner soon.
This MessBoard is really great. Thanks for all the insight.
JB
As I mentioned, one is considerably less expensive than the other, however some significant scratching/gauging of fglass is evident in the cock pit along with some toe rail ugliness/abuse. The engine is also a bit scarey.
The other boat (approx 2-3K more) is a bit more polished and a few years newer. One thing that concerns me about this boat is a through hull fitting that looks a bit funky. It looks a bit separated from the hull. The cradle on the more expensive boat is also in poor shape...the cradle on the cheaper boat is in nice shape.
These are the thougts going through my mind as I lay down at night next to the Mrs. at night!
Im optimistic that I will be a new owner soon.
This MessBoard is really great. Thanks for all the insight.
JB
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Paul Clayton
- Posts: 50
- Joined: Feb 8th, '05, 16:20
- Contact:
CD25 Motor
Well, we''ve heard a lot of different opinions on remotoring a CD25, so let me throw in mine. I just bought a Nissan 8hp 4 stroke to replace an elderly Yamaha 6hp 2 stroke. That old Yamaha moved my boat just fine and was reliable to boot, but it was extremely loud and would suffocate itself if I ran it with the lazarette cover closed. The fumes were enough to give me a headache.
I decided that if I was going to buy a new motor, I wanted a 4 stroke with an alternator to keep my battery up. The Nissan 8hp was the smallest engine I could find with an alternator, and it sounded from some of the posts to the board like it would fit, so I ordered one from my favorite outfitter.
Let me say that this motor is quite a bit bigger and quite a bit heavier than even a 25 year old Yamaha 2 stroke. Shoehorning this monster into a CD25 lazarette required removal and replacement of the motor mounts as well as removal of the wooden panel at the front of the lazarette along with its associated trim. In addition, the lazarette cover won't quite close now and I will have to make an extension for it. All in all, I probably put in 16 hours of work so far in addition to finding a metalworker who could make me a new motor mount. Now I'm not real handy with this kind of thing and you could probably do it quicker, but just know what you are getting into.
Would I do it again? Probably not - I'd drop a new 6hp 4 stroke in and find some other way to keep the battery charged. But do I regret it, now that all (most) of the work is done? No way. I've got a big, powerful engine that will serve me well fighting the currents of the Cape Fear river, something that will be seriously understressed as I motor for hours down the ICW. If I had the luxury of keeping the boat on a good sailing ground, it would all be overkill, but in truth my boat (like many others) has to serve as half sailboat, half powerboat - for every open bay or sound there are 20 miles of narrow canal. So there's my two cents worth - everyone has his own situation, and one size definitely doesn't fit all.
pmc
I decided that if I was going to buy a new motor, I wanted a 4 stroke with an alternator to keep my battery up. The Nissan 8hp was the smallest engine I could find with an alternator, and it sounded from some of the posts to the board like it would fit, so I ordered one from my favorite outfitter.
Let me say that this motor is quite a bit bigger and quite a bit heavier than even a 25 year old Yamaha 2 stroke. Shoehorning this monster into a CD25 lazarette required removal and replacement of the motor mounts as well as removal of the wooden panel at the front of the lazarette along with its associated trim. In addition, the lazarette cover won't quite close now and I will have to make an extension for it. All in all, I probably put in 16 hours of work so far in addition to finding a metalworker who could make me a new motor mount. Now I'm not real handy with this kind of thing and you could probably do it quicker, but just know what you are getting into.
Would I do it again? Probably not - I'd drop a new 6hp 4 stroke in and find some other way to keep the battery charged. But do I regret it, now that all (most) of the work is done? No way. I've got a big, powerful engine that will serve me well fighting the currents of the Cape Fear river, something that will be seriously understressed as I motor for hours down the ICW. If I had the luxury of keeping the boat on a good sailing ground, it would all be overkill, but in truth my boat (like many others) has to serve as half sailboat, half powerboat - for every open bay or sound there are 20 miles of narrow canal. So there's my two cents worth - everyone has his own situation, and one size definitely doesn't fit all.
pmc