T-Track mounted cleats

[Warren S]

Hi Gang,

Is there any conventional wisdom on the use of t-track mounted cleats for docking and spring lines?

I keep envisioning undue side-loads that might loosen the bedding or other wise cause leaks along the track. It would be nice to use midship spring lines for the upcoming hurricane season, but not if it's going to damage the track.

Thoughts?

Thanks!

[Russell]

The ones I have seen always seemed a bit on the light side to me for any real load. They are tempting though for convience. But if your idea is for hurricane season specificly? I would say no personally. For cleating furling lines, or dinghys, sure.

Why not just bite the bullet and install a proper midship cleat? Boats without midship cleats drive me nuts, I dont think I could stand being without one for long.

[Neil Gordon]

Someone want to do the math of a loaded Genoa sheet running through a block vs. a spring line?

[Russell]

Someone want to do the math of a loaded Genoa sheet running through a block vs. a spring line?

The thing is, the full load of the genoa is not applied to the T track, the winch takes a lot of the load. And you furl up a genny when the wind pipes up, you cannot furl up your boats freeboard in a hurricane.

[David van den Burgh]

Hi Gang,

Is there any conventional wisdom on the use of t-track mounted cleats for docking and spring lines?

I keep envisioning undue side-loads that might loosen the bedding or other wise cause leaks along the track. It would be nice to use midship spring lines for the upcoming hurricane season, but not if it's going to damage the track.

Thoughts?

Thanks!

We have track-mounted cleats (one Schaefer, the other a knockoff) that do backup duty to the mortised Spartan mid-ship cleats. My approach to the track-mounted cleats has been to keep the loads as much in line with the track as possible and to rig them so they only draw tight when the lines to the mid-ship cleats have taken up most of the force. That's been standard fall storm configuration for over five years, and we've had some really nasty storms (i.e., swell and surge) in our marina.

Track-mounted cleats would be better than nothing, but I would only rely on them as long as it took to get some mid-ship cleats mortised in, especially if you're talking about storm conditions.

In normal conditions, ours have worked fine for docking and spring lines.

[moctrams]

I use my Track mounted cleat for the "spring line".

[Warren S]

I think for now I will use the cleat as a "normal" spring line, and as a spring line to aid in docking, but not a storm line. in that case, i will use longer dock lines and go to a midships piling.

[Tom Keevil]

Rover came with Schaefer track-mounted cleats that we have used for spring lines without incident for many years. For us they are the essential cleats for coming into a dock. Installing permanent cleats is on our list of future projects, but we just haven't gotten to it yet.

Our boat is in the water 12 months, has been through many nasty winter storms on the Oregon coast, and the cleats have done well. The strongest officially recorded wind of which we are aware was 100 knots when the boat was in the South Beach Marina in Newport. The cleats did fine.

[Ron Churgin]

Has anyone had any experience with the Garhauer mid-ship cleats? They are half the price as the Schaeffer but are not castings and lack a through hole.

I would just use them as spring lines when docking so do not need excessive strength.

[Bob Brown]

Barbara Lee came with 6" black Aluminum cleats on the track. We have no mid ship cleats and have used these for spring lines. I would prefer cleats with longer horns and and haven't been able to find any in bronze. We would prefer not to have chrome cleats on the rail. Is there an issue with mixing the metals or is there a lack of demand for bronze?

We also have mid ship cleats on our to do list. Does Spartan still sell these?

Thanks,

Bob Brown

[drysuit2]

Rover came with Schaefer track-mounted cleats that we have used for spring lines without incident for many years. For us they are the essential cleats for coming into a dock. Installing permanent cleats is on our list of future projects, but we just haven't gotten to it yet.

Our boat is in the water 12 months, has been through many nasty winter storms on the Oregon coast, and the cleats have done well. The strongest officially recorded wind of which we are aware was 100 knots when the boat was in the South Beach Marina in Newport. The cleats did fine.

I've been thinking about this too. Because Segue spends her winters at a dock.
Is your Genni track through bolted with backing plates? Mine doesn't seem to be. The majority of the screws I see down below look like self tapping screws. Not bolts and nuts. Is that common on the later [1985] CD's? Was Cape Dory looking to save money? Or is that all that is really necessary for a toe rail?

Any way; if I through bolted a few spots on my Genni Track, and oversized the backing plate; would that be sufficient for the side ways loads on the track? I guess I have the same question about mortising in a mid-ship cleat.

I tried to use my inner jib track and blocks for my spring lines this winter; and I trashed a jib block, but not the car or track.

I would be afraid to instal a cleat to that inner track, because knowing me. I would trip over it.

Thanks for your help.









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[Warren S]

On the 270, the track is smack dab in the middle of the side deck, and I am forever stubbing my toe on the cleat.

FYI my tracks are definitely through-bolted w. backing plate every 8 or so inches.

[David van den Burgh]

On the 270, the track is smack dab in the middle of the side deck, and I am forever stubbing my toe on the cleat.

FYI my tracks are definitely through-bolted w. backing plate every 8 or so inches.

By the way, I had just assumed that the discussion of track-mounted cleats meant those mounted on the toe rail. I don't have any experience with CD tracks mounted inboard.

[Steve Laume]

Raven has Spartan midship cleats. I am definitely glad they are there but wish the horns were longer. They work fine for one line but not so good if you are trying to get two on there.

Bronze and aluminum are not a good mix. And yes I believe the demand would be extremely low even if there were no problem with dissimilar metals.

Raven's tracks are definitely through bolted with regular washers underneath. There are way more fasteners than you want to deal with when you go to rebed. I believe it is every four inches. The lack of larger washers or proper backing plates does not seem to be an issue as most of the load is in shear. That is an extreemly strong area of the boat. You have a good sized section of the teak toe rail the the uncored deck and hull where they form the joint. This is also backed up by the rub rail.

The only screws I see are those that fasten the toe rail to the deck. Everything else is bolted, Steve.

[Neil Gordon]

Someone want to do the math of a loaded Genoa sheet running through a block vs. a spring line?

The thing is, the full load of the genoa is not applied to the T track, the winch takes a lot of the load. And you furl up a genny when the wind pipes up, you cannot furl up your boats freeboard in a hurricane.

The Genoa though has a significant vertical component.