I am getting ready to refurb and reinstall the ice box on my '78 CD 25 after gutting and teh main cabin. I have never used it and like any cooler, I would imagine afer a couple of days bits of food etc will be there. My question is what has anyone done to keep that kind of material from making it's way into the bilge? My icebox has a drain to the bilge, I imagine for any melted ice to drain.
My thinking is the bilge would get a bit gross with food etc floating around.
ALSO, has anyone else made any attempts to ADD more insulation to their ice box?
Thanks for the help!
Ice Box drain
Moderator: Jim Walsh
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tartansailor
- Posts: 1527
- Joined: Aug 30th, '05, 13:55
- Location: CD25, Renaissance, Milton, DE
Re: Ice Box drain
The CD25 ice box, if you want to call it that, is not insulated, and not IMHO suitable for
anything more than icing down caned or bottled drinks. We keep our perishables in a well
insulated cooler, and gallon bottled water jugs in the forward part of the bilge.
Dick
anything more than icing down caned or bottled drinks. We keep our perishables in a well
insulated cooler, and gallon bottled water jugs in the forward part of the bilge.
Dick
Viam Inveniam Aut Faciam
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Steve Laume
- Posts: 4127
- Joined: Feb 13th, '05, 20:40
- Location: Raven1984 Cape Dory 30C Hull #309Noank, CT
- Contact:
Re: Ice Box drain
Mr Bill, there are a couple of old threads on insulating the ice box if you go to the search feature at the top of the page. Here is a fairly recent one. http://www.capedory.org/board/viewtopic ... ox#p163256
While Raven may have some water in her bilge I do not tolerate any water in the ice box and certainly no melt water in the bilge. When I start a trip, I always bring frozen gallon jugs from home. You may get a little condensation from the jugs but no melt water. The better the insulation the less condensation so those go hand in hand. Limiting the time you have the box open goes a long way too. I have not insulated the top of the box as it seems the least important. I do cover the contents with a stadium blanket and a sheet of mylar covered bubble wrap. I tuck things in like a baby and only cool the needed volume. Since cool air falls I have a closed cell plug, that I stuff in the ice box drain. Once the jugs have melted I use the water for coffee and drinking. When they are empty they can be crushed and stowed or recycled on shore. These will last aprox. five days in my situation. If the trip is to last longer and I need to purchase ice, it always goes in a dry bag. This also captures all the melt water but I don't drink that. Any meat or cheese goes in Tupperware type containers to keep from contaminating the box. The only water removal I ever do is with a sponge.
These methods seem to work out pretty well but if I was starting from scratch I would probably build a new box, a bit smaller than the original. Overall these modifications have made a huge difference. The ice box stays cold, dry and fresh for a very long time and there is never any bait water in the bilge, Steve.
While Raven may have some water in her bilge I do not tolerate any water in the ice box and certainly no melt water in the bilge. When I start a trip, I always bring frozen gallon jugs from home. You may get a little condensation from the jugs but no melt water. The better the insulation the less condensation so those go hand in hand. Limiting the time you have the box open goes a long way too. I have not insulated the top of the box as it seems the least important. I do cover the contents with a stadium blanket and a sheet of mylar covered bubble wrap. I tuck things in like a baby and only cool the needed volume. Since cool air falls I have a closed cell plug, that I stuff in the ice box drain. Once the jugs have melted I use the water for coffee and drinking. When they are empty they can be crushed and stowed or recycled on shore. These will last aprox. five days in my situation. If the trip is to last longer and I need to purchase ice, it always goes in a dry bag. This also captures all the melt water but I don't drink that. Any meat or cheese goes in Tupperware type containers to keep from contaminating the box. The only water removal I ever do is with a sponge.
These methods seem to work out pretty well but if I was starting from scratch I would probably build a new box, a bit smaller than the original. Overall these modifications have made a huge difference. The ice box stays cold, dry and fresh for a very long time and there is never any bait water in the bilge, Steve.
Re: Ice Box drain
Steve and Dick,
thanks for the advice. In spirit of fun humor, I too was amazed at the volume the designer allocated to that box. Not sure if they were storing food or hauling deer home from a hunting trip! You guys now have me thinking perhaps I might design cavity to hold a store bought cooler that is made with modern insulation, hmmmm. I do hesitate to mess wtih the boats original design, so I will have to think that one through...
Steve, excellent advice on the water jugs. If I keep the original ice box, I will use that idea.
I'll let you know what I end up doing.
Happy sailing
thanks for the advice. In spirit of fun humor, I too was amazed at the volume the designer allocated to that box. Not sure if they were storing food or hauling deer home from a hunting trip! You guys now have me thinking perhaps I might design cavity to hold a store bought cooler that is made with modern insulation, hmmmm. I do hesitate to mess wtih the boats original design, so I will have to think that one through...
Steve, excellent advice on the water jugs. If I keep the original ice box, I will use that idea.
I'll let you know what I end up doing.
Happy sailing
"J" Trap
Years ago (before my CD36, and before my CD28) I had a CD25. That 1978 boat did have insulation in the icebox. I relined it with 1" foam board, and it worked pretty well.
Any icebox should have a 'J" trap on the bottom of the drain hose. The trap fills with melted ice water, and lets a little water out into the bilge out as new water comes in the top of the trap. The whole point of the trap is, being filled with water, it stops all the cold air in the ice box from falling down the drain hose into the bilge. Without the J trap cold air continually falls down the drain hose, continually sucking warm cabin air into the ice box to replace the falling cold air and defeating the purpose of the ice box.
A well insulated ice box, starting with very cold ice (0° as opposed to 25°F), a proper J trap drain hose, and a blanket/towel on top of the food, can keep stuff cold a long, long time.
John
Any icebox should have a 'J" trap on the bottom of the drain hose. The trap fills with melted ice water, and lets a little water out into the bilge out as new water comes in the top of the trap. The whole point of the trap is, being filled with water, it stops all the cold air in the ice box from falling down the drain hose into the bilge. Without the J trap cold air continually falls down the drain hose, continually sucking warm cabin air into the ice box to replace the falling cold air and defeating the purpose of the ice box.
A well insulated ice box, starting with very cold ice (0° as opposed to 25°F), a proper J trap drain hose, and a blanket/towel on top of the food, can keep stuff cold a long, long time.
John
Sailing involves the courage to cherish adventure and the wisdom to fear danger. Knowing where one ends, and the other begins, makes all the difference.
Re: Ice Box drain
I once owned a boat with an ice box.
The ice box drain led to the bilge.
I simply secured a plastic bottle in the bilge and put the hose from the ice box into the plastic bottle.
I would empty the bottle first thing every morning.
This worked great.
Gary
The ice box drain led to the bilge.
I simply secured a plastic bottle in the bilge and put the hose from the ice box into the plastic bottle.
I would empty the bottle first thing every morning.
This worked great.
Gary
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Steve Laume
- Posts: 4127
- Joined: Feb 13th, '05, 20:40
- Location: Raven1984 Cape Dory 30C Hull #309Noank, CT
- Contact:
Re: Ice Box drain
John, I believe my drain hose has a loop in it to form a trap. The problem with that and the reason for the foam plug I use is that there is never any drain water. The only moisture I see in the ice box is from condensation and I try to sponge that up before it accumulates.
Raven did have about an inch of insulation before I went to work. You can figure out just where you stand by drilling a tiny hole in the liner and poking a wire in there. The box I had was kind of a double walled affair with about an inch of some sort of foam material. I foamed up everything all the way around to fill as much space as there was available. It is pretty thick on the hull side and under the bottom. The most distressing part on my boat was that the engine compartment shares a common wall with the ice box and there is not that much free space in between. I added sound insulation on the engine side which should also provide some additional thermal insulation.
If you can ever get your hands on a copy of "The Perfect Box: 39 Ways To Improve Your Boat's Ice Box" by the Staff of Spa Creek Instrument Co. Annapolis copyright 1982. it is a very definitive little book on evaluating and improving your boat's ice box. It is 73 pages of text and sketches that cover theory, options and recommendations for various improvements. It is a gem that I picked up used and was a tremendous help in figuring out how to proceed with my project.
The ultimate solution is to rip out everything and start over again. I went the holes and foam route but I still have the option of adding blue board on the inside and making a new liner. If I was going to be spending a lot of time in warm waters I would proceed that way as the box is certainly big enough to be able to afford the loss of capacity.
What I did do is infinitely better than how it was, Steve.
Raven did have about an inch of insulation before I went to work. You can figure out just where you stand by drilling a tiny hole in the liner and poking a wire in there. The box I had was kind of a double walled affair with about an inch of some sort of foam material. I foamed up everything all the way around to fill as much space as there was available. It is pretty thick on the hull side and under the bottom. The most distressing part on my boat was that the engine compartment shares a common wall with the ice box and there is not that much free space in between. I added sound insulation on the engine side which should also provide some additional thermal insulation.
If you can ever get your hands on a copy of "The Perfect Box: 39 Ways To Improve Your Boat's Ice Box" by the Staff of Spa Creek Instrument Co. Annapolis copyright 1982. it is a very definitive little book on evaluating and improving your boat's ice box. It is 73 pages of text and sketches that cover theory, options and recommendations for various improvements. It is a gem that I picked up used and was a tremendous help in figuring out how to proceed with my project.
The ultimate solution is to rip out everything and start over again. I went the holes and foam route but I still have the option of adding blue board on the inside and making a new liner. If I was going to be spending a lot of time in warm waters I would proceed that way as the box is certainly big enough to be able to afford the loss of capacity.
What I did do is infinitely better than how it was, Steve.