After a week long sailing trip out in the ocean, I really fell in love with self tailing winches. My 1980 CD27 still has the original Lewmar 7 winches mounted on bronze stands for the genoa sheets. They work well but I want to go to self tailers especially since I plan to do alot of single handed sailing. Has anyone done this? Can the new winches be fitted to the old stands or do they have to be mounted in a "new" place? Does Lewmar (or anyone else) make a self tailer that will fit "exactly" where the old standard winches were? I'm also thinking of replacing the Lewmar 6 halyard winch on the mast.
Any advise as to whether to go with Lewmar or any other make will be appreciated? Any suggestions in mounting the new winches (so as to avoid disaster) would be GREATLY appreciated.
Thanks
Warren
S/V Sine Qua Non
CD27 #166
Setsail728@aol.com
Winch Replacement, CD27
Moderator: Jim Walsh
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Bill Goldsmith
Re: Winch Replacement, CD27
Warren,
My 1980 Cd27 came to me two years ago with two shiny new Lewmar 16 non-self-tailers. There is no way to upgrade them to ST. I priced out new STs for the "fun" of it and got put off by the price. Instead I use those blue rubber "winchers" that work fairly well.
If you go for the self-tailers, you might be able to use the same holes in the bronze winch pads if you go with the same model, just the ST version. (However I do not recall that they still make a "7".)Check with Lewmar to see if they make a winch where the pattern is the same. Even if you go with winches that have a different hole pattern it's not a big deal to drill out new holes. On mine the inboard hole was so close to the upright support on the inside, a nut does not fit. Whomever installed it tapped threads in those inboard holes of the winch bases, solving that potential problem of upgrading winch size.
As far as the mast winches are concerned I was surprised to find that Lewmar uses plastic bases in their #6 winch. Unfortunatlely the prior owner(s) neglected winch maintenance on mine and the screws were hopelessly corroded in place. Some of the corrosion had built up underneath the plastic base and cracked it!! That winch has gone to winch heaven. I am in the process of replacing it with a Harken #8, (no plastic). I think that a #8 winch is better sized for the CD 27 anyway.
Good Luck!
Bill Goldsmith
CD27 #173
Second Chance
After a week long sailing trip out in the ocean, I really fell in love with self tailing winches. My 1980 CD27 still has the original Lewmar 7 winches mounted on bronze stands for the genoa sheets. They work well but I want to go to self tailers especially since I plan to do alot of single handed sailing. Has anyone done this? Can the new winches be fitted to the old stands or do they have to be mounted in a "new" place? Does Lewmar (or anyone else) make a self tailer that will fit "exactly" where the old standard winches were? I'm also thinking of replacing the Lewmar 6 halyard winch on the mast.
goldy@bestweb.net
My 1980 Cd27 came to me two years ago with two shiny new Lewmar 16 non-self-tailers. There is no way to upgrade them to ST. I priced out new STs for the "fun" of it and got put off by the price. Instead I use those blue rubber "winchers" that work fairly well.
If you go for the self-tailers, you might be able to use the same holes in the bronze winch pads if you go with the same model, just the ST version. (However I do not recall that they still make a "7".)Check with Lewmar to see if they make a winch where the pattern is the same. Even if you go with winches that have a different hole pattern it's not a big deal to drill out new holes. On mine the inboard hole was so close to the upright support on the inside, a nut does not fit. Whomever installed it tapped threads in those inboard holes of the winch bases, solving that potential problem of upgrading winch size.
As far as the mast winches are concerned I was surprised to find that Lewmar uses plastic bases in their #6 winch. Unfortunatlely the prior owner(s) neglected winch maintenance on mine and the screws were hopelessly corroded in place. Some of the corrosion had built up underneath the plastic base and cracked it!! That winch has gone to winch heaven. I am in the process of replacing it with a Harken #8, (no plastic). I think that a #8 winch is better sized for the CD 27 anyway.
Good Luck!
Bill Goldsmith
CD27 #173
Second Chance
After a week long sailing trip out in the ocean, I really fell in love with self tailing winches. My 1980 CD27 still has the original Lewmar 7 winches mounted on bronze stands for the genoa sheets. They work well but I want to go to self tailers especially since I plan to do alot of single handed sailing. Has anyone done this? Can the new winches be fitted to the old stands or do they have to be mounted in a "new" place? Does Lewmar (or anyone else) make a self tailer that will fit "exactly" where the old standard winches were? I'm also thinking of replacing the Lewmar 6 halyard winch on the mast.
Warren Kaplan wrote: Any advise as to whether to go with Lewmar or any other make will be appreciated? Any suggestions in mounting the new winches (so as to avoid disaster) would be GREATLY appreciated.
Thanks
Warren
S/V Sine Qua Non
CD27 #166
goldy@bestweb.net
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Bill
Re: Winch Replacement, CD27
A CD 27 came through out marina last fall, and he had added Lewmar ST winches to his boat. they were the chrome models. I dont recall the model number (but I can find out), but they did fit on his old bronze winch stands, they just had to be redrilled (as I recall). I will send him a copy of this note and see what he says.
Fair Winds
Bill
cd25d@rhapsodysails.com
Fair Winds
Bill
Warren Kaplan wrote: After a week long sailing trip out in the ocean, I really fell in love with self tailing winches. My 1980 CD27 still has the original Lewmar 7 winches mounted on bronze stands for the genoa sheets. They work well but I want to go to self tailers especially since I plan to do alot of single handed sailing. Has anyone done this? Can the new winches be fitted to the old stands or do they have to be mounted in a "new" place? Does Lewmar (or anyone else) make a self tailer that will fit "exactly" where the old standard winches were? I'm also thinking of replacing the Lewmar 6 halyard winch on the mast.
Any advise as to whether to go with Lewmar or any other make will be appreciated? Any suggestions in mounting the new winches (so as to avoid disaster) would be GREATLY appreciated.
Thanks
Warren
S/V Sine Qua Non
CD27 #166
cd25d@rhapsodysails.com
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Warren Kaplan
Re: Winch Replacement, CD27
Bill,
Next thing I was planning to do was contact Lewmar and find out what they suggest for replacement of Lewmar 7 winches. I also picked up those blue rubber "make any winch into a self tailer" gizmos at West Marine but I haven't tried them yet. I certainly will this weekend. I see you are considering a Harken 8 for the mast. I think the CD27 would do better with all the winches one size or so larger. I think they are a little "underpowered". What do you think?
Thanks for your input.
Warren
Setsail728@aol.com
Next thing I was planning to do was contact Lewmar and find out what they suggest for replacement of Lewmar 7 winches. I also picked up those blue rubber "make any winch into a self tailer" gizmos at West Marine but I haven't tried them yet. I certainly will this weekend. I see you are considering a Harken 8 for the mast. I think the CD27 would do better with all the winches one size or so larger. I think they are a little "underpowered". What do you think?
Thanks for your input.
Warren
Setsail728@aol.com
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Bill Goldsmith
Re: Winch Replacement, CD27
Warren:
I've never sailed a Cd27 except my own but I can say that the Lewmar 16s for the 135 genoa is just the right size. I could not imagine going with a smaller size. As far as the "Winchers" are concerned they certainly do not take the place of a ST winch. With the wincher you have to be sure to give the sheet enough winds on the winch so that the top of the sheet (about to be the tail) snugs up against the rubber. Then, you can usually crank it except sometimes it has the tendency to wind around. Obviously with an ST winch you don't need to give it much thought after setting it up.
The mast winches are definitely undersized. Not that you need more winch power. You don't need any more than a # 6 to get adequate lift and tension on the halyards. YOu certainly don't want to overtension the halyards, esp. the roller furling genoa. However, since the halyard winches do take constant upward pull, the plastic bases of the Lewmar #6 weaken over time. To avoid failure and in keeping with the over-built qualities of Cape Dories I would opt for a # 8 mast winch with a bronze base, or at the very least a #6 that has a bronze base (no plastic).
Bill
goldy@bestweb.net
I've never sailed a Cd27 except my own but I can say that the Lewmar 16s for the 135 genoa is just the right size. I could not imagine going with a smaller size. As far as the "Winchers" are concerned they certainly do not take the place of a ST winch. With the wincher you have to be sure to give the sheet enough winds on the winch so that the top of the sheet (about to be the tail) snugs up against the rubber. Then, you can usually crank it except sometimes it has the tendency to wind around. Obviously with an ST winch you don't need to give it much thought after setting it up.
The mast winches are definitely undersized. Not that you need more winch power. You don't need any more than a # 6 to get adequate lift and tension on the halyards. YOu certainly don't want to overtension the halyards, esp. the roller furling genoa. However, since the halyard winches do take constant upward pull, the plastic bases of the Lewmar #6 weaken over time. To avoid failure and in keeping with the over-built qualities of Cape Dories I would opt for a # 8 mast winch with a bronze base, or at the very least a #6 that has a bronze base (no plastic).
Bill
Warren Kaplan wrote: Bill,
Next thing I was planning to do was contact Lewmar and find out what they suggest for replacement of Lewmar 7 winches. I also picked up those blue rubber "make any winch into a self tailer" gizmos at West Marine but I haven't tried them yet. I certainly will this weekend. I see you are considering a Harken 8 for the mast. I think the CD27 would do better with all the winches one size or so larger. I think they are a little "underpowered". What do you think?
Thanks for your input.
Warren
goldy@bestweb.net
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John M
Re: Winch Replacement, CD27
Hi Warren,
Two years ago, I did what you are asking about. Crew strength indicated that the original #16 bronze single speed Lewmar's, were too small. I found a formula that indicates the size winch needed. We removed the #16's and replaced them with two Lewmar #40, bronze, two speed, self-tailing winches. The bronze winch stand was plenty large enough to re-use. Since the diameter of the new winches is larger than the old winches, the holes did not match. I put the new holes between the old holes and that worked just fine.
One extra thing I did was to add a 4x6 backing plate under the deck where the winch stand goes thru the deck, and I used over sized finish washers where the bolts go thru the teak coaming. This gives the winch an incredible solid feel.
Good luck, fair wind, John
johnmartin55@hotmail.com
Two years ago, I did what you are asking about. Crew strength indicated that the original #16 bronze single speed Lewmar's, were too small. I found a formula that indicates the size winch needed. We removed the #16's and replaced them with two Lewmar #40, bronze, two speed, self-tailing winches. The bronze winch stand was plenty large enough to re-use. Since the diameter of the new winches is larger than the old winches, the holes did not match. I put the new holes between the old holes and that worked just fine.
One extra thing I did was to add a 4x6 backing plate under the deck where the winch stand goes thru the deck, and I used over sized finish washers where the bolts go thru the teak coaming. This gives the winch an incredible solid feel.
Good luck, fair wind, John
Warren Kaplan wrote: After a week long sailing trip out in the ocean, I really fell in love with self tailing winches. My 1980 CD27 still has the original Lewmar 7 winches mounted on bronze stands for the genoa sheets. They work well but I want to go to self tailers especially since I plan to do alot of single handed sailing. Has anyone done this? Can the new winches be fitted to the old stands or do they have to be mounted in a "new" place? Does Lewmar (or anyone else) make a self tailer that will fit "exactly" where the old standard winches were? I'm also thinking of replacing the Lewmar 6 halyard winch on the mast.
Any advise as to whether to go with Lewmar or any other make will be appreciated? Any suggestions in mounting the new winches (so as to avoid disaster) would be GREATLY appreciated.
Thanks
Warren
S/V Sine Qua Non
CD27 #166
johnmartin55@hotmail.com
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joe sankey
Re: Winch Replacement, CD27
We upgraded from Lewmar 16s to 30STs on our 28 several years ago. The 16s (2 spd) ended up on a 27, and the owner loves them. Yes, I agree the 7s are too small. I must tell you that the winch stands on our 28 barely accomodated the 30's; that 40s would fit on a 27 is a little suprising, but I know Spartan made the mounts in different sizes. I'd go with the largest I could afford in the way of winches (I'm old now)
but I'd suggest doing careful measurements to make sure you have clearance.
Joe
sankey@gulftel.com
but I'd suggest doing careful measurements to make sure you have clearance.
Joe
John M wrote: Hi Warren,
Two years ago, I did what you are asking about. Crew strength indicated that the original #16 bronze single speed Lewmar's, were too small. I found a formula that indicates the size winch needed. We removed the #16's and replaced them with two Lewmar #40, bronze, two speed, self-tailing winches. The bronze winch stand was plenty large enough to re-use. Since the diameter of the new winches is larger than the old winches, the holes did not match. I put the new holes between the old holes and that worked just fine.
One extra thing I did was to add a 4x6 backing plate under the deck where the winch stand goes thru the deck, and I used over sized finish washers where the bolts go thru the teak coaming. This gives the winch an incredible solid feel.
Good luck, fair wind, John
Warren Kaplan wrote: After a week long sailing trip out in the ocean, I really fell in love with self tailing winches. My 1980 CD27 still has the original Lewmar 7 winches mounted on bronze stands for the genoa sheets. They work well but I want to go to self tailers especially since I plan to do alot of single handed sailing. Has anyone done this? Can the new winches be fitted to the old stands or do they have to be mounted in a "new" place? Does Lewmar (or anyone else) make a self tailer that will fit "exactly" where the old standard winches were? I'm also thinking of replacing the Lewmar 6 halyard winch on the mast.
Any advise as to whether to go with Lewmar or any other make will be appreciated? Any suggestions in mounting the new winches (so as to avoid disaster) would be GREATLY appreciated.
Thanks
Warren
S/V Sine Qua Non
CD27 #166
sankey@gulftel.com