As I mentioned recently in a previous posting my Cd 27 had an interesting setup for the 14 feet of sanitation hose that went from the pump to the overboard seacock. The 14 feet of hose was comprised of three sections, the first 8 feet was a 1.5" diameter hose coupled down to 3 feet of 1.25" hose then coupled down to 3 feet of 1" hose and finally terminating to a 1" seacock. Do other cd 27's have the same arrangement or is it a jury rig setup as I and the surveyor I had last year suspected.
Thanks,
Ron Ellard
I am curious what size sanitation hose other 27 owners have.
Moderator: bobdugan
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Andy Denmark
- Posts: 630
- Joined: Feb 5th, '05, 11:38
Industry standard
Ron,
The industry standard for waste hose is 1-1/2". It sounds to me like a P.O didn't want to spend the extra $$$ to do this right, thus the reduced sizes along the run. This is nothing but trouble in the long haul. I'd change if this were my boat. Use only the white high-grade hose, though, as the cheaper stuff still allows smell to permeate through.
I got rid of all these sorts of problems on my CD-27 by changing to a Porta-Potti. The ongoing litany of "head-related problems" have since reduced to ZERO. Maybe this is an alternative you'd consider. Sure smells better and maintenance involves only cleaning the exterior of the head with a Lysol wipe. By using the proper additive, dumping the effluent is not at all unpleasant.
Good luck and hope you find a good (sadly, not inexpensive) remedy.
FWIW
________
Marijuana strains
The industry standard for waste hose is 1-1/2". It sounds to me like a P.O didn't want to spend the extra $$$ to do this right, thus the reduced sizes along the run. This is nothing but trouble in the long haul. I'd change if this were my boat. Use only the white high-grade hose, though, as the cheaper stuff still allows smell to permeate through.
I got rid of all these sorts of problems on my CD-27 by changing to a Porta-Potti. The ongoing litany of "head-related problems" have since reduced to ZERO. Maybe this is an alternative you'd consider. Sure smells better and maintenance involves only cleaning the exterior of the head with a Lysol wipe. By using the proper additive, dumping the effluent is not at all unpleasant.
Good luck and hope you find a good (sadly, not inexpensive) remedy.
FWIW
________
Marijuana strains
Last edited by Andy Denmark on Feb 13th, '11, 03:34, edited 1 time in total.
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Duncan Maio
- Posts: 180
- Joined: Feb 5th, '05, 22:01
- Location: Cape Dory 27
Deck Fitting may not be Standard
Ron:
One note to add to Andy's comments:
Some CD's have 1 5/8" hose from the deck cleanout fitting down to the holding tank. The fitting on the tank may be a 1 1/2" barbed hose fitting, and the 1 5/8" hose will snug down on the barbs just fine with a couple of hose clamps - it will seem like a good fit. Getting 1 1/2" hose onto the 1 5/8" bronze deck fitting, however, while lying on your back and reaching through the anchor locker, is beyond the capabilities of most mortal seamen.
I have this arrangement, and have deferred replacing this last segment of hose. The last step will involve removal of the deck fitting and replacing with a new, properly sized one, and probably sealing the exposed core material around the hole (although it is pretty far outboard and no core may be exposed here).
One note to add to Andy's comments:
Some CD's have 1 5/8" hose from the deck cleanout fitting down to the holding tank. The fitting on the tank may be a 1 1/2" barbed hose fitting, and the 1 5/8" hose will snug down on the barbs just fine with a couple of hose clamps - it will seem like a good fit. Getting 1 1/2" hose onto the 1 5/8" bronze deck fitting, however, while lying on your back and reaching through the anchor locker, is beyond the capabilities of most mortal seamen.
I have this arrangement, and have deferred replacing this last segment of hose. The last step will involve removal of the deck fitting and replacing with a new, properly sized one, and probably sealing the exposed core material around the hole (although it is pretty far outboard and no core may be exposed here).
Duncan Maio
s/v Remedy
CD27 #37
Bristol, RI
s/v Remedy
CD27 #37
Bristol, RI
followup
Wow Andy that's extreme, a friend of mine with a Siedleman 37
was thinking of doing the same thing, tearing out his head and using a porta potti. If it was just me it probably wouldn't be a big deal, but for my daughter and wife its another story.
Duncan, guess my posting wasn't clear enough, I meant the sanitation hose going in the other direction from the guzzler diaphagm pump to the seacock. This hose measures 1 1/2" inside diameter off the guzzler pump (model 500) and down to a 1" hose that terminates on the seacock.
What is your setup like to the seacock from the pump?
Ron
was thinking of doing the same thing, tearing out his head and using a porta potti. If it was just me it probably wouldn't be a big deal, but for my daughter and wife its another story.
Duncan, guess my posting wasn't clear enough, I meant the sanitation hose going in the other direction from the guzzler diaphagm pump to the seacock. This hose measures 1 1/2" inside diameter off the guzzler pump (model 500) and down to a 1" hose that terminates on the seacock.
What is your setup like to the seacock from the pump?
Ron
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Duncan Maio
- Posts: 180
- Joined: Feb 5th, '05, 22:01
- Location: Cape Dory 27
Ron:
Your post was plenty clear; I should have pointed out that I was making a different point about another obscurity (in case you were going in that direction too).
In addition to the deck pump-out from the holding tank (an entirely insufficient six gallons or so) we have an arrangement using a Y-valve and one ball valve. The ball valve is normally closed, as is of course the seacock.
With the Y valve in one position, discharge goes to the holding tank. In the other postition, with the seacock open, you get direct overboard discharge via a vented loop (vented to the outside through the hull just below the toe rail). By opening the ball valve and the discharge seacock, the Henderson waste pump can be used to discharge overboard from the tank.
Of course, all except use of the pump-out boat (free from the Bristol Harbormaster) has been forbidden in Rhode Island waters for many years now, so I forget all the details. I'd like to install a larger holding tank, perhaps under the port settee, but I would also like a simpler system.
Your post was plenty clear; I should have pointed out that I was making a different point about another obscurity (in case you were going in that direction too).
In addition to the deck pump-out from the holding tank (an entirely insufficient six gallons or so) we have an arrangement using a Y-valve and one ball valve. The ball valve is normally closed, as is of course the seacock.
With the Y valve in one position, discharge goes to the holding tank. In the other postition, with the seacock open, you get direct overboard discharge via a vented loop (vented to the outside through the hull just below the toe rail). By opening the ball valve and the discharge seacock, the Henderson waste pump can be used to discharge overboard from the tank.
Of course, all except use of the pump-out boat (free from the Bristol Harbormaster) has been forbidden in Rhode Island waters for many years now, so I forget all the details. I'd like to install a larger holding tank, perhaps under the port settee, but I would also like a simpler system.
Duncan Maio
s/v Remedy
CD27 #37
Bristol, RI
s/v Remedy
CD27 #37
Bristol, RI
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Andy Denmark
- Posts: 630
- Joined: Feb 5th, '05, 11:38
Some follow-up
Ron,
Extreme is a bit -- well, extreme!
Actually, after getting over the concept-level aversion to Porta Potties, the distaff side seems to prefer them. The natural disinclination towards P/P's seems to be based in feelings about those blue boxes seen at boat shows, building sites, and other outdoor events. That unpleasant perception goes away quickly when it becomes apparent that you really can't look down into the thing and see what is in there. Further, the admonition in the sign over my old Wilcox-Crittenden head of, "Don't put anything in here that you haven't eaten first," no longer applies. I needn't go into detail.
The thing I've noticed most is the extra space gained by not having a holding tank, a clunky and complicated looking toilet, plumbing that is inevitably exposed (how do you say ugly?), valves, leaks, drips (all odoriferous), and difficulty of use by persons not inclined to mechanical things. If nothing else, this latter point goes to the utter simplicity of the system -- even someone who has only a vague perception of gravity can comfortably understand and use the thing.
There's also a safety issue that's avoided - without those through-hull fittings and associated seacocks the chances of a water breach are further minimized. When I haul Rhiannon out this spring these will be glassed over.
Anyway, I'll get off this soap box and go back to nailing down decking.
________
Charade
Extreme is a bit -- well, extreme!
Actually, after getting over the concept-level aversion to Porta Potties, the distaff side seems to prefer them. The natural disinclination towards P/P's seems to be based in feelings about those blue boxes seen at boat shows, building sites, and other outdoor events. That unpleasant perception goes away quickly when it becomes apparent that you really can't look down into the thing and see what is in there. Further, the admonition in the sign over my old Wilcox-Crittenden head of, "Don't put anything in here that you haven't eaten first," no longer applies. I needn't go into detail.
The thing I've noticed most is the extra space gained by not having a holding tank, a clunky and complicated looking toilet, plumbing that is inevitably exposed (how do you say ugly?), valves, leaks, drips (all odoriferous), and difficulty of use by persons not inclined to mechanical things. If nothing else, this latter point goes to the utter simplicity of the system -- even someone who has only a vague perception of gravity can comfortably understand and use the thing.
There's also a safety issue that's avoided - without those through-hull fittings and associated seacocks the chances of a water breach are further minimized. When I haul Rhiannon out this spring these will be glassed over.
Anyway, I'll get off this soap box and go back to nailing down decking.
________
Charade
Last edited by Andy Denmark on Feb 13th, '11, 03:35, edited 1 time in total.
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The Patriot
- Posts: 380
- Joined: Mar 14th, '05, 09:14
Your setup sounds like the standard arrangement, which works quite well. When my CD28 was being built, I had the factory do something slightly different. The conventional Groco head discharges to a holding tank under the furniture in the forepeak. This tank can be emptied in two different ways. The first is through a standard deck plate discharge hose. In addition the factory added an overboard pumpout from the tank through a Whale Gusher 8 to a 1.5 inch seacock in the hanging locker behind the head.Duncan Maio wrote: ... we have an arrangement using a Y-valve and one ball valve. The ball valve is normally closed, as is of course the seacock. With the Y valve in one position, discharge goes to the holding tank. In the other postition, with the seacock open, you get direct overboard discharge via a vented loop ...
Obviously the idea is that under all circumstances, whether in harbor or offshore, the tank takes the discharge. Whenever it's legal, the tank can be pumped offshore.
This makes swimming a much more pleasant experience.
Porta Potti's in the Keys
Just a thought - heads have been on my mind lately since I've finally decided that I need to replace head and all the old hoses this winter. There are a number of places, Boot Key Harbor the current example, where having a vessel that you sleep in, or is capable of such, must have head with holding tank, and a porta-potti is not acceptable! Think that it has to do with the concept of not being able to cable tie valve, etc.
Kittiwake has made another trip down from Annapolis to Key West, then back to Marathon for the season. The trip down was early, we took advantage of Andy's hospitality to take Capt Larry's 6 pack course, and will start my second career in the next couple of days.
Peace and Fair Winds
Kittiwake has made another trip down from Annapolis to Key West, then back to Marathon for the season. The trip down was early, we took advantage of Andy's hospitality to take Capt Larry's 6 pack course, and will start my second career in the next couple of days.
Peace and Fair Winds
Bill Watson
holding tank size
Hey Duncan,
I had a 15 gallon tank under the port side bunk, I have been looking at this site for a replacement
http://www.raritaneng.com/
There appears to be a couple of arrangements of prefab sizes anywhere from 14 to a 20 gallon that can fit under the bunk of a 27.
Ron
I had a 15 gallon tank under the port side bunk, I have been looking at this site for a replacement
http://www.raritaneng.com/
There appears to be a couple of arrangements of prefab sizes anywhere from 14 to a 20 gallon that can fit under the bunk of a 27.
Ron