Interesting project CD27

[RIKanaka]

I looked at an intrguing project boat the other day, an '82 CD27 on the hard for the past 3-4 years, with a cabin and cockpit full of rain water for at least the past several months, and possibly for the past 2 years.

The hull, externally, appeared to be in good shape and at least as good at holding water in as it was designed to keep it out. The cabin was submerged to the level of the main salon berths at the time of my viewing. The owner had previously pumped out the cabin which, judging from the internal waterline (new nautical term?), had been up to the level of the deck, but recent heavy rains had filled it again. The deck, at least internally, may well have been partially submerged during the aforementioned indeterminate period but it had no obvious soft spots. Removing the organic and tarp debris from the scuppers in the "cockpit pool" resulted in immediate drainage of the cockpit and pointed to a cause of the cabin flooding.

The Yanmar engine was almost completely submerged when I viewed it and had been completely submerged for at least a few months and may have been subjected to a few freeze/thaw cycles during the past 2 winters. From what I could see through the oil sheen in the cabin it was relatively uncorroded and had about 250 hours of use on it.

Fortunately the sails, spars and rigging had been stored indoors so they were in pretty good shape.

How well encased is the lead ballast within the keel and what would be the likelihood of internal hull damage from a few freeze and thaw cycles?

How likely is the Yanmar to be salvageable? How much would a rebuild or a repower run? I assume the electrical components are shot.

What other concerns should I have about this project?

Depending on the final price and repair work involved this could be a great deal or the worst money pit ever. Either way, I'd hate to see it continue to languish in its present condition. Thanks in advance for any input.

[Wayne Grenier]

Plan on a new motor-and replacing all the mechanical and electrical systems in the boat-and the fuel tanks and all the upholestery-and probably the sails and stays etc.-so add all that up and see if it comes to the value of the boat in restored condition ($15K without any consideration for your time and labor ) and you will probably see you should get this boat for free-nothing detoriates faster than a boat especialy if they are not winterized or stored properly-god help you if you fallen in love with her-of course working on baots is wonderful therapy so you may if you wish deduct the price of treating with a psychologist for the next 5 years from the above calculations-but as a cost effective project-sorry-

[Bob Owens]

As the owner of a 1977 CD which is in very good condition, I would advise that you pass this one by, unless you get it for virtually no cost and have lots of time and tools. You will spend many thousands getting this boat rehabed. I second everything Wayne said.
Bob

[marka]

In my view, it all depends on how much you enjoy the work. The interior of a CD27 is easily removed and if you are an experienced wood worker, easily replaced. I agree the engine and wiring likely require replacement. I bet the boat lived through freeze/thaw cycles just fine (get a surveyor to check). Mold in the headliner may be a real problem that you should probably also consider.

I've often thought about trying to obtain a bare hull or cosmetic disaster such as the one you describe and completely redoing the interior. It would be a great project and in my experience, the majority of the cost is in your labor (except for the new engine).

[MarcMcCarron]

run away fast.

[bill2]

I'd look at it like this - for the labor of a complete cleanup ( gutting of the motor, all wood, electrical, plumbing ) you're getting a bare hull to turn into a "custom" cruiser. You should get the boat as is for $1.

If you think saving her from the scrap heap is a noble cause I'd go for it - being prepared to spend much time - both repairing and at the consignment shop - and some money ( a rebuilt motor and more ).

If you don't have the time and ( can't learn ) the skills you'd be hard pressed to justify the money to have others do the work.

If you do it - there's nothing on the finished boat that will be beyond your experience.

Good Luck

[Duncan Maio]

I'm with the more optimistic of the other posters here - this is a $1 boat, but if you are up for the challenge, it sounds like a noble cause.

Keep us posted on your progress.

[Tod M]

the buyer were interested in an engineless boat (saving a bundle since all the repowering expenses are removed).

[RIKanaka]

...both discouraging and encouraging. The realm of responses pretty much reflects the feelings I've had about this potential endeavor and I'm still on the fence on this one.

Wayne, Bob and Marc- The owners are asking a few thousand for it presently and mainly want it out of their yard. I haven't started negotiating yet as I wanted get an idea of the cost involved to rehab it first. The asking price + cost of moving it closer to home + storage + a new diesel could easily put it into the 5-figure range (assuming $5-6000 for a new diesel) without accounting for the electrical and interior work required, tank replacements, etc. The spars, rigging and sails, as I mentioned, were in serviceable condition. I agree that there would be a lot of labor involved and that it would be good therapy. However, whatever I would save in psychologist bills (I did get a PM from crazywilbur that disputes this opinion), I would probably have to fork over to a marriage counselor.

marka, bill2, Duncan and Tod - I'm pretty decent at woodworking, and I've done some car and outboard engine diagnostics and repairs but no major rebuilding. Although I have some basic household electrical wiring experience, I'd probably contract out that duty. A few of the cabin wall planks above water were warped; the remainder were watermarked. The bulkhead woodwork was delaminating. I didn't get a look into the v-berth but I imagine there is some wood damage there.

The thought of going "engine-less" (or at least "inboard-less") and saving money on the repower did occur to me. I could take one of the outboard motors in my garage (more fodder for the marriage counselor) and hang it off the transom, as blasphemous as that may seem to many, as a temporary measure until I could find an affordable repower solution. And if by some miracle I were to find that the present Yanmar was salvageable/rebuildable that would be a pleasant bonus, although I'm not expecting it to be like one of those British Seagull stories that you always read about ("...they dug it out of 2 feet of sand after 40 years at the bottom of the English Channel, filled the tank with a 2-stroke mix and it started on the first pull...").

How difficult is it to get rid of mold in the headliner? Is the headliner removable/replacable? I imagine the fuel and fresh water tanks would have to be replaced? Is this a difficult job? I'm assuming that the holding tank is still functional; if not I'll just use a porta-potty.

I do enjoy most of this sort of work, provided that the repairs are manageable and eventually successful and that the end point of it all, getting the boat back out on the water where it belongs, is realistically and economically attainable. Allocating spare time to a project like this is always an issue but the thoughts of being out on the water in the end product is a huge motivation.

Thanks again for the input. If I do pull the trigger on this one - and I hope I'm not aiming the gun at my foot - you'll be reading a lot of questions of the "How do I..." nature from me.

[marka]

When i removed and refinished the interior of Linda Jean, I removed the water tank and the holding tank. I had previously removed the fuel tank as well. I see no reason why immersion in filthy water would lead you to conclude you need to replace these tanks. All can be cleaned and disinfected (freshwater tank) to the degree required. It's just a matter of taking a little time and the use of an appropriate cleaning agent.

With respect to the wood work, I imagine all the teak bulkheads would require replacement which is a bit tedious but not terribly difficult. Save everything you remove for a pattern.

I've not got a clue how to address mold in the headliner/hull-liner. I would have to think about that one.

[Bob Owens]

If you have time, you might find it helpful to read a book written a few years back about extensive restoration of a CD 27: London Goes to Sea: Restoring and Sailing an Old Boat on a Budget (Paperback), by Peter J. Baumgartner

[tartansailor]

Mark,
Standard practice in the Airstream travel trailer crowd is when laying up the coach, have a tray of vinegar spaced in each compartment.
It works. Just keep the trays full. If you button up your boat nice and tight, I assure you mold will go away.

Dick

[MarcMcCarron]

It's a good idea to run away from this boat because it's too easy to
find a CD 27-28 in much better shape that this wretch for less money-
(in the long run) . Throwing a outboard on the back may be a very
poor solution. Resale value will be nil; you'll be creating an odd duck!
Project boats seldom are anything but an awful value.

[Ron M.]

It will cost more in the long run to get a boat like this in shape.......even doing the work yourself.......of course it depends on what kind of shape you will settle for. I suggest finding a vessel in REASONABLE condition that you can enjoy and keep up with.
________
Rolls-royce wraith

[Troy Scott]

Bob,

I am speaking as one who is in the middle of a major refit and cosmetic overhaul of a CD36 that was really in pretty good shape to start with. This project is requiring hundreds of hours and lots of money. If you want this CD27 bristol, be prepared to spend many thousands of dollars and many hundreds of hours.

IF YOU WANT TO SAIL, find a boat that's ready to go or needs very little. You can still spend a lot of time and money on "very little".

IF YOU WANT TO DO SHOP WORK, buy this boat for $1, absolutely no more. She has been seriously mistreated by the present owners, and she would be happier all dried out and in your shop. I mean SHOP. Don't even think about doing this unless you have a nice covered or enclosed workspace with plenty of tools.