Equipment Failure Puzzler

[mike ritenour]

I'm smelling a "Car Talk" hint here
Thanks Paul.
Can't believe you found someone to repair that behemouth! Best of luck my friend.
Rit

[Steve Laume]

I would have said it was part of the steering cable but will rule this out because this post would not have been so casual.

The auto pilot reference seems to point at an accidental jibe while it was supposedly in control. This would lead me to believe this cable might be part of the vang assembly.

Running down wind while under auto pilot the captain goes below for a nice cup of tea and all hell breaks lose.

Quite literally, Steve.

[Oswego John]

I'm smelling a "Car Talk" hint here
Thanks Paul.
Best of luck my friend.
Rit

I know how to get to the bottom of this. I'm calling Car Talk and ask Frick and Frack what's going on. They'll know.

O J

[Ed Haley]

Did someone attach a preventer (probably a short-line boom vang) to a lifeline while cruising downwind with the main swung out? Smarter sailors than me have tried that one.

[Carl Thunberg]

Piecing together the potential clue in the 40-pound box comment, with the bent thimble, I'm thinking that maybe the anchor somehow got dropped on a pendant for a cruising spinnaker, maybe? It's a long-shot, but it's all I got.

[John Danicic]

Interesting repartee so far. Now, more clues.

It was the steering cable. The starboard side. 1/4 inch SS.

It became a most interesting sail when it suddenly broke in 20 to 30 knot winds on a broad, starboard reach. Auto pilot was not on. It made a most vexing sound when it went. I heard it from the mast. A friend was at the wheel and suddenly had no rudder control. We were about to head up to put a reef in the main. Boat speed was about 7.3 knots in two to three footers.

Here are a few more photos/clues. I have my own theory. Why do you think it happened?

[SPIBob]

Okay, I'll take a guess. Some heavy metal object with a sharp edge---spare anchor?---that was stored in the vicinity of the rudder post shifted position so that when the helm was put hard to starboard or port, as in a tack, the wire cable and thimble where the steering cable attaches to the quadrant were brought into sudden, forceful contact with the edge of the object. This created a repetitive pinching action, not unlike between the jaws of a bolt cutter, and this collapsed the thimble and eventually cut through the cable. That's all I got.

[M. R. Bober]

Was the cable too slack? I'm sticking with Col. Mustard.

Mitchell Bober
Sunny Lancaster, (No slackers, here) VA

[mike ritenour]

Hey John,
Awesome photography!
What lens were you using?
Rit

[John Danicic]

Hey John,
Awesome photography!
What lens were you using?
Rit

Mike I used a 55mm Macro with a reversing ring. Good for extreme close-ups.


The cable was not too slack but I think that the rudder has a lack of rudder stop(s), which allowed it to travel too far to one side allowing the chain cable connection to come in constant contact with the steering gear. Over the years the wires were cut one by one until there weren't enough to hold on anymore. There also appears to be corrosion at the Nicropress fitting or some of the strands were damaged when it was installed. I am glad it happened when it did and it was interesting installing and using the emergency tiller.

The wire/cable connection is beyond my inspection view from below or above for that matter. The other side's cable connection is fine. Still has the plastic covering which of course, obscures it. I would recommend that all check these connections. It might mean removing the chain cable to see exactly what is going on.

Has anyone installed rudder stops? I definitely need one on at least one side.

[David van den Burgh]

Hey John,
Awesome photography!
What lens were you using?
Rit

Has anyone installed rudder stops? I definitely need one on at least one side.

John,

Ariel's rudder stop is a steel pipe welded to the steering assembly under the cockpit floor. It occupies the inside arc of the quadrant and uses the quadrant itself to limit motion. You must have something like that on Mariah, too.

With regard to your cable eye, perhaps it's possible to get a longer chain in the pedestal to keep the eyes away from the gears.

Thanks for sharing the warning.

[John Danicic]

David:

From what I could tell there were no stops on either side though I didn't specifically look at the time. I would remember something big and I did notice that the emergency tiller swung to starboard and would stop about 6 inches before the cockpit seat. When the tiller was swung to port it went all the way and stopped at the seat.

I think that lengthening the chain would cause a different set of problems as the eye-loop will not go through the deck opening and could jam.

It could be possible that the chain was not centered but how do we explain the tiller travel discrepancy?

Might you have a photo of your stops?

Here is a shot of my quadrant and the emergency tiller in place. In this photo I had taken off the wheel which it barely cleared.

[David van den Burgh]

John,

The rudder stop is visible in your photo. I've highlighted it.



Ariel's stop is vertical, whereas yours appears to be bent to port. Could that be? That would explain why the emergency tiller went all the way to the seat when it was over to port. It might also explain the failure of the eye.

Ariel's is also covered with a plastic hose to dampen contact between the quadrant and the post. I'll see if I can dig up a photo.

[John Danicic]

That's it. That pipe always looked that way. I thought that stub of pipe was something to run wires up. Never gave it a second thought as it didn't seem to do anything. Pretty bent so should be interesting straightening her out.

Thanks David. I love this board.

[GeorgeV]

This last summer the cable on my steering quadrant broke. During the repair we discovered the quadrant stop was simply not long enough to guarantee that the rudder / quadrant did not over rotate. The yard built me a new longer one (maybe a inch longer) to keep the quadrant and the rudder rotating too far and it is working great. I think the metal that the builder used was too soft to stand up over the years.

The damage you had is exactly what I had. The stop itself was held in place by a couple of bolts, so don't try to straigten it, just take it out and have a shop make up a new one, it shouldn't cost much it was a simple fix once we identified the problem.

The stop could have easily been bent if the boat had run aground and someone attemted to pull it off from the stern. The rudder would go hard over, putting a tremdous load on the stop.

I would recommend anyone who is replacing the cables on their quadrant to take a close look at the stop and replace it with a slightly longer stop if it look damaged or bent at all.

Fair Winds