Seeking Advice on Sailmaker for CD30

[Larry DeMers]

Hi everyone,

I am currently pricing out a new main and staysail for our CD30, and wondered if anyone here has a sail brand or maker that they would care to recommend? Also, anyone have experiences with a loose footed mainsail? I am hearing that they are much easier to reef down in higher winds, and have a larger range of operation at a given reef point than the regular footed main.

Cheers!

Larry DeMers
s/v DeLaMer
Cape Dory 30 Sailing Lake Superior



demers@sgi.com

[Don Carr]

Larry;
Can't/Won't comment on the best sailmaker,but I will give you my experience with loose footed mains. Primarily the loose footed main was conceived from racing. The concept is to provide as you say infinite sail shaping capbabilities by adjusting foot tension. As a comparison look at a sluggged or tracked foot. By releasing or increasing tension all you do is allow the draft to move forward or aft. On a loose footed main not only does the draft move but the fundamental shape of the foot changes. This is particularly helpful in downwind situations where you want a 'belly'. Reefing is not of particular issue here as properly adjusted outhaul / reefing points will keep reasonable sail shape.

[Bruce Bett]

Larry:

Last year I had a new main and jenny made at UK Detroit. At the sail makers suggestion it is full batoned and loose footed. The sail shape is more responsive to adjustment of the out haul, and therefore I’m more likely to make an adjustment. As for reefing the difference is that you don’t tie the reef points around the boom just around the bottom of the sail. This means you can use shorter reef points. It also means you retain the advantage of the loose foot even when reefed. As for UK I’m not prepared to say they are the best out there but I did talk to several sailmakers in the Detroit area and liked they’re proposal and price. They made me a nice sail.

Bruce Bett
Sostenuto
CD25 #496

Hi everyone,

I am currently pricing out a new main and staysail for our CD30, and wondered if anyone here has a sail brand or maker that they would care to recommend? Also, anyone have experiences with a loose footed mainsail? I am hearing that they are much easier to reef down in higher winds, and have a larger range of operation at a given reef point than the regular footed main.

Cheers!

Larry DeMers
s/v DeLaMer
Cape Dory 30 Sailing Lake Superior

bettb@macomb.cc.mi.us

[Larry M]

Hi Larry,
Last year we had Quantum here in San Francisco cut a loose footed main for our CD 33. In addition to the benefits mentioned the ability to flatten the sail as the wind rises tends to act like a shallow reef point. I went for a full top batten and the remainder just being oversized. Once you sail with one you will not go back to a shelf foot. I have ordered many sails from this loft and if you would like a contact,let me know. There loft at the marina has several CD in about every size to measure off and currently runs a winter discount program.
Larry Mace

Hi everyone,

I am currently pricing out a new main and staysail for our CD30, and wondered if anyone here has a sail brand or maker that they would care to recommend? Also, anyone have experiences with a loose footed mainsail? I am hearing that they are much easier to reef down in higher winds, and have a larger range of operation at a given reef point than the regular footed main.

Cheers!

Larry DeMers
s/v DeLaMer
Cape Dory 30 Sailing Lake Superior

lmace@gt.com

[Marino]

They're also a lot easier to put on the boom as the bolt rope doesn't kink up.

[John M]

Hi Larry,

I can recommend Schurr Sails in Penscola, FL. They made a Main and 135% Genoa (for our former boat, a CD22) that were excellent. The Main had a particularly nice shape. Also, they made the asymetrical spinnaker that we are currently using aboard Intrepid (CD28). Schurr has a good reprutation and a lot of sails racing and cruising here on Lake Lanier (Atlanta).

I race on a Hunter 30 and we removed the foot-rope and now just use the clew slug to hold the foot. The main is old and tired and needs to be replaced, but being loose footed sure helps the shape, up-wind and off the wind.

Ditto on the comments about reefing, a proper reef is tied around the foot.

John Martin
CD28 #346 Intrepid

Hi everyone,

I am currently pricing out a new main and staysail for our CD30, and wondered if anyone here has a sail brand or maker that they would care to recommend? Also, anyone have experiences with a loose footed mainsail? I am hearing that they are much easier to reef down in higher winds, and have a larger range of operation at a given reef point than the regular footed main.

Cheers!

Larry DeMers
s/v DeLaMer
Cape Dory 30 Sailing Lake Superior

johnmartin55@hotmail.com

[Joe Sankey]

Larry:
I agree with John. Schurr has made sails for three boats (Ensign, CD22 and CD28) for us. Ck out their website (Schurrsails.com) and/or talk to Hunter Riddle. They are well known for racing success, but I assure you they know cruising sails.
Joe

Hi everyone,

I am currently pricing out a new main and staysail for our CD30, and wondered if anyone here has a sail brand or maker that they would care to recommend? Also, anyone have experiences with a loose footed mainsail? I am hearing that they are much easier to reef down in higher winds, and have a larger range of operation at a given reef point than the regular footed main.

Cheers!

Larry DeMers
s/v DeLaMer
Cape Dory 30 Sailing Lake Superior

sankey@gulftel.com

[Larry DeMers]

Thanks for the advice everyone. I will talk to each of the recommended sailmakers.

...Larry

Hi everyone,

I am currently pricing out a new main and staysail for our CD30, and wondered if anyone here has a sail brand or maker that they would care to recommend? Also, anyone have experiences with a loose footed mainsail? I am hearing that they are much easier to reef down in higher winds, and have a larger range of operation at a given reef point than the regular footed main.

Cheers!

Larry DeMers
s/v DeLaMer
Cape Dory 30 Sailing Lake Superior

demers@sgi.com

[Larry DeMers]

Don,

I have to admit that I had not thought on this type of main until a few weeks ago. Then i found out what others have known for a long time..the loose footed main is a real improvement over the footed main. Don, are there any disadvantages to this sail type? I can see that a small boom mounted winch will be added this spring..at least I am assuming that it would be needed to handle the outhaul. Can you think of anything else that is specific to this type of mainsail?

From all the positive comments on this type of sail, I am getting anxious to try it out. The mainsail I am replacing still has life in it, but is 17 yrs. old, and ready for retirement in the garage.

Thanks for the help on this!

Cheers!

Larry DeMers
s/v DeLaMer
Cape Dory 30

Larry;
Can't/Won't comment on the best sailmaker,but I will give you my experience with loose footed mains. Primarily the loose footed main was conceived from racing. The concept is to provide as you say infinite sail shaping capbabilities by adjusting foot tension. As a comparison look at a sluggged or tracked foot. By releasing or increasing tension all you do is allow the draft to move forward or aft. On a loose footed main not only does the draft move but the fundamental shape of the foot changes. This is particularly helpful in downwind situations where you want a 'belly'. Reefing is not of particular issue here as properly adjusted outhaul / reefing points will keep reasonable sail shape.

demers@sgi.com

[John M]

Larry,

Before you add a winch to your boom, try an outhaul with 4:1 purchase. On our CD28 the outhaul is made up of 2 small double blocks and a length of 1/4 inch line. The outhaul is lead back to the cockpit for quick, easy adjustment, even under load. I have used this outhaul arrangement on many boats, over many years. You will find that adjusting a loose footed main is a very simple process.

John & Nancy Martin
CD28 #346 Intrepid

Don,

I have to admit that I had not thought on this type of main until a few weeks ago. Then i found out what others have known for a long time..the loose footed main is a real improvement over the footed main. Don, are there any disadvantages to this sail type? I can see that a small boom mounted winch will be added this spring..at least I am assuming that it would be needed to handle the outhaul. Can you think of anything else that is specific to this type of mainsail?

From all the positive comments on this type of sail, I am getting anxious to try it out. The mainsail I am replacing still has life in it, but is 17 yrs. old, and ready for retirement in the garage.

Thanks for the help on this!

Cheers!

Larry DeMers
s/v DeLaMer
Cape Dory 30

Larry;
Can't/Won't comment on the best sailmaker,but I will give you my experience with loose footed mains. Primarily the loose footed main was conceived from racing. The concept is to provide as you say infinite sail shaping capbabilities by adjusting foot tension. As a comparison look at a sluggged or tracked foot. By releasing or increasing tension all you do is allow the draft to move forward or aft. On a loose footed main not only does the draft move but the fundamental shape of the foot changes. This is particularly helpful in downwind situations where you want a 'belly'. Reefing is not of particular issue here as properly adjusted outhaul / reefing points will keep reasonable sail shape.

johnmartin55@hotmail.com

[Don Carr]

Larry,

I have found no disadvantages to a loose footed main. I agree with John that a winch is serious overkill. I like Johns arrangement back to the cockpit but a simpler arrangement is to install an outhaul car on the end of the boom (which implies a block) and lead the 1/4" line forward inside the boom with an exit plate about 18" aft of the gooseneck terminating at a clamcleat. The drawback is that you adjust outhaul from the mast. Even on a 55" luff racing sail it is very adjustable by one person unless you are full off the wind. To ease simply disengage theline from the cleat and adjust. To tighten simply put the line in the cleat and heave forward until adjusted...the tension will set the line in the cleat.



carrd48@netzero.net

[Larry DeMers]

Thanks for the info on Loose Footed Mains. I see that a winch is not needed probably, so that is a relief! I was looking at this aspect of the new mainsail this past weekend, and found that the boom mounted winch was going to be a problem to mount clear of other equipment already in place.

Another question: I am getting three reefs put into our mainsail, and I was wondering what you do to handle reefing on a loose footed main. I use jiffy reefing now, but can see that another method of adjusting the mainsail while reefed may be needed. Since the clew of the mainsail needs to be adjusted in or out easily, the outhaul will need to be reattached to the active clew cringle when reefed. How do you make these quick changes, while holding the clew captive on the boom at the same time? (I am suspecting the answer is probably bloody obvious, and I am just not seeing it this early in the morning..sorry). It almost seems like we will still need to have the reefing outhauls we now have for our two-reef point mainsail (except we need to add one more outhaul to the boom), which will hold the mainsail in position while we reattach the permanent outhaul (since the foot of the sail is not attached to the boom except at the clew end). It also seems like the equipment strength needed here is going to be higher since the boom is not holding the foot of the sail anymore. The clew is totally restrained by the outhaul line and block & tackle, and it's attachment points.

Any suggestions here?

Thanks again,

Larry

Larry,

I have found no disadvantages to a loose footed main. I agree with John that a winch is serious overkill. I like Johns arrangement back to the cockpit but a simpler arrangement is to install an outhaul car on the end of the boom (which implies a block) and lead the 1/4" line forward inside the boom with an exit plate about 18" aft of the gooseneck terminating at a clamcleat. The drawback is that you adjust outhaul from the mast. Even on a 55" luff racing sail it is very adjustable by one person unless you are full off the wind. To ease simply disengage theline from the cleat and adjust. To tighten simply put the line in the cleat and heave forward until adjusted...the tension will set the line in the cleat.

demers@sgi.com

[johnmartin55@hotmail.com]

Larry, We use the clew reefing line to hold the main down/out, while reefed. We do not have/use an outhaul when the main is reefed. Our clew reefing line is mounted so it pulls down and out at about a 45 degree angle. I have never considered using an outhaul while the main is reefed. I usually want a flat sail. I may? shake out the single reef to get a fuller shape, but only going down wind, and only while racing. I supose you could mount your outhaul block and tackle to a hook (tack hook), if you have enough room on the boom. Let me know what you decide.

John Martin
CD28 #346 Intrepid

Thanks for the info on Loose Footed Mains. I see that a winch is not needed probably, so that is a relief! I was looking at this aspect of the new mainsail this past weekend, and found that the boom mounted winch was going to be a problem to mount clear of other equipment already in place.

Another question: I am getting three reefs put into our mainsail, and I was wondering what you do to handle reefing on a loose footed main. I use jiffy reefing now, but can see that another method of adjusting the mainsail while reefed may be needed. Since the clew of the mainsail needs to be adjusted in or out easily, the outhaul will need to be reattached to the active clew cringle when reefed. How do you make these quick changes, while holding the clew captive on the boom at the same time? (I am suspecting the answer is probably bloody obvious, and I am just not seeing it this early in the morning..sorry). It almost seems like we will still need to have the reefing outhauls we now have for our two-reef point mainsail (except we need to add one more outhaul to the boom), which will hold the mainsail in position while we reattach the permanent outhaul (since the foot of the sail is not attached to the boom except at the clew end). It also seems like the equipment strength needed here is going to be higher since the boom is not holding the foot of the sail anymore. The clew is totally restrained by the outhaul line and block & tackle, and it's attachment points.

Any suggestions here?

Thanks again,

Larry

Larry,

I have found no disadvantages to a loose footed main. I agree with John that a winch is serious overkill. I like Johns arrangement back to the cockpit but a simpler arrangement is to install an outhaul car on the end of the boom (which implies a block) and lead the 1/4" line forward inside the boom with an exit plate about 18" aft of the gooseneck terminating at a clamcleat. The drawback is that you adjust outhaul from the mast. Even on a 55" luff racing sail it is very adjustable by one person unless you are full off the wind. To ease simply disengage theline from the cleat and adjust. To tighten simply put the line in the cleat and heave forward until adjusted...the tension will set the line in the cleat.