Lifespan of standing rigging

[Bill Goldsmith]

I received some alarming responses to my question below about replacing studs and turnbuckles on my lower shrouds which were installed new by a PO in 1995. Inspection reveals that the forestay, backstay and upper shrouds look like new, with flawless swages and clean wire.

Below it was metioned that 7 years is outside the time envelope for the standing rigging, and should all be replaced. Does this apply to a boat that is stored for the winter 6-7 months a year, or more for a boat that is sailed year round, or does usage make any difference? I seem to recall reading somewhere that in the northern climes with winter storage you can get 10-12 years out of standing rigging, as long as it is inspected and maintained, and any questionable pieces replaced as needed on an earlier schedule.

Bill Goldsmith
CD27#173
Second Chance
Croton-on-Hudson, NY



goldy@bestweb.net

[Don Carr]

Here is my somewhat informed opinion. There is no 'absolute' lifespan for standing rigging. First those in the Western part of LIS store their boats mast up as opposed to un-steping the mast, this practice will shortne the lifespan of the standing rigging. Second do you hose down the rigging after each sail with fresh water? This practice will lengthen the lifespan. Third do you sail in heavy winds or stress the rigging? These practices will shorten the lifespan of your standing rigging.
My standing rigging is 12 years old and I have it inspected every year by a rigger , it passed with flying colors. One way to validate your rigging is to use some 'disclosing' solution on the wire which will show 'weak' spots on the wire.
To say a given item on a boat has a fixed lifespan is about like saying a car engine is only good for 120K miles or for that matter
a diesel needs rebuilding after 2000 hours. It's all in how that time or usage was spent.

IMHO



carrds@us.ibm.com

[Kurt]

I don't understand why there is a "lifespan" for standing rigging...I inspect mine annually for corrosion, cracks, broken wires etc. and I'm careful not to damage it when stepping/unstepping the mast...I don't over tension it and I reef early when the wind picks up. I suppose freeze/thaw cycles could affect it but I suspect that affect is minimal. My original rigging is now 17 years old and still looks great...although I do plan to replace it in the next couple years simply because its a prudent thing to do and because I have a roller furler. But to say that 7 year old rigging is dangerous? Very hard to believe.
A word of advice: BUY FROM A RIGGER THAT USES A ROTARY SWAGING TOOL....rotary swaging tools are expensive and most riggers don't have them.



kjlgpw@aol.com

[Warren Kaplan]

I received some alarming responses to my question below about replacing studs and turnbuckles on my lower shrouds which were installed new by a PO in 1995. Inspection reveals that the forestay, backstay and upper shrouds look like new, with flawless swages and clean wire.

Below it was metioned that 7 years is outside the time envelope for the standing rigging, and should all be replaced. Does this apply to a boat that is stored for the winter 6-7 months a year, or more for a boat that is sailed year round, or does usage make any difference? I seem to recall reading somewhere that in the northern climes with winter storage you can get 10-12 years out of standing rigging, as long as it is inspected and maintained, and any questionable pieces replaced as needed on an earlier schedule.

Bill Goldsmith
CD27#173
Second Chance
Croton-on-Hudson, NY

I have to say I was somewhat taken aback by the 7 year lifespan of the standing rigging. When I bought my 1980 CD27 2 years ago the surveyor carefully inspected all the standing rigging. He made a point of saying that the rigging was in great shape. I don't know if its the original rigging or not but when I bought the boat there was no mention that the rigging was recently replaced. I'm sure the seller would have mentioned that. My forestay way replaced last year but that was only because Furlex headsail furlers come with a new forestay.

Warren Kaplan
Sine Qua Non
CD27 #166 (1980)
Oyster Bay Harbor, NY



Setsail728@aol.com

[Steve Bernd]

Bill,

This is a question I would like a better feeling for also. I do have a single reference point. My previous boat was a 1967 Cal-25 and except for the back stay, had all original standing rigging and turnbuckles. We finally replaced the bronze turnbuckles in 1997 for "good measure", destroyed them getting them off but re-used the original shrouds. I don't know if this was typical or we were just young, naive, and lucky. The boat saw consistent use as it was a partnership and the mast stayed up all year in So. California. I now have a CD but the old Cal is still sailing with the new turnbuckles and original shrouds and forestay. We inspected for broken strands and cracks regularly but never saw anything.

As I now have a '83 CD-28 with all original standing rigging (again except the back stay), I am curious about other's bad experiences (as opposed to recommendations).

Has anyone ever had a catastrophic failure due to age, corrosion, etc?
Does failure come on gradually with broken strands and so much stretch you can't adjust them any more? Also, is the back stay more prone to stretch than the rest?

Thanks in advance for the great wealth of experience out there.

Steve Bernd
CD-28
Ventura,CA
Thanks in advance.

[Larry DeMers]

In the northern climes, where we store the boat away for half a year or more..you should be good for 10-15 years at least. How to tell if you have a problem developing? As Don says, use the tools available for this job. They include a penetrating dye that flouresces under ultra-violet light. This very viscous fluid will invade even the smallest cracks and imperfections and will then be visible in the UV light. Use a babys diaper to run the rigging and see if there are any 'fishhooks' in the wire..if there are..get rid of that stay. Lastly, use the dye on the swage fittings and carefully look at them, especially the bottom one. Here is where most damage is reported due to salt intrusion and the freeze/thaw cycle in fresh or salt water environs.

Our rigging is original, from 1983 and still looks new. I do check it carefully each spring, but I can gaurantee you that 7 years life for rigging seems rather pessimistic..while it may be true down in Southern Florida due to the extreme UV and salt environment, it is certainly not the case in the polar opposite to Florida..up here in NW Wisc. where we eek out maybe 5 mn. of sailing, and at that some of it is in snowstorms.

that's my story, and I'm sticking to it!~

Larry DeMers
s/v DeLaMer
Cape Dory 30
Apostle Islands of Lake Superior

I received some alarming responses to my question below about replacing studs and turnbuckles on my lower shrouds which were installed new by a PO in 1995. Inspection reveals that the forestay, backstay and upper shrouds look like new, with flawless swages and clean wire.

Below it was metioned that 7 years is outside the time envelope for the standing rigging, and should all be replaced. Does this apply to a boat that is stored for the winter 6-7 months a year, or more for a boat that is sailed year round, or does usage make any difference? I seem to recall reading somewhere that in the northern climes with winter storage you can get 10-12 years out of standing rigging, as long as it is inspected and maintained, and any questionable pieces replaced as needed on an earlier schedule.

Bill Goldsmith
CD27#173
Second Chance
Croton-on-Hudson, NY

demers@sgi.com

[Leo MacDonald CD33]

I received some alarming responses to my question below about replacing studs and turnbuckles on my lower shrouds which were installed new by a PO in 1995. Inspection reveals that the forestay, backstay and upper shrouds look like new, with flawless swages and clean wire.

Below it was metioned that 7 years is outside the time envelope for the standing rigging, and should all be replaced. Does this apply to a boat that is stored for the winter 6-7 months a year, or more for a boat that is sailed year round, or does usage make any difference? I seem to recall reading somewhere that in the northern climes with winter storage you can get 10-12 years out of standing rigging, as long as it is inspected and maintained, and any questionable pieces replaced as needed on an earlier schedule.

Bill Goldsmith
CD27#173
Second Chance
Croton-on-Hudson, NY

Bill,

I think Larry and Don are right on.

I unstepping the mast(s) when placing her on the hard and also have a rigger inspection (not quite as often as Don). Heather Ann was 20 years old when we got her without any mention of replaced rigging. During our four years only the forestay was replaced (part of the Profurl package).

Salt and stresses are our concerns. Your inspection routine will tell you when to replace.

Fair Winds,
Leo MacDonald
'Evening Light' CD33
SYC, Groton, CT



macdoreNOSPAM@aol.com

[Joe Sankey]

I had the starboard upper fail at the swaqed fitting at the turnbuckle on a CD 22 several years ago. We were beating in 15-25 knot gusts with my wife at the helm. It sounded like a 22 rifle going off. We released everything, but the mast whipped and bent. I had asked someone who I assumed (WRONG!) was knowledgeable to take a look at the fittings the week prior; no sweat, they look fine. They didn't really, as they were discolored. Last year at survey on our current CD 30, similar discolorations were found along with hairline cracks only seen with high powered magnification. The surveyor said next year; BoatUS said now, and don't move boat until it's done.

Anyway, we replaced everything on both boats. The 22 lasted about 10 years; the 30 about 18. Only the lowers were found faulty at survey.
I'd say after 10 years you ought to start thinking seriously about replacement.FWIW
Joe Sankey
CD 30 Slow Dance
Magnolia Springs, AL

Bill,

This is a question I would like a better feeling for also. I do have a single reference point. My previous boat was a 1967 Cal-25 and except for the back stay, had all original standing rigging and turnbuckles. We finally replaced the bronze turnbuckles in 1997 for "good measure", destroyed them getting them off but re-used the original shrouds. I don't know if this was typical or we were just young, naive, and lucky. The boat saw consistent use as it was a partnership and the mast stayed up all year in So. California. I now have a CD but the old Cal is still sailing with the new turnbuckles and original shrouds and forestay. We inspected for broken strands and cracks regularly but never saw anything.

As I now have a '83 CD-28 with all original standing rigging (again except the back stay), I am curious about other's bad experiences (as opposed to recommendations).

Has anyone ever had a catastrophic failure due to age, corrosion, etc?
Does failure come on gradually with broken strands and so much stretch you can't adjust them any more? Also, is the back stay more prone to stretch than the rest?

Thanks in advance for the great wealth of experience out there.

Steve Bernd
CD-28
Ventura,CA
Thanks in advance.

sankey@gulftel.com

[Clay Stalker]

I received some alarming responses to my question below about replacing studs and turnbuckles on my lower shrouds which were installed new by a PO in 1995. Inspection reveals that the forestay, backstay and upper shrouds look like new, with flawless swages and clean wire.

Below it was metioned that 7 years is outside the time envelope for the standing rigging, and should all be replaced. Does this apply to a boat that is stored for the winter 6-7 months a year, or more for a boat that is sailed year round, or does usage make any difference? I seem to recall reading somewhere that in the northern climes with winter storage you can get 10-12 years out of standing rigging, as long as it is inspected and maintained, and any questionable pieces replaced as needed on an earlier schedule.

Bill Goldsmith
CD27#173
Second Chance
Croton-on-Hudson, NY

Bill:

When I purchased my 1982 CD27 in 12/00 the surveyor called the standing rigging in excellent condition....I doubt it was ever changed....I do inspect it regularly, but still seems in good shape...FWIW...

Clay Stalker
CD27 Salsa #247
Bristol Harbor, Rhode Island



cstalker@cheshire.net

[John R.]

I received some alarming responses to my question below about replacing studs and turnbuckles on my lower shrouds which were installed new by a PO in 1995. Inspection reveals that the forestay, backstay and upper shrouds look like new, with flawless swages and clean wire.

Below it was metioned that 7 years is outside the time envelope for the standing rigging, and should all be replaced. Does this apply to a boat that is stored for the winter 6-7 months a year, or more for a boat that is sailed year round, or does usage make any difference? I seem to recall reading somewhere that in the northern climes with winter storage you can get 10-12 years out of standing rigging, as long as it is inspected and maintained, and any questionable pieces replaced as needed on an earlier schedule.

Bill Goldsmith
CD27#173
Second Chance
Croton-on-Hudson, NY

From my experience it is on a case by case basis. No set rule. Usage, salt exposure, proper tensioning, maintenance, stainless quality, fitting types......all have a factor in the lifespan.

Proper inspection is the key to unveiling potential problems.....the outline for inspection has already been discussed.

[wayne grenier]

I received some alarming responses to my question below about replacing studs and turnbuckles on my lower shrouds which were installed new by a PO in 1995. Inspection reveals that the forestay, backstay and upper shrouds look like new, with flawless swages and clean wire.

Below it was metioned that 7 years is outside the time envelope for the standing rigging, and should all be replaced. Does this apply to a boat that is stored for the winter 6-7 months a year, or more for a boat that is sailed year round, or does usage make any difference? I seem to recall reading somewhere that in the northern climes with winter storage you can get 10-12 years out of standing rigging, as long as it is inspected and maintained, and any questionable pieces replaced as needed on an earlier schedule.

Bill Goldsmith
CD27#173
Second Chance
Croton-on-Hudson, NY

From my experience it is on a case by case basis. No set rule. Usage, salt exposure, proper tensioning, maintenance, stainless quality, fitting types......all have a factor in the lifespan.

Proper inspection is the key to unveiling potential problems.....the outline for inspection has already been discussed.

I own a 1974 CD 28'-last year I replaced all the standing rigging. I was told by the rigging shop they reccommend replacing rigging every 18 years at this Massachusetts latitude. I told them the stays were from a 28' boat and there response was "this is awfully beefy for a 28'! Good old cape dory! I got 25 years out of it-and had had no problems-I inquired about the turnbuckles as well-they said they don't "pass judgement" on them-but I replaced them all with open barrell turnbuckles as reccomended-as they are easier to keep clean and you can see how much thread you have in the barrel and you can lock them with cotter pins- I did not have to replace the port upper and lowers as they were all replaced in 1990 after hurricane bob when I tangled with a 55' Hunter that dragged me up onto the beach-guess which boat had only cosmetic damage and was hauled of the beach and sailed for the rest of the year? guess who had to have their keel rebedded, prop shaft and strut replaced and rudder repaired and spent months in the yard? but that's another story-



grenier@localnet.com

[Joel]

I've had Pokey since '86 and think all the standing rigging was original. About 5 years ago we had a rough mast stepping episode - the turnbuckle wouldn't straighten itself on the chainplate tang as the mast neared vertical. I kinked the shroud just above the turnbuckle before I realized what was happening. It took 4 years to fail, but fail it did and right at that point. I had prepared the boat on a Saturday afternoon for a Sunday morning sail. I am certain the shroud was fine then. When we arrived Sunday morning, half the strands had given way. It looked like if I blew on it it would have given the rest of the way. Imagine the failure if there had been any force on it.

Anyway, I sailed the rest of the season with a temporary replacement sourced from the basement (previous homeowner was a sailor). The entire rig is being built by the rigging shop as I write.

FWIW - I was advised that when one shroud or stay goes that they should all be replaced. The theory is that the forces of wear and tear (UV, salt, freeze cycles, etc.) would be the same on all and it's just a matter of time before the rest go.

Joel Bondy
s/y Pokey II
'73 Ty #549
Bayside, NY



bondy_joelNOSPAM@hotmail.com

[Ken Cave]

It is only your life hanging out there on the hopes that your rigging is in good shape. And, having my rigging replaced when I purchased my CD 28 (even though the rigger thought it would last another few years) makes another less worry when I encounter the big snot we get in the northwest waters!

If your life worth the $800.00 or so in replacing the rigging every ten years or so?

Ken Cave DC 28 #227
Anacortes, WA



bcave@whidbey.net