The cost of a slip is probably the most depressing aspect of sailing. Currently my 25D is on a trailer for restoration, but soon I too will join your ranks (the sailing wounded?). Through our CDSOA we are organized into fleets; would it be possible for some fleet members to pool resources and purchase waterfront property suitable for dockage. If property could be secured, perhaps better sailing oppurtunities would be created. Might owners from the NE plan for that winter when they'll leave their Dory with the Carolina or Gulf Coast fleet, etc? If this is approached as an organization-wide initiative, or at least east coast/ west coast cooperatives, perhaps we can get more (at least more varied sailing) for our money. Of course, this is much more complex than simply buying land and we may not have the membership numbers to go this alone, but such cooperative efforts have succeeded for years in other recreational groups. Beautiful waterfront property is still available (not much) at very affordable prices (relatively) at places like the Georgia coast. The really high cost comes with convenient access near population centers. THIS WILL ONLY GET WORSE.
Perhaps the complexity of this issue overwhelms consideration, but the potential benefits are exciting.
This was not my first reaction to the discussion of the high cost of slips. Actually, my first reaction was rather... male.............. especially divorced male, but I'm happily married now and look forward to sailing with my sweetheart in distant, exotic ports, which brings up the high cost of flying.
gysail@copper.net
High cost vs Sinking feeling
Moderator: Jim Walsh
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Ed Haley
Re: High cost vs Sinking feeling
Good thought provoking question. I know of several friends of mine who actually bought a small marina and did the exact same thing. They saved lots of slip fees but the savings comes with a price.
Not to throw water on your idea, but there are costs for such an endeavor that must be considered such as insurance, security, utilities, taxes, mortgage, dock/slip upkeep, facilities to be maintained, and many jobs needing to be completed to insure a successful endeavor. Not the least of which is the necessity to depend on volunteerism (not always reliable) to complete tasks. Then there is the discrepancy between those who own small boats and those who own large boats. You would need to set up a board of directors or something like a yacht club to manage the affairs.
Having said all that, this would still be an attractive financial undertaking for dedicated boaters. When you're ready to end your boating activities, your saleable share would be a valuable return on your investment.
I certainly would be interested in investing in a share if the location was attractive and legal affairs could be negotiated or secured. Let's see how much interest there is in this idea.
Ed Haley
s/v Mokita
CD330 #1
Mystic CT
eghaleyNOSPAM@twcny.rr.com
Not to throw water on your idea, but there are costs for such an endeavor that must be considered such as insurance, security, utilities, taxes, mortgage, dock/slip upkeep, facilities to be maintained, and many jobs needing to be completed to insure a successful endeavor. Not the least of which is the necessity to depend on volunteerism (not always reliable) to complete tasks. Then there is the discrepancy between those who own small boats and those who own large boats. You would need to set up a board of directors or something like a yacht club to manage the affairs.
Having said all that, this would still be an attractive financial undertaking for dedicated boaters. When you're ready to end your boating activities, your saleable share would be a valuable return on your investment.
I certainly would be interested in investing in a share if the location was attractive and legal affairs could be negotiated or secured. Let's see how much interest there is in this idea.
Ed Haley
s/v Mokita
CD330 #1
Mystic CT
eghaleyNOSPAM@twcny.rr.com
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Garrard Young
Re: High cost vs Sinking feeling
You're absolutely right, Ed. The range and complexity of such an undertaking would be formidable. Perhaps too demanding. Response will be interesting. Those with time shares, community covenants and such, will see the problems as well as possibilities. But it could be doable.... maybe best discussed next winter.... our biggest weakness as a group is probably that none of us want more problems... we just want to sail... if I weren't a confirmed escapist, I probably wouldn't have the boat in the first place.
Garrard
gysail@copper.net
Garrard
gysail@copper.net
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Ken Coit
I Have Info
If anyone gets serious about a CD marina condo operation, you might want to take a look at how our marina is organized and operates.
Ken
parfaitNOSPAM@nc.rr.com
Ken
Garrard Young wrote: The cost of a slip is probably the most depressing aspect of sailing. Currently my 25D is on a trailer for restoration, but soon I too will join your ranks (the sailing wounded?). Through our CDSOA we are organized into fleets; would it be possible for some fleet members to pool resources and purchase waterfront property suitable for dockage. If property could be secured, perhaps better sailing oppurtunities would be created. Might owners from the NE plan for that winter when they'll leave their Dory with the Carolina or Gulf Coast fleet, etc? If this is approached as an organization-wide initiative, or at least east coast/ west coast cooperatives, perhaps we can get more (at least more varied sailing) for our money. Of course, this is much more complex than simply buying land and we may not have the membership numbers to go this alone, but such cooperative efforts have succeeded for years in other recreational groups. Beautiful waterfront property is still available (not much) at very affordable prices (relatively) at places like the Georgia coast. The really high cost comes with convenient access near population centers. THIS WILL ONLY GET WORSE.
Perhaps the complexity of this issue overwhelms consideration, but the potential benefits are exciting.
This was not my first reaction to the discussion of the high cost of slips. Actually, my first reaction was rather... male.............. especially divorced male, but I'm happily married now and look forward to sailing with my sweetheart in distant, exotic ports, which brings up the high cost of flying.
parfaitNOSPAM@nc.rr.com
-
sloopjohnl
Re: High cost vs Sinking feeling
within this group you may come upon some nearing retirement or searching for a career change that would fill the needs of managers, maintenance personnel both for facilities and boats, security personnel, etc.
Ed Haley wrote: Good thought provoking question. I know of several friends of mine who actually bought a small marina and did the exact same thing. They saved lots of slip fees but the savings comes with a price.
Not to throw water on your idea, but there are costs for such an endeavor that must be considered such as insurance, security, utilities, taxes, mortgage, dock/slip upkeep, facilities to be maintained, and many jobs needing to be completed to insure a successful endeavor. Not the least of which is the necessity to depend on volunteerism (not always reliable) to complete tasks. Then there is the discrepancy between those who own small boats and those who own large boats. You would need to set up a board of directors or something like a yacht club to manage the affairs.
Having said all that, this would still be an attractive financial undertaking for dedicated boaters. When you're ready to end your boating activities, your saleable share would be a valuable return on your investment.
I certainly would be interested in investing in a share if the location was attractive and legal affairs could be negotiated or secured. Let's see how much interest there is in this idea.
Ed Haley
s/v Mokita
CD330 #1
Mystic CT
-
Richard Smith
Re: High cost vs Sinking feeling
Access to the water has been an issue with me since I bought my first boat (Hobie 16) 25 years ago.
I have reached the conclusion that there is no economical way of keeping a larger boat at a slip or mooring (with for profit launch service) in the metropolitan area. This year it costs $1,900 to rent a slip for a 18 foot Catboat at the Nicholas Great Kills marina on Staten Island. For that one gets hostility from the management and the power boat owners who predominate.
3 years ago I put my money where my mouth is and sold my last sailboat (Albin Cumulus 28) and bought a very beautiful sea kayak. My on-going cost of ownership is ZERO.
Is paddling the type of boating I prefer... NO! However larger boats, perhaps starting at 18 feet, are regarded as expensive toys for the rich and there is NOT THE SLIGHTEST POSSIBILITY that any municipality is going to underwrite the costs of ownership. Condo and co-op marinas have been set up. In fact there is a totally unused one at the entrance of Great Kills Harbor, Staten Island. In general the slips in these operations proved unmarketable.
This is why there is a GLUT of older sailboats on the market. In fact it’s literally impossible to give them away!
In my opinion the only economical way to approach this issue is to set up a mooring field and operate a launch service out of nearby marina. This seems to work in Huntington and Oyster Bay.
The second and perhaps non-acceptable option is to drop down to smaller boats which can be hand dollied to a simple launching ramp. Such an operation is in place and popular, for years in Spruce Run Lake in New Jersey.
I am quite sure that operations like GateWay here in New York would be willing and perhaps eager to establish the necessary facilities for smaller dry sailed boats if approached appropriately.
Richard Smith
sailnut@asan.com
I have reached the conclusion that there is no economical way of keeping a larger boat at a slip or mooring (with for profit launch service) in the metropolitan area. This year it costs $1,900 to rent a slip for a 18 foot Catboat at the Nicholas Great Kills marina on Staten Island. For that one gets hostility from the management and the power boat owners who predominate.
3 years ago I put my money where my mouth is and sold my last sailboat (Albin Cumulus 28) and bought a very beautiful sea kayak. My on-going cost of ownership is ZERO.
Is paddling the type of boating I prefer... NO! However larger boats, perhaps starting at 18 feet, are regarded as expensive toys for the rich and there is NOT THE SLIGHTEST POSSIBILITY that any municipality is going to underwrite the costs of ownership. Condo and co-op marinas have been set up. In fact there is a totally unused one at the entrance of Great Kills Harbor, Staten Island. In general the slips in these operations proved unmarketable.
This is why there is a GLUT of older sailboats on the market. In fact it’s literally impossible to give them away!
In my opinion the only economical way to approach this issue is to set up a mooring field and operate a launch service out of nearby marina. This seems to work in Huntington and Oyster Bay.
The second and perhaps non-acceptable option is to drop down to smaller boats which can be hand dollied to a simple launching ramp. Such an operation is in place and popular, for years in Spruce Run Lake in New Jersey.
I am quite sure that operations like GateWay here in New York would be willing and perhaps eager to establish the necessary facilities for smaller dry sailed boats if approached appropriately.
Richard Smith
sailnut@asan.com