Engine-less Sailing

Discussions about Cape Dory, Intrepid and Robinhood sailboats and how we use them. Got questions? Have answers? Provide them here.

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Duncan
Posts: 600
Joined: Apr 17th, '08, 17:43
Location: CD 27, CD 10
Montreal, QC

Engine-less Sailing

Post by Duncan »

This post was inspired by a for sale ad here:
http://www.capedory.org/board/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=34640
The vendor says:
We built a Chinese sculling oar for close maneuvering, and have done several trips around the Puget Sound and Straits of Juan de Fuca only under sail power
That reminded me of when I was single-handing my CD27 home to Montreal from Rhode Island.
About halfway the exhaust manifold came loose, and I had to wait three days while some new bolts and a gasket were shipped in.
The lady at the Shelburne Shipyard on Lake Champlain did my order, and then she asked me if I wanted a mooring until the parts arrived "since I couldn't go anywhere" in the meantime.

I said "no thanks" and had probably the best sailing of the trip for the next few days, sailing without the engine.
I recall ghosting into an anchorage, dodging the boats already there, stopping Coquine by backing the jib, and then digging the anchor in by backing the main.
A few people were watching, and they waved happily at the success. It wasn't too hard to sail up over the anchor the next morning and get going again.

Another time, the batteries were too low to start the engine, and I sailed into an unfamiliar marina. I was going too quick, but I did a 360 and came very softly into the slip.

Ever since, I try to sail off and on my mooring without the engine. I mark a star in the log anytime I do that!
I don't think it's smart to do this in a crowded mooring ground when the weather is up.
I do like the feeling though, and I learn more about how to sail the boat anytime I do it.
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Paul D.
Posts: 1273
Joined: Feb 6th, '05, 20:52
Location: CD 33 Femme du Nord, Lake Superior

Re: Engine-less Sailing

Post by Paul D. »

In the 2000's, when we had Femme moored in Grand Marais, MN harbor (America's coolest small town, Outside Magazine) I used to sail on and off the mooring. I remember several seasons where I only started the motor to give it a good run a few times. Very fun and great practice. It is a little more involved to anchor however. Very good to do to keep the old skills honed and quite fun as well when not under pressure.
Paul
CDSOA Member
Keith
Posts: 576
Joined: Sep 14th, '12, 20:01
Location: Moon Dance 1979 CD 30C Hull # 134

Re: Engine-less Sailing

Post by Keith »

Last summer I blew the head gasket on my 37 year old raw water cooled MD7A, basically the the salt water eventually ate through the copper ring between the cylinder and one of the water jackets. It took 6 wks to get all the parts and the head machined and assembled. I sailed Nantucket sound the entire time single handed with out the engine. It was glorious, Even in 30 knot winds no problem. Well ok I did have to make two passes at the mooring that day. There were only two times when I could not get out of the very narrow channel out of the east bay in Osterville because the wind was coming straight down the channel at me.

PS After several oil and filter changes and the valve job see purrs like a kitten. I wonder it will ever actually die. Me thinks NOT!

Keith
David Patterson
Posts: 785
Joined: Dec 17th, '10, 22:58
Location: 1982 Cape Dory 25D #85, sv Cloud Girl.

Re: Engine-less Sailing

Post by David Patterson »

Some of the most challenging sailing to me (aside from negotiating the salt water rapids of my sailing grounds) is maneuvering the boat in light airs and close quarters. I love hearing other sailors' experiences of sail-only. Thanks for this thread. David, Friday Harbor
John Stone
Posts: 3621
Joined: Oct 6th, '08, 07:30
Location: S/V Far Reach: CD 36 #61 www.farreachvoayges.net www.farreachvoyages.com

Re: Engine-less Sailing

Post by John Stone »

Well, I love everything about engineless sailing. For me, it's all about the sailing. Even the destination is secondary to the sailing. Nothing connects you to the earth, sky, wind, and water like pure sailing. It's timeless. Like moving through the arc of history by connecting to an endless saga--Phoenicians, Greeks, Romans, Vikings, Polynesians, the European explorers, the great age of sail and on through Slocum, Pidgeon, Smeeton and the rise of 20th century voyaging--cruising as it were. There is a great feeling that overcomes me when I have to rely on the boat, her sails, and my own skill and wits.

There have been a few times when I briefly thought ugh, if I had an inboard this would be a very simple problem to solve. But, in the end I have never regretted removing the engine from the Far Reach and fairing in the aperture. She is a different boat with the aperture filled in and that long run aft free of turbulence and obstructions.

The big rig and light air drifter has made ghosting along a real magical experience that I probably would miss if I had an engine to crank up. The 14' sculling oar has taught me a lot about what is possible. And it's a great feeling to experience the bend of that oar as you lean back and pull sensing the Far Reach gliding forward under your feet through a mirror of still water. Anchoring under sail and sailing out the anchor have been hugely rewarding--a little scary on occasion in crowded harbors of the West Indies. I enjoy the edgy feeling I get when we are utterly dependent on the sails. Whether drifting on Pamlico Sound or rolling to a left over swell in a flat calm 300 miles SW of Bermuda or whoosing off the face of 12'-14' seas in 35 knot trade winds under a reefed stays'l. I get so much more by not having the engine. The pleasure of the thrill outweighs the worry of the anxiety. And the anxiety gets less and less the more I sail her and learn her secret ways and hidden desires.

It's true we have a very neat little removable swing arm motor mount and a 9.8 hp four blade high thrust outboard. But, we have seldom used it. That little four stroke will push her fully loaded 18,500 pounds along at 5 knots at three quarter throttle in a flat calm. But, mny times the outboard is left at home. If the wind is up in the marina we will use it to maneuver the Far Reach into her slip. If it's calm we scull in. If we were on a mooring I would have no need for the engine at all. Ever. The boat has more room, smells better, and is far less complicated without it. Last year, I sailed the Far Reach from the Neuse River 12 miles down the Adams Creek ICW, under two bridges past Ft Macon, out the Beaufort, NC inlet and 8 more miles across Onslow Bay into the Cape Lookout Bight and anchored under sail. It was a fabulous experience. Planning the use of favorable wind and tide was critical--what fun it was. And, it was a delight to leave the outboard at home for our offshore trip to the BVI last year. We did eventually crate and ship the outboard down due to the rediculously crowed harbors the Virgin Islands but it was never required. In the end, we used less than 3 gallons of fuel for the whole six months. And every bit of the use was elective--not essential.

But there is a time and a place for everything--engines too. I'd never encourage anyone to do what we are doing. I'd rather simply share the experince and let each sailor decide what works best for them. Would I put an inboard in the Far Reach? You bet. And when that moment arrives, if it does, I will. But for now, sailing enginefree is delightful.

For those interested in engeless sailing there is a wonderful book by Richard Baum called "By the Wind." It's his story of sailing his 35' cutter Little Dipper without an engine. The boat was designed by Starling Burgess and looks a lot like a Cape Dory 36. It was published in 1962. You can find it on the used book market. I've read it many times and found it very inspiring.

Best to all and happy sailing.
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tjr818
Posts: 1851
Joined: Oct 13th, '07, 13:42
Location: Previously owned 1980 CD 27 Slainte, Hull #185. NO.1257949

Re: Engine-less Sailing

Post by tjr818 »

Very interesting John,
Do you find that 14' oar to be the right length for Far Reach? I have often thought of getting a sculling oar or yuloh for Slainte. Shaw and Tenney recommended one much longer and they wanted a fortune for it, shipping would have almost doubled the cost. Did you build yours?
Tim
Nonsuch 26 Ultra,
Previously, Sláinte a CD27
John Stone
Posts: 3621
Joined: Oct 6th, '08, 07:30
Location: S/V Far Reach: CD 36 #61 www.farreachvoayges.net www.farreachvoyages.com

Re: Engine-less Sailing

Post by John Stone »

Tim,
I made the oar. I scarfed two pieces of ash together and covered the scarf with two layers of carbon fiber. It's actually 14'10' long. Here is the link to the build. http://www.farreachvoyages.com/projects ... yoars.html

There are a couple of important consideration to making the sculling oar work. It's not just the oar but the entire system of oar, oar lock, oriental lanyard, etc.

(1) Oar length. I determined the length by deciding the best place to scull from would be on top of the seat lockers--specifically on the top of the LP gas locker directly behind the tiller. It gave me good visibility and reduced the length of the oar. If I stood on the cockpit floor the oar would have been huge. For the kind of oar I use, I wanted the oar to be about 40 degrees to the horizontal surface of the water. I determined the rough length by using a simple PVC pipe mock up. I then built the oar a little longer at 16' long then cut it back to 14'10" though trial and error.

(2) The oar lock. The oar lock has to be bullet proof. I read a few blogs where people tried to lash together a cheap oar lock and the system failed. There is a lot of power being applied to the oar lock. So, regardless the design, it has to be tough enough to handle the loads and it has to have as little friction as possible. The oar leather and how it is lubricated is important. Friction is your enemy. You want minimal friction.

(3) Oriental lanyard. The OL is a line (about 1/4") that runs from an attachment point on the loom about halfway between the oar lock and the handle on the oar directly down to a pad eye on the deck. The OL makes the oar controllable By tensioning the OL correctly the loom remains at the correct height/angle and imparts the correct twist to the loom. You don't need an OL sculling your dinghy but you sure as hell do when sculling a large heave displacement hull. The forces at play are just to great.

There has been a fair amount written about sculling oars and I think most evidence agrees the Chinese yuloh and Japanese Ro are more efficient than the western style oar for sculling. But a yuloh would have been longer, heavier, and harder to store on my boat. Also, I felt like I was mixing designs in a way that was not pleasing to my eye . . . I didn't think the yuloh would look right. Also, I talked about the asymmetric blade design issue, that is a point of discussion on the internet, with Larry Pardey, and the oar they used for forty years on both boats was a standard western style symmetrical design. I figured he has more experience than just about anyone in the world sculling a heavy displacement sailboat. So, I followed his recommendation.

The sculling oar works. It's not a perfect solution. I am not an expert but I have sculled my boat a reasonable amount of time to feel like I have an experienced opinion. I'd say I can scull in about 6 knots of wind but I would not want to. In a calm, it is easy and I think I can get the boat going about 1 1/2 knots. It will turn on a dime. I have read you can back a boat up by reversing the feathering motion but I have not had a chance to try it out . . . yet. It's a lot of work but like anything, I think in the beginning one relies on a lot of muscle and brute force but as the technique is learned the muscle is less important--it's almost all technique and finesse. I think it would be all I need if we were on a mooring ball. But in a marina, with wind and current, it not very practical . . . at least with an 18,000 lb boat. I like it. I am glad I have it. It's part of my simple system. But it has limitations--just like that little 9.8hp outboard we use.
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Astronomertoo
Posts: 217
Joined: Nov 24th, '11, 08:53
Location: 1975 CD25 239 Moon Shine

Re: Engine-less Sailing

Post by Astronomertoo »

Paul D. wrote:In the 2000's, when we had Femme moored in Grand Marais, MN harbor (America's coolest small town, Outside Magazine) I used to sail on and off the mooring. I remember several seasons where I only started the motor to give it a good run a few times. Very fun and great practice. It is a little more involved to anchor however. Very good to do to keep the old skills honed and quite fun as well when not under pressure.
Hello all,
Paul we enjoyed all the pics and stories over the years of your sailing on Lake Superior, where we have used the commercial fleet a few times for our tourist time up on the big lake. We travel up yearly to spend time with my nature photography sister, who I learn much from about how to shoot pics for the local LS calendars. She has a few new ones of the GM Harbor which you might see this winter. I always thought we might run into some of you someday to say hello. We were up there this past summer with our RV for photographing the tall ship sail day at Duluth, riding on a old contracted Hatteras, and spent the next month at various campgrounds from Superior Wi to Grand Marais, which along with Bayfield Wi, is definitely one of our 2 favorite places on the water, anywhere. We did not take the ferry over to Madeline Island, so we could have missed some of you over there.
We photographed many Cape Dorys down in Michigan, where I saw some really nice marinas, but only saw one CD in the Superior/Duluth Harbor, and none up on the MN northshore, or on the southeast lake shores. Not even in the new crowded marina south of Bayfield, or north near the casino.
I always thought it would be fun to use our CD25 up there for some gunkhoiing around the lake one summer, but it would be a prohibitively long trailer tow from down here, so not likely in this life.
Wishing you all a Merry Christmas,
Bob C
Citrus Springs FL
Moon Shine
BobC
Citrus Springs, Florida
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