When I bought Second Chance 4 years ago the cockpit locker hasps were missing, and someone has (partially) filled the bolt holes. Why would someone have done this? Are they knee-bangers?
Obviously these hasps are required equipment in heavy seas but I have not sailed in these conditions. Nevertheless I'd like to replace them. I do not recall seeing them in the Spartan Catalog--does anyone know about a source for a direct replacement?
I am very interested in ways to soften the loud BANG when closing the cockpit lockers. One cannot always lower them gently, sometimes they have to be shut using the gravity method. Even when dropping them from 1 or 2 inches they are very loud.
I tried black rubber foam weatherstripping that is sold for this purpose, but in the heat the adhesive softens and it moves, stops being effective, and becomes visible when lockers are shut. Then it is a mess to remove and clean up.
Any ideas would be welcome.
Bill Goldsmith
CD27#173
Second Chance
Croton-on-Hudson, NY
goldy@bestweb.net
Cockpit Lockers....need hardware and........BANG!!!!!!
Moderator: Jim Walsh
-
Don Carr
Re: Cockpit Lockers....need hardware and........BANG!!!!!!
Bill; I can't speak to the hardware issue, but for 'weather proofing' and otherwise quieting the lockers try automotive weather stripping. I am in the process of using some now. I got the stuff that is the same stuff used in the trunks of cars. Any good auto supply place will have it. The stuff is rubber /synthetic rubber. I find that foam stuff is absolute junk.
IMHO
carrds@us.ibm.com
IMHO
carrds@us.ibm.com
-
Larry DeMers
Re: Cockpit Lockers....need hardware and........BANG!!!!!!
Hi Bill,
One intriquiing idea that I have been toying with (mentally so far) is to use gas-filled extension tubes, like are used on the large read dorrs of a 3 door car. These are available in surplus houses in all sorts of sizes and diameters, and throws. You will need to know how much change in length you will need, but it should be possible to have the gas filled shock swing over center at it's most closed point, and act to soften the closing for you.
SO far, we are using those springs that stay in column and hold the hatch cover open..until you push on the center of the spring, and then it bends in half, closing the hatch. There is NO resistance to closing once the spring has been taken out of column (sort of like our masts when out of column).
But this idea of using the gas filled shock tubes is one idea I have seen used before, and it would be a cool fix if the geometries could be gotten perfectly right.
Cheers,
Larry DeMers
s/v DeLaMer
Cape Dory 30
Lake Superior
demers@sgi.com
One intriquiing idea that I have been toying with (mentally so far) is to use gas-filled extension tubes, like are used on the large read dorrs of a 3 door car. These are available in surplus houses in all sorts of sizes and diameters, and throws. You will need to know how much change in length you will need, but it should be possible to have the gas filled shock swing over center at it's most closed point, and act to soften the closing for you.
SO far, we are using those springs that stay in column and hold the hatch cover open..until you push on the center of the spring, and then it bends in half, closing the hatch. There is NO resistance to closing once the spring has been taken out of column (sort of like our masts when out of column).
But this idea of using the gas filled shock tubes is one idea I have seen used before, and it would be a cool fix if the geometries could be gotten perfectly right.
Cheers,
Larry DeMers
s/v DeLaMer
Cape Dory 30
Lake Superior
Bill Goldsmith wrote: When I bought Second Chance 4 years ago the cockpit locker hasps were missing, and someone has (partially) filled the bolt holes. Why would someone have done this? Are they knee-bangers?
Obviously these hasps are required equipment in heavy seas but I have not sailed in these conditions. Nevertheless I'd like to replace them. I do not recall seeing them in the Spartan Catalog--does anyone know about a source for a direct replacement?
I am very interested in ways to soften the loud BANG when closing the cockpit lockers. One cannot always lower them gently, sometimes they have to be shut using the gravity method. Even when dropping them from 1 or 2 inches they are very loud.
I tried black rubber foam weatherstripping that is sold for this purpose, but in the heat the adhesive softens and it moves, stops being effective, and becomes visible when lockers are shut. Then it is a mess to remove and clean up.
Any ideas would be welcome.
Bill Goldsmith
CD27#173
Second Chance
Croton-on-Hudson, NY
demers@sgi.com
-
Bill Goldsmith
Re: Cockpit Lockers....need hardware and........BANG!!!!!!
Larry,
That's called thinking outside the locker...er....box!! Interesting idea. Perhaps a storm door/screen door closer would also work. Seems to me it a screen door would more closely approximate the loads imposed by the locker cover than would a big ole minivan hatch or even and Impreza hatch. And it has that handy little adjustment screw. Of course the gas shocks are thinner, screen door closer is kinda clunky. Now ya got me thinkin......
Thanks,
Bill Goldsmith
goldy@bestweb.net
That's called thinking outside the locker...er....box!! Interesting idea. Perhaps a storm door/screen door closer would also work. Seems to me it a screen door would more closely approximate the loads imposed by the locker cover than would a big ole minivan hatch or even and Impreza hatch. And it has that handy little adjustment screw. Of course the gas shocks are thinner, screen door closer is kinda clunky. Now ya got me thinkin......
Thanks,
Bill Goldsmith
Larry DeMers wrote: Hi Bill,
One intriquiing idea that I have been toying with (mentally so far) is to use gas-filled extension tubes, like are used on the large read dorrs of a 3 door car. These are available in surplus houses in all sorts of sizes and diameters, and throws. You will need to know how much change in length you will need, but it should be possible to have the gas filled shock swing over center at it's most closed point, and act to soften the closing for you.
SO far, we are using those springs that stay in column and hold the hatch cover open..until you push on the center of the spring, and then it bends in half, closing the hatch. There is NO resistance to closing once the spring has been taken out of column (sort of like our masts when out of column).
But this idea of using the gas filled shock tubes is one idea I have seen used before, and it would be a cool fix if the geometries could be gotten perfectly right.
Cheers,
Larry DeMers
s/v DeLaMer
Cape Dory 30
Lake Superior
Bill Goldsmith wrote: When I bought Second Chance 4 years ago the cockpit locker hasps were missing, and someone has (partially) filled the bolt holes. Why would someone have done this? Are they knee-bangers?
Obviously these hasps are required equipment in heavy seas but I have not sailed in these conditions. Nevertheless I'd like to replace them. I do not recall seeing them in the Spartan Catalog--does anyone know about a source for a direct replacement?
I am very interested in ways to soften the loud BANG when closing the cockpit lockers. One cannot always lower them gently, sometimes they have to be shut using the gravity method. Even when dropping them from 1 or 2 inches they are very loud.
I tried black rubber foam weatherstripping that is sold for this purpose, but in the heat the adhesive softens and it moves, stops being effective, and becomes visible when lockers are shut. Then it is a mess to remove and clean up.
Any ideas would be welcome.
Bill Goldsmith
CD27#173
Second Chance
Croton-on-Hudson, NY
goldy@bestweb.net
-
catherine_monaghan@m
Re: Cockpit Lockers....need hardware and........BANG!!!!!!
Bill,
On Realization we just purchased a length of small diameter clear flexible tubing (get enough to do all of your lockers) and slit it lengthwise then fitted it over the edge of the locker lids. It's cheap and it works great.
Cathy
CD32 <a href="http://www.hometown.aol.com/bcomet/real ... ization</a>, #3
Rahway, NJ
Raritan Bay
catherine_monaghanNOSPAM@merck.com
On Realization we just purchased a length of small diameter clear flexible tubing (get enough to do all of your lockers) and slit it lengthwise then fitted it over the edge of the locker lids. It's cheap and it works great.
Cathy
CD32 <a href="http://www.hometown.aol.com/bcomet/real ... ization</a>, #3
Rahway, NJ
Raritan Bay
Bill Goldsmith wrote: When I bought Second Chance 4 years ago the cockpit locker hasps were missing, and someone has (partially) filled the bolt holes. Why would someone have done this? Are they knee-bangers?
Obviously these hasps are required equipment in heavy seas but I have not sailed in these conditions. Nevertheless I'd like to replace them. I do not recall seeing them in the Spartan Catalog--does anyone know about a source for a direct replacement?
I am very interested in ways to soften the loud BANG when closing the cockpit lockers. One cannot always lower them gently, sometimes they have to be shut using the gravity method. Even when dropping them from 1 or 2 inches they are very loud.
I tried black rubber foam weatherstripping that is sold for this purpose, but in the heat the adhesive softens and it moves, stops being effective, and becomes visible when lockers are shut. Then it is a mess to remove and clean up.
Any ideas would be welcome.
Bill Goldsmith
CD27#173
Second Chance
Croton-on-Hudson, NY
catherine_monaghanNOSPAM@merck.com
-
John R.
Re: Cockpit Lockers....need hardware and........BANG!!!!!!
Corrosion will be a nightmare on those things.
Bill Goldsmith wrote: Larry,
That's called thinking outside the locker...er....box!! Interesting idea. Perhaps a storm door/screen door closer would also work. Seems to me it a screen door would more closely approximate the loads imposed by the locker cover than would a big ole minivan hatch or even and Impreza hatch. And it has that handy little adjustment screw. Of course the gas shocks are thinner, screen door closer is kinda clunky. Now ya got me thinkin......
Thanks,
Bill Goldsmith
Larry DeMers wrote: Hi Bill,
One intriquiing idea that I have been toying with (mentally so far) is to use gas-filled extension tubes, like are used on the large read dorrs of a 3 door car. These are available in surplus houses in all sorts of sizes and diameters, and throws. You will need to know how much change in length you will need, but it should be possible to have the gas filled shock swing over center at it's most closed point, and act to soften the closing for you.
SO far, we are using those springs that stay in column and hold the hatch cover open..until you push on the center of the spring, and then it bends in half, closing the hatch. There is NO resistance to closing once the spring has been taken out of column (sort of like our masts when out of column).
But this idea of using the gas filled shock tubes is one idea I have seen used before, and it would be a cool fix if the geometries could be gotten perfectly right.
Cheers,
Larry DeMers
s/v DeLaMer
Cape Dory 30
Lake Superior
Larry DeMers wrote:Bill Goldsmith wrote: When I bought Second Chance 4 years ago the cockpit locker hasps were missing, and someone has (partially) filled the bolt holes. Why would someone have done this? Are they knee-bangers?
Obviously these hasps are required equipment in heavy seas but I have not sailed in these conditions. Nevertheless I'd like to replace them. I do not recall seeing them in the Spartan Catalog--does anyone know about a source for a direct replacement?
I am very interested in ways to soften the loud BANG when closing the cockpit lockers. One cannot always lower them gently, sometimes they have to be shut using the gravity method. Even when dropping them from 1 or 2 inches they are very loud.
I tried black rubber foam weatherstripping that is sold for this purpose, but in the heat the adhesive softens and it moves, stops being effective, and becomes visible when lockers are shut. Then it is a mess to remove and clean up.
Any ideas would be welcome.
Bill Goldsmith
CD27#173
Second Chance
Croton-on-Hudson, NY
-
Larry DeMers
Re: Cockpit Lockers....need hardware and........BANG!!!!!!
Bill,
I agree with John that salt air/water could cause you some corrosion on the standard door closer..although good idea, and worth trying if it does not muck up the boat too much doing so. The shock strut would be much more tolerant to salt air/water I would expect,a s it goes in a car, and is exposed to various conditions..although not direct salt spray I would hope!
I think that the hatch back on my Integra is heavier than the lazarette hatch..and they use tiny, 1/2" diameter struts (2). So some experimentation would be cool here. I would suggest a surplus source of gas filled struts, or a discount car repair place..and see if they actually provide a spec on what weight and throw the device is made for.
Cheers,
Larry DeMers
demers@sgi.com
I agree with John that salt air/water could cause you some corrosion on the standard door closer..although good idea, and worth trying if it does not muck up the boat too much doing so. The shock strut would be much more tolerant to salt air/water I would expect,a s it goes in a car, and is exposed to various conditions..although not direct salt spray I would hope!
I think that the hatch back on my Integra is heavier than the lazarette hatch..and they use tiny, 1/2" diameter struts (2). So some experimentation would be cool here. I would suggest a surplus source of gas filled struts, or a discount car repair place..and see if they actually provide a spec on what weight and throw the device is made for.
Cheers,
Larry DeMers
Bill Goldsmith wrote: Larry,
That's called thinking outside the locker...er....box!! Interesting idea. Perhaps a storm door/screen door closer would also work. Seems to me it a screen door would more closely approximate the loads imposed by the locker cover than would a big ole minivan hatch or even and Impreza hatch. And it has that handy little adjustment screw. Of course the gas shocks are thinner, screen door closer is kinda clunky. Now ya got me thinkin......
Thanks,
Bill Goldsmith
Larry DeMers wrote: Hi Bill,
One intriquiing idea that I have been toying with (mentally so far) is to use gas-filled extension tubes, like are used on the large read dorrs of a 3 door car. These are available in surplus houses in all sorts of sizes and diameters, and throws. You will need to know how much change in length you will need, but it should be possible to have the gas filled shock swing over center at it's most closed point, and act to soften the closing for you.
SO far, we are using those springs that stay in column and hold the hatch cover open..until you push on the center of the spring, and then it bends in half, closing the hatch. There is NO resistance to closing once the spring has been taken out of column (sort of like our masts when out of column).
But this idea of using the gas filled shock tubes is one idea I have seen used before, and it would be a cool fix if the geometries could be gotten perfectly right.
Cheers,
Larry DeMers
s/v DeLaMer
Cape Dory 30
Lake Superior
Larry DeMers wrote:Bill Goldsmith wrote: When I bought Second Chance 4 years ago the cockpit locker hasps were missing, and someone has (partially) filled the bolt holes. Why would someone have done this? Are they knee-bangers?
Obviously these hasps are required equipment in heavy seas but I have not sailed in these conditions. Nevertheless I'd like to replace them. I do not recall seeing them in the Spartan Catalog--does anyone know about a source for a direct replacement?
I am very interested in ways to soften the loud BANG when closing the cockpit lockers. One cannot always lower them gently, sometimes they have to be shut using the gravity method. Even when dropping them from 1 or 2 inches they are very loud.
I tried black rubber foam weatherstripping that is sold for this purpose, but in the heat the adhesive softens and it moves, stops being effective, and becomes visible when lockers are shut. Then it is a mess to remove and clean up.
Any ideas would be welcome.
Bill Goldsmith
CD27#173
Second Chance
Croton-on-Hudson, NY
demers@sgi.com
-
Shelby
Gas Struts
No need to search for surplus, West Marine carries gas struts for the purpose of this discussion. Mounting points in various shapes, and struts in differents lengths and weights.
-
Stephen Heineke
Re: Cockpit Lockers....need hardware and........BANG!!!!!!
Cathy, Do you use any adhesive or is it the pressure from the tubes natural desire to reform into a circle that keeps it stuck to the locker lid?
Stephen Heineke
CD25 #67 La Suaviata
Austin (Lake Travis), Texas
austex@attglobal.net
Stephen Heineke
CD25 #67 La Suaviata
Austin (Lake Travis), Texas
catherine_monaghan@m wrote: Bill,
On Realization we just purchased a length of small diameter clear flexible tubing (get enough to do all of your lockers) and slit it lengthwise then fitted it over the edge of the locker lids. It's cheap and it works great.
Cathy
CD32 <a href="http://www.hometown.aol.com/bcomet/real ... ization</a>, #3
Rahway, NJ
Raritan Bay
Bill Goldsmith wrote: When I bought Second Chance 4 years ago the cockpit locker hasps were missing, and someone has (partially) filled the bolt holes. Why would someone have done this? Are they knee-bangers?
Obviously these hasps are required equipment in heavy seas but I have not sailed in these conditions. Nevertheless I'd like to replace them. I do not recall seeing them in the Spartan Catalog--does anyone know about a source for a direct replacement?
I am very interested in ways to soften the loud BANG when closing the cockpit lockers. One cannot always lower them gently, sometimes they have to be shut using the gravity method. Even when dropping them from 1 or 2 inches they are very loud.
I tried black rubber foam weatherstripping that is sold for this purpose, but in the heat the adhesive softens and it moves, stops being effective, and becomes visible when lockers are shut. Then it is a mess to remove and clean up.
Any ideas would be welcome.
Bill Goldsmith
CD27#173
Second Chance
Croton-on-Hudson, NY
austex@attglobal.net
-
Larry DeMers
Re: Gas Struts
Hey, thanks..missed them last perusal of the "Bible". I would assume that they would be salt water tolerant then if intended for boat use..curing one solid objection to them. I think I will invest a bit in a pair and see how they work. Will let you all know in a few weeks. (oh boy, another project!)
Cheers,
Larry DeMers
s/v DeLaMer
Cape Dory 30
Lake Superior
deemrs@sgi.com
Cheers,
Larry DeMers
s/v DeLaMer
Cape Dory 30
Lake Superior
Shelby wrote: No need to search for surplus, West Marine carries gas struts for the purpose of this discussion. Mounting points in various shapes, and struts in differents lengths and weights.
deemrs@sgi.com
-
Catherine Monaghan
Re: Cockpit Lockers....need hardware and........BANG!!!!!!
Stephen,
I guess it's really hose rather than a tube. It's that clear plastic stuff. Anyway, we don't use any adhesive and it stays put. Over the course of the sailing season it will collect dirt though, that's the only drawback, but the stuff is so cheap that we just replace it each Spring. The hardest part of the whole operation is cutting the slit in the hose, the rest is easy.
Cathy
CD32 Realization, #3
Rahway, NJ
Raritan Bay
catherine_monaghanNOSPAM@merck.com
I guess it's really hose rather than a tube. It's that clear plastic stuff. Anyway, we don't use any adhesive and it stays put. Over the course of the sailing season it will collect dirt though, that's the only drawback, but the stuff is so cheap that we just replace it each Spring. The hardest part of the whole operation is cutting the slit in the hose, the rest is easy.
Cathy
CD32 Realization, #3
Rahway, NJ
Raritan Bay
Stephen Heineke wrote: Cathy, Do you use any adhesive or is it the pressure from the tubes natural desire to reform into a circle that keeps it stuck to the locker lid?
Stephen Heineke
CD25 #67 La Suaviata
Austin (Lake Travis), Texas
catherine_monaghan@m wrote: Bill,
On Realization we just purchased a length of small diameter clear flexible tubing (get enough to do all of your lockers) and slit it lengthwise then fitted it over the edge of the locker lids. It's cheap and it works great.
Cathy
CD32 <a href="http://www.hometown.aol.com/bcomet/real ... ization</a>, #3
Rahway, NJ
Raritan Bay
Bill Goldsmith wrote: When I bought Second Chance 4 years ago the cockpit locker hasps were missing, and someone has (partially) filled the bolt holes. Why would someone have done this? Are they knee-bangers?
Obviously these hasps are required equipment in heavy seas but I have not sailed in these conditions. Nevertheless I'd like to replace them. I do not recall seeing them in the Spartan Catalog--does anyone know about a source for a direct replacement?
I am very interested in ways to soften the loud BANG when closing the cockpit lockers. One cannot always lower them gently, sometimes they have to be shut using the gravity method. Even when dropping them from 1 or 2 inches they are very loud.
I tried black rubber foam weatherstripping that is sold for this purpose, but in the heat the adhesive softens and it moves, stops being effective, and becomes visible when lockers are shut. Then it is a mess to remove and clean up.
Any ideas would be welcome.
Bill Goldsmith
CD27#173
Second Chance
Croton-on-Hudson, NY
catherine_monaghanNOSPAM@merck.com
-
Ken Coit
Re: Gas Struts
Larry,
The link below will get you lots of specs on stainless steel gas springs. They also seem to be willing to select the right one for the application if you can provide them with measurements.
Keep on sailing,
Ken Coit
CD/36 Parfait
Hailing Port: Raleigh, NC
Sailing from: Beaufort, NC
parfaitNOSPAM@nc.rr.com
The link below will get you lots of specs on stainless steel gas springs. They also seem to be willing to select the right one for the application if you can provide them with measurements.
Keep on sailing,
Ken Coit
CD/36 Parfait
Hailing Port: Raleigh, NC
Sailing from: Beaufort, NC
Larry DeMers wrote: Hey, thanks..missed them last perusal of the "Bible". I would assume that they would be salt water tolerant then if intended for boat use..curing one solid objection to them. I think I will invest a bit in a pair and see how they work. Will let you all know in a few weeks. (oh boy, another project!)
Cheers,
Larry DeMers
s/v DeLaMer
Cape Dory 30
Lake Superior
Shelby wrote: No need to search for surplus, West Marine carries gas struts for the purpose of this discussion. Mounting points in various shapes, and struts in differents lengths and weights.
parfaitNOSPAM@nc.rr.com
-
John R.
Re: Gas Struts
Now you're talking.......very good post Ken for those who have a need for them. I imagine those puppies (316L)are not cheap.
Ken Coit wrote: Larry,
The link below will get you lots of specs on stainless steel gas springs. They also seem to be willing to select the right one for the application if you can provide them with measurements.
Keep on sailing,
Ken Coit
CD/36 Parfait
Hailing Port: Raleigh, NC
Sailing from: Beaufort, NC
Larry DeMers wrote: Hey, thanks..missed them last perusal of the "Bible". I would assume that they would be salt water tolerant then if intended for boat use..curing one solid objection to them. I think I will invest a bit in a pair and see how they work. Will let you all know in a few weeks. (oh boy, another project!)
Cheers,
Larry DeMers
s/v DeLaMer
Cape Dory 30
Lake Superior
Shelby wrote: No need to search for surplus, West Marine carries gas struts for the purpose of this discussion. Mounting points in various shapes, and struts in differents lengths and weights.
-
Larry DeMers
Re: Gas Struts
Ken,
Hey thanks for that site! Interesting stuff, and a lot of ways to cure the lazarette falling-on-head-while-digging-for-something syndrome that I am particularly bugged with. I use those springs which are great, until someone decides to force them to close by pushing the hatch cover down..then they bend and get distorted..and ruined. Seems to happen every other year in our boat.
There is a particularly good drawing of the radius measurement that you will need to determine before ordering the part. It describes nicely the critical measurement from hinge point to attachment point.
Thanks..big help!
Larry DeMers
s/v DeLaMer
Cape Dory 30
Lake Superior
demers@sgi.com
Hey thanks for that site! Interesting stuff, and a lot of ways to cure the lazarette falling-on-head-while-digging-for-something syndrome that I am particularly bugged with. I use those springs which are great, until someone decides to force them to close by pushing the hatch cover down..then they bend and get distorted..and ruined. Seems to happen every other year in our boat.
There is a particularly good drawing of the radius measurement that you will need to determine before ordering the part. It describes nicely the critical measurement from hinge point to attachment point.
Thanks..big help!
Larry DeMers
s/v DeLaMer
Cape Dory 30
Lake Superior
Ken Coit wrote: Larry,
The link below will get you lots of specs on stainless steel gas springs. They also seem to be willing to select the right one for the application if you can provide them with measurements.
Keep on sailing,
Ken Coit
CD/36 Parfait
Hailing Port: Raleigh, NC
Sailing from: Beaufort, NC
Larry DeMers wrote: Hey, thanks..missed them last perusal of the "Bible". I would assume that they would be salt water tolerant then if intended for boat use..curing one solid objection to them. I think I will invest a bit in a pair and see how they work. Will let you all know in a few weeks. (oh boy, another project!)
Cheers,
Larry DeMers
s/v DeLaMer
Cape Dory 30
Lake Superior
Shelby wrote: No need to search for surplus, West Marine carries gas struts for the purpose of this discussion. Mounting points in various shapes, and struts in differents lengths and weights.
demers@sgi.com
-
Jim Stull
Re: Cockpit Lockers....need hardware and........BANG!!!!!!
I have fastened a short length of lite weight bungy cord to each of the covers. One end is fixed to the inside of the cover, the other end has a brass "S" hook. The end with the hook is looped back and hooked to a fixed loop on the inside of the lid when it is closed. When I open the lid, I now automatically grab the bungy and drop the brass hook over the lifeline. If I forget to remove the bungy before closing the cover, no harm done, the bungy will stretch and the additional resistance will remind you to unclip it. Works quite well.
Jim
jtstull@earthlink.net
Jim
jtstull@earthlink.net