Pirates eat lead. U.S. Captain freed!

[Amgine]

I hate having to play devil's advocate, but some of the comments here have been somewhat vitriolic.

The first thing I want to point out is there is no evidence anywhere that any hostage of Somali pirates has been killed by their captors. This is important, because it informs the next point:

After considerable provocation, while armed with firearms and in direct communication with the crew, the pirates did not open fire and slaughter the crew who attacked them with simple hand tools.

After agreeing to not continue the fight with the crew, the pirates removed the captain who had surrendered to them as a hostage.

Their hostage, who had surrendered to them, attempted to escape in violation of his word to them.

A member of the pirates, who accepted an invitation for medical treatment for the injuries received from the freighter crew, was not returned to the pirates. (From their point of view, he was captured in violation of the negotiations for his treatment. Yes, I know he didn't want to return according to the US Navy, but that's not what the pirates saw.)

There's more than one point of view in any situation.

My opinion is beside the point. I do wish the navies in the region would hand out AIS transponders and tell every boat that if they do not have a working transponder aboard, they will be sunk without discussion. And act on it. It would be a lot less expensive/dangerous.

[Troy Scott]

I'm wondering what's next. I've heard talk of sending in the troops to attack the pirates' land-based support system. I don't think I want that to happen. Now, I know that that body of water is far too large to be effectively patrolled and controlled. However, there can't be so many ports in Somalia that we couldn't effectively keep a check on them. Would it be possible or reasonable to inspect the traffic in and out of the ports the pirates use? This would be dangerous work, but it should be possible to refuse passage to vessels that don't cooperate. Is this naive? Does anyone else have a suggestion?

[Troy Scott]

Amgine,

I understand your point. Pirates are human beings, and none of us knows what led any of those guys into that life. Maybe a day in their shoes would make any one of us more understanding. BUT..., if pirates boarded my boat and threatened me, I would NOT be remotely inclined to sympathize. I would be very grateful to be rescued, even if it involved putting large holes in some or all of the pirates. Any sadness or remorse for the dead pirates should be tempered by the realization that they would all still be alive if they had been at home tending their gardens instead of terrorizing folks on the high seas.

[Kevin Kaldenbach]

Amgine,

First take a second and count to two hundred. Better yet, take two seconds because two hundred is a lot. That is about the number of people from several different ships being held hostage by pirates. This problem is escalating and needs to be stopped.

You do not think the lives of the crew were in danger, but the mere fact that the pirates are carrying guns and forcing their way onto these ships is an act of violence endangering the lives of the crew. What are the pirates doing to get their millions of dollars in ransom? threatening to tickle the hostages? No, the pirates are threatening the lives of their captives. Therefore it is safe to assume, that since we know we are not going to pay the ransom, the crew will be killed. Thus we need to kill the pirates before they kill the crew.

I can say with a some deal of certainty that if the first few attempts to hijack ships for ransom were met with the resistance found in dealing with the Alabama we would not be discussing piracy today. Instead we find ourselves having to fix a much larger problem. Along with allowing piracy to expand into a thriving industry with hundreds of peoples being held at any one time, we have increased the potential risk to these mariners. Non the less the problem needs to be fixed and piracy as we know it today needs to go away. The only way to do this is might! Not measured responses that are in proportion to the threat from a bunch of thugs in dilapidated boats. No, the response needs to be; if you mess with us we will hit back hard.

When a pirate see a boat with Old Glory flying from its stern he needs to know that if he attempts to take the crew hostage he will never be free again.

Your AIS reasoning shocks me. You say we are wrong for shooting the villains holding the Captain hostage, but it would be fine to kill someone who did not get the memo to pick up an AIS on their way in. Yikes! I better start reading those memos more closely.

[S/V Necessity]

The "pirates" are actually working for someone else. The guys who are, in charge (and receiving the lions share of these ransoms) are safe on land. If we don't deal with them, this will go on forever.

And I also think it's been pointed out by others elsewhere, If these guys had a garden of some sort to tend to, they would probably be doing so. No matter how we chose to deal with the pirates on the sea, those on land will always be able to find more recruits.

[Joe Myerson]

Amgine and Ben are right (assuming you can believe what those evil folks in the media write about it). There's also the question of the surviving hijacker of the Maersk Alabama, who appears to be about 16 years old.

According to the BBC, these sea raiders are sent offshore for days at a time in skiffs filled with weapons, a few bottles of water, some K'at to relieve their hunger pains--and raw fish to eat if they catch any while on patrol. Their elders, and those who help finance them from afar and get a cut of the ransom money, sit on shore.

These pirates used to be coastal fishermen. They lost their livelihood, they have no government to protect them, and they come from a former country where kidnapping seems to be the only way to make a buck.

But that doesn't mean that the rest of the world should let them get away with it. Many career criminals from other countries probably have similar back stories.

Answers? I don't have any. But it's nice to learn that another pirate raid on a US-flagged freighter was repulsed.

--Joe

[Andy Denmark]

At the risk of my comments being branded "vitriolic" let me pose a big picture solution.

Somalia is a large recipient of US foreign aid, much of which ends up in the hands of warlords, etc., who, by the way, have no compassion for their fellow countrymen as they hoard these resources for their own kind. In addition, Aid workers from the USA and the UN are systematically tortured, killed, or otherwise forced out of this country. The UN and other countries have had no better luck in reforming/reeducating/industrializing this place than the USA.

Why don't we simply cease all foreign aid, economic resources and humanitarian assistance to this region until the piracy stops? Let them stew in their own sorry political/economic/health juices until they get their act together by themselves -- or not. It's fruitless to try and save people from themselves at any level. Let them solve their own problems without us enabling them any further. When the warlords see these valuable resources cut off then they can deal with the pirates their own way.

The bucks the USA sends to these people could then be spent (or wasted) on more "stimulus" or bailout programs right here in our own country. Keeping these expenditures in the USA might be easier for US citizens to stomach than pouring good dollars after bad into this bottomless pit.
________
How to roll joints

[Kevin Kaldenbach]

No matter how hungry I get I have no right to your belongings. Nor do I have the right to threaten your life if you are not threatening mine. Nether do my sons. What I do have is a god given right to protect myself. I know that that part of the world is crappy but is not like the United States has not poured a lot of time and money into the area. Maybe some pirates are kids but they are pirates first and they are willing to threaten the lives of others, therefore they are our enemies.

[Amgine]

Heh... See? that's why I hate playing devil's advocate: people assume that if you can see a different point of view, that must be the one you hold.

Yes, I really do think the combined task force should put a complete interdiction on all boating in the region without AIS, and should sink without further provocation any boat which refuses to carry one. It is absolutely a form of group punishment, which seems anathema to most people.

I also think shippers (or their insurers) should be charged for every second of time the various militaries are involved in the region. They are the sole beneficiaries since there is a perfectly reasonable alternative shipping route. Dozens of companies have already shifted. And if there were little or no shipping, there'd be little or no piracy...

I can armchair quarterback with the best of 'em. But, my opinion is about as valuable as any armchair quarterback too. Worthless.

[Kevin Kaldenbach]

If there were not different opinions in this world it would be a boring place. Its great that we can share them.

[Jim Davis]

[img]http://i631.photobucket.com/albums/uu34 ... USNAVY.jpg[/img]

There are two totally different situations. The one on land in Somalia, as bad as it is, is one that the Western World has chosen to ignore. Under Bush, the elder, we tried and under Clinton we pulled out Rightly or wrongly, I'm not going to comment. The UN seems to have the same attitude as does Europe in ignoring it. The same applies to many other trouble spots, Darfor is an example.

The pirates are a criminal element, regardless of their individual motivation and should be taken care of as a criminal situation, not a social issue. Since it is not practical for law enforcement to go in and try to arrest them the Naval solution seems to be the only viable one available. Perhaps letting them fish inshore, but they should not be allowed to venture near shipping. Convoys for shipping, perhaps, sinking unidentified/approved small craft, perhaps. In any case the profit motive must be removed and swift action taken.

[Hud Smith]

With all the countries being affected by the piracy, why not send up a stationary orbit satellite to monitor the area(paid for by a bunch of countries). Add in ship tracker, and you could alert freighters about approaching small craft, identify "mother ships" by the small craft activity, etc.
Anyway, a great job by the crew, navy and SEALs.

[sharkbait]

I haven't heard anything about this but, why don't our ships turn off their AIS systems while in that part of the world?