The fitting at the base of the tiller leaks

43ferry · Post by **43ferry** » Aug 15th, '08, 14:25

Hi,
As the new owner of a Typhoon Weekender can anyone offer suggestions as to removal/repair of the pipe/housing for the rudder shaft to identify the cause/repair of a leak at the base of the housing?

(Not only am I anxious about whether anyone will understand my question but also whether I've used this very intimidating site)!

Don

Judith · Post by **Judith** » Aug 15th, '08, 18:33

I should tell you, I don't have a Typhoon and I can't help with your question--though I'll bet someone will chime in shortly who DOES and CAN. (Come to think of it, you might check the archives: I think Sea Hunt was asking recently about something similar with his new-to-him Typhoon.)

I just wanted to say I've only been sailing a couple years now, and I've found this site informative--and immensely entertaining--but never intimidating.

Ask away. There're a lot of nice folks here, and everybody enjoys sharing what they know.

Cheers,
Judith

Sea Hunt · Post by **Sea Hunt** » Aug 15th, '08, 19:39

Don:

I had what I believed was a leak coming from the tiller base plate and the pipe for the shaft for the rudder. The two forward scuppers were not draining properly and the cockpit was filling with water. Once it got up to the level of the base plate, etc. (about 1" - 1 1/2") it dripped down into the bilge.

Once I solved the scupper issue by replacing and reconfiguring the seacock hoses, I caulked all around the tiller base plate and the rudder shaft pipe with BoatCaulk. Since them, my bilge has been "essentially" bone dry even after sustained heavy rains - my Ty is moored in South Florida. With the constant humidity nothing is ever really dry.

I should note that once I fixed the scupper draining issue I probably did not have to worry about water ingress through the tiller base plate, rudder shaft pipe, etc., because thereafter no water accumulated in the cockpit. However, it was recommended to me by several on this board that these areas be well sealed as well. I did as suggested and am a happy camper.

Before taking on the task of removing the base plate, pipe, etc., I would first try to determine the real source(s) and cause(s) of the leak(s). Is your Ty on a mooring, at a dock or on a trailer

Does the cockpit fill with water after a rain

If so, the correct diagnosis may be something other a leak at the base plate, pipe, etc. These may be the areas where the leak(s) shows up, but the originating cause may be else where.

Having stated all of the above, please note that I am truly a "tadpole sailor" and have very, very little knowledge of sailboat repair and maintenance. There are, however, some real pros on this board that will shortly add their expertise to this issue and you will be well pleased with their suggestions, as I have been over the past many months.

43ferry · Post by **43ferry** » Aug 18th, '08, 17:42

Thanks Tadpole. A thoughtful theory & probable solution I bet. I'll check that out.
Don

43ferry · Post by **43ferry** » Aug 18th, '08, 17:43

Thanks Tadpole. A thoughtful theory & probable solution I bet. I'll check that out.
Don

43ferry · Post by **43ferry** » Sep 11th, '08, 20:04

Just a note to Tadpole (& others?) to bring this up to date. I had concluded that the water in the bilge (about 30 gal. over 48 hours) had come from a heavy rain downpour that leaked into the bilge thru the teak base plate at the tiller. This seemed even more probable when I found the scuppers partly clogged with leaf debris. Cleared the hoses, (tested with a bucket of water on the cockpit floor) & the scuppers handled it quickly.
I then pried loose the teak plate surrounding the tiller tube, scraped the old (& crumbly) caulk off the bottom of the plate, recaulked & put back in the 4 screws.
Problem not solved. Upon return to the boat this morning (3 days later) again found water (it tasted salty, about 10 gallons) in the bilge. The cockpit floor was dry. We did have rain again, but not nearly as much. Working hypothesis: The water is coming from the Atlantic & the leak is below waterline. I don't think the water is entering from under the base of the tiller plate. The teak plate was nice & dry.
What's next, tilt the tiller forward & waterproof grease (the bearing?) underneath? Does the Weekender have a "stuffing box." Can I get at what might be the problem while the boat is in the water or should I wait to take the tiller apart when its hauled out? What should I look for if I crawl aft into a quarter berth under the deck?
I know there has been a lot written about similar problems & I've found previous posts helpful, but so MUCH water!

43 Ferry (Don)

sloopjohnl · Post by **sloopjohnl** » Sep 11th, '08, 20:48

check the thru hulls for the scuppers along with the valves and hoses. other than the rudder shaft, those are the only factory-installed holes in the hull.

43ferry · Post by **43ferry** » Sep 13th, '08, 07:57

Well,,,,the fitting at the base of the tiller doesn't leak. As you pointed out Seahunt the tiller plate gets wet when the scuppers don't drain!

Have now isolated the leak. Cracks in the glass lateral to the rusted eyebolt sticking out from the bilge. (This eyebolt is just under the 4" square teak cover over the bilge). My Typhone is a 1976, is the eyebolt (keel bolt?) standard manufacture? There is one crack about an inch & a half long on each side of this bolt & I wiped the bilge dry & then watched as water seeped back in, about an 8th of an inch after 5 or so minutes.

Obviously, water is entering the keel before it emerges from the bilge, right? I did some tapping & knocking on the bottom & sides of the bilge & everything feels hard. Are these small cracks (which let in about 7 gal of water every 24 hrs.) an easy fix or indicative of a much larger problem?

Any comments welcome.

Anxious Don@43 Ferry Rd.

Markst95 · Post by **Markst95** » Sep 13th, '08, 08:11

I'd agree with John, its probably one of the thru hulls. Being an older ty you also might have two thru hulls for the toilet. You probably need to rebed them. The eye is what they used to lower the lead into the keel.

43ferry · Post by **43ferry** » Sep 13th, '08, 08:30

I have checked the thru holes for the scuppers, (& the valves & hoses). All are dry & the scuppers drain the cockpit effectively.
There was once a head but the inside capped pipe is secure & dry also.
But water is seeping into the bilge thru those cracks on either side of the bolt! (Thanks Mark for explaining the origin of the bolt. Now what about the cracks?)
Don@43Ferry Rd

Markst95 · Post by **Markst95** » Sep 13th, '08, 08:39

Unless the hull is leaking I can't see how the fiberglass on top of the keel can cause the leak, could it be running down from somewhere else? My boat doesn't have much fiberglass down there, just some on the sides to hold the keel in place.

43ferry · Post by **43ferry** » Sep 13th, '08, 08:53

I'll look again. There is a thru hole for the old potty but I thought it was dry. Thanks,
Don

43ferry · Post by **43ferry** » Sep 13th, '08, 12:36

No doubt about it, water is seeping in thru the cracks around the eyebolt from under the bilge. Since I've had to bucket out the bilge every day or two for the last 10 days, (about 7 gal/day), can I correctly infer that the thru plug (has a cap on it outside the hull) for the since removed head is a possible candidate for water entering the keel/hull? There is no water entering from where the ball cocks are fitted to the floor & the tubes are dry.

Don

Rollergirl · Post by **Rollergirl** » Sep 13th, '08, 14:17

Did you have a hard grounding recently?
Your boat has a cavity molded in that the lead ballast was lowered into via the ballast lifting ring you see rusting away in your bilge. At some point in the boats history water infiltrated the space between the ballast and the cavity wall and froze, cracking the area around the ring. So you have found the secondary leak.
The primary leak is probably the heal shoe to the rudder or a series of cracks from a hard grounding or improper storage. Neither is too difficult to fix; strip the bottom paint in the affected areas this winter haulout and look for the damage. Most Ty's I have seen have a rough area near the rudder shoe form assorted damage and poor repair.
Lots of info on this board for repair. Good searching.

Bill Bloxham

43ferry · Post by **43ferry** » Sep 14th, '08, 08:15

Thanks Bill,
Your theory makes a lot of sense to me. I'll ck when I haul out in a couple wks.
Don

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